Russell: " I hope it’s not my last game (in Seattle)"

[tarlhawk]

As a professional player/entertainer I really don't see Russell having options to explore...unless he wants to "retire" ...stay out of the NFL for a year...and then decide to "un-retire" and join a team. Is he willing to take the DeShaun Watson approach and "sit on the bench" for a year or two? Can he face his team mates with such a stance? He has an O-Line that allowed him to recover from a very serious injury and helped Penny end the season on a very high note. Russell has an assortment of "weapons at his disposal" to attain the personal goals he seeks. He has a city that still loves him...although he is allowing the media to tarnish his image and suspect his character/motives.

What "teams" out there have the talent/draft picks to even tempt our team's release of the key to returning to our winning ways? The Saints and Giants have salary cap issues that can't be easily resolved to where they could afford RW and his contract...his baseball agent would insist on a renegotiated contract for his "client" (his agents true motivation in "leaking" any news of RW's discomfort). Until Russell is brave enough to make a statement on his own or hold a press conference then this off-season will remain the circus show that the media seems to favor.

Our management and TEAM has allowed him to build up a future Hall of Fame resume...is this a path he really wants to commit to? Can the NFL ownership afford QB's to break large capital contracts and not risk a trickle down effect with QB's drafted by teams suffering losing seasons...only to have those QB's demand a trade off of their losing team...Trevor Lawrence? Should a "struggle" between players and management be encouraged? Look up what John Elway did to the Baltimore Colts who drafted him...allowing the Denver Broncos to fleece the Colts at that time.

[RiverDog]

I heard a saying once . Better check how big your parachute is before you jump out of the plane . Whose really out there that’s sure fire better ? But it clearly goes for a qb like Russel too. Who is going to be an upgrade ?

The decision may have come down to the final weeks and the teams improved play . Had they lost out after the bears game It may have been a different conversation.

So doesn’t this mean they clearly side with PC ? I think Russell’s future is very much in play . It was 18 months ago they erupted in a coaches meeting to ask for more input on game planning . Unless it’s all patched over I can’t see how Russel wants 2 more years of it .

There's not going to be a QB out there that is "sure fire better" than Russell. If we do trade him, we can expect to be back to the TJack/Clipboard Jesus level of the QB store. We'd probably end up with a place card holder for a year or two.

[tarlhawk]

We'd probably end up with a place card holder for a year or two.

Now who is the optomist? By not having a QB as a first round pick...let alone a second round selection...will "lightening strike twice"? ...allowing us to "discover" a generational QB like RW (3rd RD pick)...or Tom Brady (6th rd pick)? You have 20+ teams competing for such "treasure" in this current NFL climate. Without an above average QB...let alone an elite QB...your drafted play makers on both sides of the Off/Def sides would have no incentive to seek a contract beyond their rookie contract.

[RiverDog]

We'd probably end up with a place card holder for a year or two.

Now who is the optomist? By not having a QB as a first round pick...let alone a second round selection...will "lightening strike twice"? ...allowing us to "discover" a generational QB like RW (3rd RD pick)...or Tom Brady (6th rd pick)? You have 20+ teams competing for such "treasure" in this current NFL climate. Without an above average QB...let alone an elite QB...your drafted play makers on both sides of the Off/Def sides would have no incentive to seek a contract beyond their rookie contract.

I'm not exactly sure what is optimistic or pessimistic about my comment. I'm simply stating a fact as I've always seen it. If we trade Russell, then we're in for a major rebuild.

My position regarding Russell is unchanged from what it's been for nearly a year since these rumors first started: If Russell wants to stay, I'll welcome him back with open arms. If he wants out, I'm all for trading him for the best possible deal.

[NorthHawk]

Look at the teams still searching for a Franchise QB and look at the teams at the top of the divisions.
That's all you need to know about the importance of finding and keeping a great QB. There are occasionally
some exceptions like Dilfer and maybe Tannehill but by and large the teams with the best QBs win out.

What's better a good HC or a good QB? Clearly it's easier to find a good HC than a good QB. Our own history
shows us that we've had 3 or 4 very good HC's but only 1 Franchise QB. And at any one time in the NFL there
are a half dozen or more teams looking to upgrade their QB.

So if we lose Russell, expect to be wandering the desert looking for a savior for the next decade or more unless Lady Luck smiles upon us.

