Hawks Cards

[Hawktawk]

Which team shows up? Last weeks or the week before or what? Is it a team that was flat, injured, unlucky, not the sum of their parts? Or a bottom feeder with a bare bones roster of talent in need of being blown up?

or are they something in the middle?

Vegas has us as a 6 point dog which I find surprising. We have players with their luggage and golf clubs already loaded in the back of the BMW and they have a chance at the division. I saw the injury report and it seemed kind of long including Wags. Nobody knows what's going to happen in Seattle so its really a job interview for everyone not under contract next year and some who are.

Cant pick my boys to fail. I'm going with 34-26 Hawks in what may be a swan song for a lot of people or perhaps convince ownership to run it back out next year.

[RiverDog]

The Cards don't have that much to play for. There's no chance for them to get HFA and a first round bye and the worst they can finish is with their current #5 seed. They are a full game behind the Rams so they need them to beat the Niners and all that would do would be to guarantee them a home game. There's a good chance that they'll rest some of their key players.

That's one of the problems with the current playoff seeding system. Eliminating a bye seed takes away some of the motivation for teams to play hard in the last week of the season.

[NorthHawk]

The Cards don't have that much to play for. There's no chance for them to get HFA and a first round bye and the worst they can finish is with their current #5 seed. They are a full game behind the Rams so they need them to beat the Niners and all that would do would be to guarantee them a home game. There's a good chance that they'll rest some of their key players.

That's one of the problems with the current playoff seeding system. Eliminating a bye seed takes away some of the motivation for teams to play hard in the last week of the season.

Yah, probably right but players do play for pride and they always play to win because to get to the NFL a player has to be ultra competitive and hate to lose.
The Cards team is deeper than ours and we may be looking at some of our backups to see what they can do so it could even out.

Regarding the loss of the extra Bye, the NFL only responds to money so if there is a significant dropoff in revenue be it media sponsors or gambling, it might
wake them up and nudge them to add that back in.

[RiverDog]

The Cards don't have that much to play for. There's no chance for them to get HFA and a first round bye and the worst they can finish is with their current #5 seed. They are a full game behind the Rams so they need them to beat the Niners and all that would do would be to guarantee them a home game. There's a good chance that they'll rest some of their key players.

That's one of the problems with the current playoff seeding system. Eliminating a bye seed takes away some of the motivation for teams to play hard in the last week of the season.

Yah, probably right but players do play for pride and they always play to win because to get to the NFL a player has to be ultra competitive and hate to lose.
The Cards team is deeper than ours and we may be looking at some of our backups to see what they can do so it could even out.

Regarding the loss of the extra Bye, the NFL only responds to money so if there is a significant dropoff in revenue be it media sponsors or gambling, it might
wake them up and nudge them to add that back in.

Which is why we can't derive very much out of this game one way or another. The Cards players themselves may hold back that little something extra, but we'll never know. The uncertainty will exist no matter what we see on the field. It's a glorified exhibition game.

I'll be watching, but not with a very close eye. There's more games than usual on in the afternoon time slot, nearly all of which have playoff implications.

[Hawktawk]

A home game is worth fighting for . And teams have been resting starters in the final games for decades if their playoff seeding has been settled . If Seattle goes out and plays well and wins against a team with top ten plus ratings for every unit spare me the “ it’s a bad team BFD “ nonsense . It’s the nfl . As Holmgren said after escaping Cleveland 9-6 in one of hasslebacks first start “ to win in this league is hard . “

[Agent 86]

A home game is worth fighting for . And teams have been resting starters in the final games for decades if their playoff seeding has been settled . If Seattle goes out and plays well and wins against a team with top ten plus ratings for every unit spare me the “ it’s a bad team BFD “ nonsense . It’s the nfl . As Holmgren said after escaping Cleveland 9-6 in one of hasslebacks first start “ to win in this league is hard . “

Interesting that the Cards are 8-1 on the road this year, and only 3-4 at home. I agree a home game is worth fighting for, but maybe the Cards aren't as worried as some teams would be about that this year.

[RiverDog]

A home game is worth fighting for . And teams have been resting starters in the final games for decades if their playoff seeding has been settled . If Seattle goes out and plays well and wins against a team with top ten plus ratings for every unit spare me the “ it’s a bad team BFD “ nonsense . It’s the nfl . As Holmgren said after escaping Cleveland 9-6 in one of hasslebacks first start “ to win in this league is hard . “

Yeah, that's the company line, for sure. No one's going to come out and say that they aren't giving 110% as if they go one and done in the playoffs in the following week, they'll be dead meat in the press and with their fans for resting starters.

But resting starters isn't the only thing that changes in these meaningless games. Teams aren't going to expose their playbook in a garbage game. Blitzes aren't called with the same frequency. for fear of exposing tendencies. RB's are often times placed on a 'pitch count'. Teams have a legitimate desire to get their backups some reps in case they're needed in the playoffs. The game is being played under a different set of conditions.

I'm not sure if you've ever been to a Cards game in Glendale, but trust me, they have one of the most passive fan bases in the league and are frequently outnumbered by the opposing team's fans. It's not like having to go into Green Bay and win. No one knows that better than the Cards' players and coaches.

[RiverDog]

A home game is worth fighting for . And teams have been resting starters in the final games for decades if their playoff seeding has been settled . If Seattle goes out and plays well and wins against a team with top ten plus ratings for every unit spare me the “ it’s a bad team BFD “ nonsense . It’s the nfl . As Holmgren said after escaping Cleveland 9-6 in one of hasslebacks first start “ to win in this league is hard . “

Interesting that the Cards are 8-1 on the road this year, and only 3-4 at home. I agree a home game is worth fighting for, but maybe the Cards aren't as worried as some teams would be about that this year.

Which speaks to the same point I was making with Hawktalk. I've been to 3 Hawks-Cards game in Glendale, and the crowd was at least 50% Seahawk fans, sometimes more. The Packers and Cowboys take it over at an even higher percentage. It's no surprise that we've played relatively well there over the years. They've even named their ticket sales program "Protect the Nest", selling ticket packages to multiple games rather than single games opposing team's fans buy.

[Hawktawk]

I have heard that about AZ at home . Whatever . Their swoon has mirrored the play of their short dynamic franchise QB much like their opponent . They were more effective with McCoy than Murrays first few back . They have something to play for . I will be watching for clues to where the team really is along with the Seahawks brass .

[RiverDog]

17-10 Hawks at the half. I haven't been paying real close attention to the game, just what they show on the Red Zone. It looks like the defense is putting up a pretty good effort, holding the Cards to just 89 yards offense in the first half. Russell's numbers look average although he does have a couple of TD passes and no INT's. 3rd down efficiency looks lots better, converting 6 out of 8. Penny looks like he's heading for another 100+ yard game.

[Hawktawk]

Russ a second brutal turnover after the fumble 6 to start the game . Defense gives it up to start the second half then a pick returned to our 1.. bad Russ today

[RiverDog]

Yeah, that was a bad interception, almost a pick 6, overthrowing Homer on a relatively short route and running to his right.

[trents]

Okay, let's give credit where credit is due. Russ had a couple of turnovers but:

1. The Hawks played hard and won against a very good team at home who had incentive to win because of playoff placement whereas the Hawks were only playing for pride.
2. Penny had a monster game again. Big, fast and shifty. If he can stay healthy and if we are willing to sign him again he will give us what we have missed since Lynch left. We have had enough data I believe to conclude he is the real deal.
3. We won despite missing Wags and playing with a depleted secondary. Brooks had a monster game (at least 19 tackles) and Cody Barton filled in capably for Wags. Barton is a good piece.
4. The young fill-ins in the secondary played big time. That bodes well considering the bad injury to Diggs toward the end of the game.

An impressive win with some young players demonstrating great talent and potential. I feel much better about the talent level on our team than I did a couple of games ago and there could be a bright future. There is still a need for improving the O line, IMO, but they looked good today.

The Hawks looked like the old Hawks we remember from 6-7 years ago. There was spirit and swagger and enthusiasm today which I have not seen in years. It was almost as if a cloud had been lifted. Perhaps they needed a game where there was nothing at stake in order to play loose and aggressively, like we used to see them play. We saw the old Seahawk soul today. It was a game that left a good taste in my mouth after a bitter season.

[Aseahawkfan]

Geez. Even I gotta say Penny lost his mind. I don't know where he found this reserve, but I hope it isn't fool's gold. Pretty crazy turnaround.

[RiverDog]

Okay, let's give credit where credit is due. Russ had a couple of turnovers but:

1. The Hawks played hard and won against a very good team at home who had incentive to win because of playoff placement whereas the Hawks were only playing for pride.
2. Penny had a monster game again. Big, fast and shifty. If he can stay healthy and if we are willing to sign him again he will give us what we have missed since Lynch left. We have had enough data I believe to conclude he is the real deal.
3. We won despite missing Wags and playing with a depleted secondary. Brooks had a monster game (at least 19 tackles) and Cody Barton filled in capably for Wags. Barton is a good piece.
4. The young fill-ins in the secondary played big time. That bodes well considering the bad injury to Diggs toward the end of the game.

An impressive win with some young players demonstrating great talent and potential. I feel much better about the talent level on our team than I did a couple of games ago and there could be a bright future. There is still a need for improving the O line, IMO, but they looked good today.