[Hawktawk]

Ryan Tannehill has home field advantage . Hass described him as “ winning boring “ in the context of discussing Russels idiotic sack vs the bears . I can look at the season and think of plenty of losses this year that ultimately came down to lack of offense in crunch time. One was the Titans who have played over 70 players this year and lost their bell cow back for most of the season . I’d love Russ to be happy , play like he used to and hang around . Where I disagree is that the last 9 winning years were all about Russ . Or that we need to spend 10 years in the wilderness without him
. We went to 49 and some could debate 48 in spite of Russ but because our defense was lock down . If we have something in the middle qbs wise and run the ball and play defense we can win a lot of games without Russ not to mention he was 6-8 as a starter this year. Is he going to start improving at 34 .

[NorthHawk]

We’ve never seen Russ in a dynamic Offense. We saw a glimpse of it earlier this year and some the last few games
after we were eliminated from playoff contention, when he played very well, but the majority of his career has
been playing under a static Pete Ball Offense with very little creativity. He’s shown in the past that he’s capable
of carrying a team to wins, and there’s no reason to think he can’t continue to do so.

[tarlhawk]

I'm not exactly sure what is optimistic or pessimistic about my comment. I'm simply stating a fact as I've always seen it. If we trade Russell, then we're in for a major rebuild.

I implied optimism because you said we'd only have a couple years of having a QB "place card holder". Here's the current projected FA QB beginning in 2022.

Tyrod Taylor QB 33
Jameis Winston QB 28
Cam Newton QB 33
Jacoby Brissett QB 30

[tarlhawk]

We went to 49 and some could debate 48 in spite of Russ but because our defense was lock down . If we have something in the middle qbs wise and run the ball and play defense we can win a lot of games without Russ not to mention he was 6-8 as a starter this year. Is he going to start improving at 34 .

He doesn't need to start "improving" ...he showed in our promising season ending that whatever was "keeping him down...confidence/injury" he got over it and played like a winner again. The QB type you mention as middle QB wise is often referred to as a "game manager" which Russell quickly shrugged aside that label as he soon set passing/winning records for the start of a career. If stuck with a "game manager" you need a sustained stellar defense and even then your chance of winning close games becomes far from automatic.

Finding a lasting winning coach in this era isn't as easy as some suppose. A winning head coach is not only appreciated by a team's fan base...but trusted by team ownership. Many unwanted headaches for upper management can be the result of a bad choice of coach.

[tarlhawk]

[quote="NorthHawk"
What's better a good HC or a good QB? [/quote]


The simple answer is why choose...both are desired and both are currently our team's blessing.

[RiverDog]

I'm not exactly sure what is optimistic or pessimistic about my comment. I'm simply stating a fact as I've always seen it. If we trade Russell, then we're in for a major rebuild.

I implied optimism because you said we'd only have a couple years of having a QB "place card holder". Here's the current projected FA QB beginning in 2022.

Tyrod Taylor QB 33
Jameis Winston QB 28
Cam Newton QB 33
Jacoby Brissett QB 30

We both know that list is going to grow. Besides, free agency is just one way to acquire players. There's also the draft and trades. If we were to trade Russell, we'd end up with a lot of capital for him. It wouldn't necessarily have to mean the end of the world.

I'm not advocating that we trade Russell, but if he wants out either now or in two years at the end of his contract, then I'd be in favor of trading him now vs. not getting anything at all for him or forcing a disgruntled player to stay via a very expensive FT.

[RiverDog]

What's better a good HC or a good QB?

The simple answer is why choose...both are desired and both are currently our team's blessing.

So if Russell does come out and demand a trade, if you were Pete, how would you respond? "Screw you, Russell! Get with the program! If you don't like it, tough chit, I'm the coach and you're the player!" Or something to that effect?

[tarlhawk]

Tyrod Taylor QB 33
Jameis Winston QB 28
Cam Newton QB 33
Jacoby Brissett QB 30

If we were to trade Russell, we'd end up with a lot of capital for him. It wouldn't necessarily have to mean the end of the world.