The Hawks looked like the old Hawks we remember from 6-7 years ago. There was spirit and swagger and enthusiasm today which I have not seen in years. It was almost as if a cloud had been lifted. Perhaps they needed a game where there was nothing at stake in order to play loose and aggressively, like we used to see them play. We saw the old Seahawk soul today. It was a game that left a good taste in my mouth after a bitter season.

Russ had more than just a couple of turnovers. He didn't look sharp, completing under 60% of his passes. But we did do a lot better on 3rd down, which has been a huge weakness this season. Nevertheless, the Cards still had the ball for over 10 minutes longer than we did, and that's going to need to change going forward.

Disagree about the Cards incentive. The difference between them losing was between the 4th and 5th seeds. But to be honest, I can't say that it affected their play.

I don't suffer from amnesia as you apparently do. This season was an abortion, and the past 12 months has been a nightmare. Today did little to rid myself of that puke taste in my mouth. I'm glad this season is over and once the playoffs end, I'll turn my attention to outdoor activities and college basketball. We'll see what happens this coming week, if we're hitting the reset button or standing pat. If I had to bet on it, I'd lay my money on standing pat.

[Aseahawkfan]

Russ had more than just a couple of turnovers. He didn't look sharp, completing under 60% of his passes. But we did do a lot better on 3rd down, which has been a huge weakness this season. Nevertheless, the Cards still had the ball for over 10 minutes longer than we did, and that's going to need to change going forward.

Disagree about the Cards incentive. The difference between them losing was between the 4th and 5th seeds. But to be honest, I can't say that it affected their play.

I don't suffer from amnesia as you apparently do. This season was an abortion, and the past 12 months has been a nightmare. Today did little to rid myself of that puke taste in my mouth. I'm glad this season is over and once the playoffs end, I'll turn my attention to outdoor activities and college basketball. We'll see what happens this coming week, if we're hitting the reset button or standing pat. If I had to bet on it, I'd lay my money on standing pat.

I tuned out a while back only keeping track here and there and after the game.

I'm a defense guy. This defensive roster is terrible. A shadow of what it once was. Your defense isn't great until you have a D-line that can control the LoS. Even with a great secondary, until you have guys who can hold their own on the line, you don't have much of a defense. Pete and John have let this Defensive line fall into the gutter, not to mention the CBs are a rotating line of guys I barely know.

Until I see some real work to bring this defense back to form, I don't expect a great deal of improvement with a defensive coach as the HC.

[NorthHawk]

Seattle played pretty well yesterday. I think that's their peak though and the Cards haven't played really well since the mid season mark.
They look to me like a 1 and done playoff team, unless they really get it together before their game.

Our DL isn't consistent. It's in part why both Wagner and Brooks ended up with more than 170 tackles. 340 to 350 tackles per year by 2 LBs is way too much and probably shows that the opposing
teams were successful running the ball through the DL enough so to make it worth their while to do it often.

[Hawktawk]

I'm a defense guy. This defensive roster is terrible. A shadow of what it once was. Your defense isn't great until you have a D-line that can control the LoS. Even with a great secondary, until you have guys who can hold their own on the line, you don't have much of a defense. Pete and John have let this Defensive line fall into the gutter, not to mention the CBs are a rotating line of guys I barely know.

Until I see some real work to bring this defense back to form, I don't expect a great deal of improvement with a defensive coach as the HC.

The defense basically gave up 16 points to an 11-4 team and knocked the crap out of former MVP front runner Murray . That's with half the defense hurt. The QB dug us a huge hole of 14 points. If its on the D for not stopping a 1 yard drive I dont know what to say. I thought every defensive unit was decent to good yesterday.

But with a back like Penney changing field position it didn't really matter. Penney getting going really helps Russ too. 7 TD passes last 2 weeks and a rush TD. We need tweaks on both sides of the ball but I'm no longer in favor of tearing it down.

[RiverDog]

Seattle played pretty well yesterday. I think that's their peak though and the Cards haven't played really well since the mid season mark.
They look to me like a 1 and done playoff team, unless they really get it together before their game.

Our DL isn't consistent. It's in part why both Wagner and Brooks ended up with more than 170 tackles. 340 to 350 tackles per year by 2 LBs is way too much and probably shows that the opposing
teams were successful running the ball through the DL enough so to make it worth their while to do it often.

The Cards peaked early. They've gone 4-6 after starting the season 7-0, losing badly to sub .500 teams like the Lions and Panthers. IMO the Rams will beat them by at least two scores.

The major reason why Wags and Brooks got so many tackles is because we had the league's worst TOP by over a minute more than the next worst team, which is a function of both the offense as well as the defense. But I do agree that our DL is inconsistent.

I would like to think that we're just a player or two from being competitive, that yesterday was an encouraging sight to see. But we've been through this routine too many times in the past few years for me to believe in this fool's gold. It's like a thirsty cowboy plodding through the desert and seeing a shimmering lake just a few yards ahead.