You're not looking at it from the business side of the GM's decision. In cap management there's a financial burden called dead money that a team is stuck with when "letting a player go via trade/release" with contract years remaining. Do you think the team wanting to trade for Russell is going to freely give us draft choices...absorb a renegotiated "elite QB contract"...and pay our "dead money". Trading a QB "before his time" is very tricky...just look at the negotiations that shipped Goff to Detroit and brought Matt Stafford to the Rams...both QB are highly paid which made it possible to keep money owed in balance for both teams.

[tarlhawk]

So if Russell does come out and demand a trade, if you were Pete, how would you respond? "Screw you, Russell! Get with the program! If you don't like it, tough chit, I'm the coach and you're the player!" Or something to that effect?

No but you would remind him that what he is asking/demanding is not in the best interests of the team financially/morally. Pete could point out that a balanced team rushing/passing makes it easier for him to excel in Waldron's offense.

[Hawktawk]

Brock and Salk were discussing a report regarding GMs around the league and their perception of Wilson . I don’t recall the reporters name but it was a big one . He said clubs aren’t as high on Wilson as he or JS thinks they are .

Again maybe just a waste of ink but I speculated on it earlier in the year when he was playing dreadful. If he doesn’t move it might be because nobody’s giving a kings ransom for a guy with some baggage and some question marks .or perhaps they are trying to suppress the market . We shall see.

[NorthHawk]

Brock and Salk were discussing a report regarding GMs around the league and their perception of Wilson . I don’t recall the reporters name but it was a big one . He said clubs aren’t as high on Wilson as he or JS thinks they are .

Again maybe just a waste of ink but I speculated on it earlier in the year when he was playing dreadful. If he doesn’t move it might be because nobody’s giving a kings ransom for a guy with some baggage and some question marks .or perhaps they are trying to suppress the market . We shall see.

A new regime on a team who wants to make a splash would pay quite a bit for him.
He's won a SB, is a multiple Pro Bowler, has a ridiculous number of comeback wins, and has carried the team on multiple occasions over the years.
That resume will be a huge lure for a team that is still looking for that missing piece at QB to take them to the SB or to fire up a fan base on teams
that have struggled at the QB position.

[obiken]

Hey look, I love TCS, and others that advocate shipping out Russ, but they are WRONG on Russ. Russ has looked around the league and seen how Mahomey has Reid, JG has Shanahan, Dak has Moore, Herbert has Staley, and Stafford has Mckvay, Just to name a few. It's an Offensive league, sorry management has made the bed for us and we are stuck with PC and JS, and we didnt even get a vote.

[Hawktawk]

” Is he going to start improving at 34 .”?

He doesn't need to start "improving" ...he showed in our promising season ending that whatever was "keeping him down...confidence/injury" he got over it and played like a winner again. The QB type you mention as middle QB wise is often referred to as a "game manager" which Russell quickly shrugged aside that label as he soon set passing/winning records for the start of a career. If stuck with a "game manager" you need a sustained stellar defense and even then your chance of winning close games becomes far from automatic.

Finding a lasting winning coach in this era isn't as easy as some suppose. A winning head coach is not only appreciated by a team's fan base...but trusted by team ownership. Many unwanted headaches for upper management can be the result of a bad choice of coach.

Unless I missed something Russ spotted AZ 14 points in a 38 -30 win . That means our defense gave up 16 points and the back went for 190 .

Russ was way better once Penney got rolling but still figured out how to lose to the bears with Penny going off for 135 and changing field position all night with chunk runs . Lots of people worry about whether Penney’s resurgence is real . We could ask the same of Russ . He’s making 35 million to be a clutch difference maker . Tell me his last clutch RW signature walk off win ? There were half a dozen chances late in games this year . Is his league worst 3rd down completion % an abberation or is this who he is now ? These are big questions . Anyone completing less than 50% on 3rd down needs to improve I don’t care who they are .

[tarlhawk]

Wow...some of you guys create your own drama. "Poor" Russell was provided with a team and management that supports him and makes it possible for him to create long standing records so quickly that his Hall of Fame resume is almost complete. Somehow a defense minded coach blundered into trusting you when others would have doubted.

Teams needing a QB passed your name being selected in the draft at least twice...but our GM believed in you and drafted you. Our team's "fans" pity you for having a defensive minded coach whose team "blundered" into a Super Bowl and DESTROYED a heavy offense minded Denver Broncos. "Blundered" into a second Super Bowl the very next year failing at the last possible moment in time. How terrible we kept winning year after year despite our "out of touch" head coach and his GM keeping us back from another SB (they grow on trees...don't you know?).

Are we blessed to have an elite QB to rack up many winning seasons? Or is Russel just as blessed having a TEAM that supported his efforts...ensuring his efforts and preparation were not in vain? This is a TEAM sport in spite of the many individuals within our TEAM that you choose to elevate or slay depending on your "mood".

[tarlhawk]

Unless I missed something Russ spotted AZ 14 points in a 38 -30 win . That means our defense gave up 16 points and the back went for 190 .
Russ was way better once Penney got rolling but still figured out how to lose to the bears with Penny going off for 135 and changing field position all night with chunk runs . Lots of people worry about whether Penney’s resurgence is real . We could ask the same of Russ . He’s making 35 million to be a clutch difference maker . Tell me his last clutch RW signature walk off win ? There were half a dozen chances late in games this year . Is his league worst 3rd down completion % an abberation or is this who he is now ? These are big questions . Anyone completing less than 50% on 3rd down needs to improve I don’t care who they are .

Go on with your infatuation with taking hits on RW when he suffers a down season...you really end up painting yourself in a bad manner that I don't think you deserve. Your defense of Penny at the expense of Russell really rings shallow/hollow...both have turned it around when the "empire was burning" and both are victors. The "stats" you insist on...mean nothing when they don't represent a NORMAL season under NORMAL circumstances. You say you like relying on what you SEE as an observer...yet you observe but fail to acknowledge RW being restored to the QB who is fun to watch...his confidence is transferred to his team mates efforts...true leaders inspire...how can you not "see" this?

Russell and Penny are part of the reason to have hope for our TEAM moving forward to 2022...think TEAM and not lauding/down playing individuals...perspective is everything.

[Hawktawk]

If pointing out the man turned it over 2 times leading to strip 6 and ball on AZ 1 puts me in a bad light so be it . Penney has nothing to do with it other then point out those who say Penney’s fools gold but think Russels decline over a year was a blip, the lack of clutch game winners nobody wants to talk about and recent resurgence is certainly the real deal.

You’re a brilliant analyst as are many on the forum . I’m a gut instinct and eyeball test analyst. Russ looked smooth the last 3 games for the most part and threw 9 TDs in those 3 weeks after being dreadful vs the Rams . But as I say he lost the bears game . He didn’t miss too many but every one was on third down or 4th down or in the end zone . Then the ridiculous sack . And he took no accountability , disagreed with PC . He did it 3 or 4 times publicly post game last season .

I’m comfortable saying Russ entered 2021 as my biggest question mark after his dreadful
Performance in the WC and then whining about getting hit too much.

I still feel the same way . If Russ was Russ this year in the close games we are 11-6 at least or better . I don’t let the emotion of winning and a weekly highlight reel for 9 years cloud my judgement . It’s kind of important to be right about the next few years of this guys career . If he declines we have 35 million in a declining QB who isn’t worth as much in trade as has been reported by some GMs already . Even if he’s as good as new nobody thinks he wants an extension . If he’s good and I think Penney as the feature back I don’t care beyond the next couple years . If he goes out and can’t move the chains like much of the last season and a half it does not matter who is coaching D.

[tarlhawk]

It’s kind of important to be right about the next few years of this guys career . If he declines we have 35 million in a declining QB who isn’t worth as much in trade as has been reported by some GMs already . Even if he’s as good as new nobody thinks he wants an extension . If he’s good and I think Penney as the feature back I don’t care beyond the next couple years . If he goes out and can’t move the chains like much of the last season and a half it does not matter who is coaching D.

He's under contract now and is very important to our future going forward. Russell is key to any optimism for 2022 so the off season following 2022 will determine if Russ and the team are equally happy with each other so RW's extension can be quickly completed and not become a distraction. Certain free agents will also be watching then to influence their desire to come here...or not.

Our GM is definitely going to have his work cut out for him this year...with so many contracts up. J.Adams contract occupied much of his time when some of these extensions could have been handled earlier. The draft (even without a 1rst rd pick) seems promising based on where we will be selecting for each round. We also lack a 6th rd pick but have an extra 4th rd pick...so still promising. Who we are able to re-sign once free agency starts in the new league year will shape many of our draft choices.