[NorthHawk]

Penny being as productive as he has been and the turnaround on Offense shows us how important a good run game is to Pete's style of Offense.
That they would pass by some exceptional RB's and not address that is in part why we did poorly this past year and why we have been stuck in
NFL Limbo since Marshawn left.

[NorthHawk]

The major reason why Wags and Brooks got so many tackles is because we had the league's worst TOP by over a minute more than the next worst team, which is a function of both the offense as well as the defense. But I do agree that our DL is inconsistent.

I would counter that by stating that the ToP imbalance is because teams could successfully run on us and grind out a 1st down - and that's in a large part due to the DL.

[trents]

I didn't see any evidence yesterday of Russ' finger causing his throws to be off target. Maybe it's finally healed. It seems evident to me that Russ has lost some foot speed. He just gets caught more often than he used to when fleeing the pocket or on keepers. Having said that, his runs did seem to have more determination behind them yesterday and he was more decisive when he ran. Making up your mind quickly about tucking and running typically gives much better results than waiting until the defenders are almost on top of you.

[NorthHawk]

I didn't see any evidence yesterday of Russ' finger causing his throws to be off target. Maybe it's finally healed. It seems evident to me that Russ has lost some foot speed. He just gets caught more often than he used to when fleeing the pocket or on keepers. Having said that, his runs did seem to have more determination behind them yesterday and he was more decisive when he ran. Making up your mind quickly about tucking and running typically gives much better results than waiting until the defenders are almost on top of you.

I tend to think it's not speed as much as it is he's waiting longer before deciding to run. In his early years he would take off much quicker and possibly too soon and over the years he's learned to wait
for plays to develop or give them more of a chance before running.
At least that's my take on it.

[tarlhawk]

I would counter that by stating that the ToP imbalance is because teams could successfully run on us and grind out a 1st down - and that's in a large part due to the DL.

Our Defense ranked 2nd in the NFL with opponents rush avg (3.8 yds/attempt) and our total rushing yards allowed we ranked 17th (even with a very uneven Time of Possession.

[RiverDog]

The major reason why Wags and Brooks got so many tackles is because we had the league's worst TOP by over a minute more than the next worst team, which is a function of both the offense as well as the defense. But I do agree that our DL is inconsistent.

I would counter that by stating that the ToP imbalance is because teams could successfully run on us and grind out a 1st down - and that's in a large part due to the DL.

Yup. So is Russell's 3rd down completion percentage, too, which is one of the worst in the league for starting QB's. Overall, we're ranked 23rd on 3rd down, or bottom third, and we're dead last on 4th down.

[NorthHawk]

Well, it's not good along the LoS on either side.
But I think most of us know that. Pete? I'm not so sure.

[Hawktawk]

I didn't see any evidence yesterday of Russ' finger causing his throws to be off target. Maybe it's finally healed. It seems evident to me that Russ has lost some foot speed. He just gets caught more often than he used to when fleeing the pocket or on keepers. Having said that, his runs did seem to have more determination behind them yesterday and he was more decisive when he ran. Making up your mind quickly about tucking and running typically gives much better results than waiting until the defenders are almost on top of you.

I’ll disagree just a little about Russels finger . It doesn’t hurt anymore because he’s high fiving the team again . Clearly for the first few games back he couldn’t grip the ball leading to un russ like wild misses . And every game since there are a few . The wild overthrow of Homer was the main example . He overthrew Lockett even worse on 4 th down vs the bears . So maybe this is who Russ is now . A bit less accurate and not quite as quick although he did house one yesterday .

The strip sack was just terrible play , terrible awareness and the announcer reamed him for it . It’s a 3 step drop . Put your foot in the ground and fire to an NFL open receiver or throw it away .

It’s always been part of the equation with Russ as he is always trying to make a play but it seems to be getting worse . Listening to PCs post game comments he was speaking directly to Russell “ when we are balanced and running the ball and wining at the LOS and not giving it to the other team we don’t need to throw for 400 yards “. His interview with Salk today he doubled down on that theme while saying Russ had a blast last night , Russ doesn’t care he just wants to win . He said he doesn’t expect Russ to go anywhere “ he’s our quarterback “

[trents]

I also want to high 5 to the Hawks's defense in this game. Five sacks and most of them were coverage sacks. Mighty mouse got loose a few times but he didn't run wild like he usually does against us. We kept him under control about as good as you can expect.

[Hawktawk]

I also want to high 5 to the Hawks's defense in this game. Five sacks and most of them were coverage sacks. Mighty mouse got loose a few times but he didn't run wild like he usually does against us. We kept him under control about as good as you can expect.

As injuries have piled up the Seahawks have demonstrated excellent depth . The D was great yesterday . It’s the most dominant 2 game stretch I recall in quite a while .