Bears Game

[RiverDog]

As we discussed earlier, the weather is likely to play a significant role in how this game is played. Forecast is for a major snow storm (major according to Seattle standards, that is) with a significant breeze coming out of the north.

The Hawks got Tyler Lockett, Bryan Mone, and Alex Collins back off the Covid list earlier this week but put CB Bless Austion on it. He was listed as questionable with a shoulder injury anyway. We'll also be missing tight end Will Dissly, defensive tackle Bryan Mone and right tackle Brandon Shell, cornerback DJ Reed, as well as practice squad players Ryan Izzo and Mike Jackson, all on the Covid list. Tre Brown is out with an injury, meaning that we'll be without our top 3 cornerbacks.

The Bears have 8 players on the Covid list: DT Akiem Hicks, TE Jesper Horsted, DB Tashaun Gipson, DB Jaylon Johnson, TE Jesse James, LB Joel Iyiegbuniwe, WR Allen Robinson II, and RB Ryan Nall.

I'm not sure who to give the advantage to. Normally I'd say that with as many CB's out as we have that the Bears might have an advantage, but if the weather dictates more running, then maybe not.

I didn't realize it until a few moments ago, but the Bears have a top 5 defense.

[curmudgeon]

Bears. Good D, Wilson struggles in weather…..

[Hawktawk]

I don’t know if the field will be covered but if it snows enough it will be lots of straight ahead plays . It’s always advantage offense on a slick field. They know where they are going and the D has to react . Drew Bledsoe in the apple cup comes to mind as does slim shady McCoy going off for almost 200 in at least 6 inches of snow . Who knows . I know if you are in pain the colder it gets the worse . So Russels grip on the ball will be interesting. I truly hope he can finish strong , especially if it winds up being the last roundup . Our D has played well and I anticipate they will again . We are the #5 scoring d but way too long of drives . Possessions will be a premium and turnover will critical . I don’t bet against us especially with Lock back . I like us 24-13. But that’s entertainment value only . I wouldn’t bet a nickel

[RiverDog]

I don’t know if the field will be covered but if it snows enough it will be lots of straight ahead plays . It’s always advantage offense on a slick field. They know where they are going and the D has to react . Drew Bledsoe in the apple cup comes to mind as does slim shady McCoy going off for almost 200 in at least 6 inches of snow . Who knows . I know if you are in pain the colder it gets the worse . So Russels grip on the ball will be interesting. I truly hope he can finish strong , especially if it winds up being the last roundup . Our D has played well and I anticipate they will again . We are the #5 scoring d but way too long of drives . Possessions will be a premium and turnover will critical . I don’t bet against us especially with Lock back . I like us 24-13. But that’s entertainment value only . I wouldn’t bet a nickel

It's a little hard to tell with these cameras, but a live shot of the Port of Seattle adjacent to the stadium shows the area with a pretty good covering of snow:

https://www.nwseaportalliance.com/cargo ... turn-times

[RiverDog]

Sounds like they've already had 2-5" last night with another couple inches to fall by 3pm:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/sn ... d=msedgntp

[Hawktawk]

I’ve heard tapering off by kickoff. Not a fun day either way

[c_hawkbob]

This was just loaded to FB:

[RiverDog]

I’ve heard tapering off by kickoff. Not a fun day either way

The storm warning lasts till 3pm so the 2nd half is likely to be a little better.

[RiverDog]

Nothing but a hitch and go, probably not a bad idea with the footing the way it is. Not sure why the CB was playing Metcalf so tight with no help behind him. Nice pass by Russell.

[Stream Hawk]

Happy holidays! “Best” our defense has looked all year. Still want to blow it up, but I like some of our pieces as building blocks.
On D. Darrell Taylor, R Green, Diggs, Sidney Jones, Tre Brown, Brooks
Offense. Lockett, Lewis, Everett, Penny?
Edit: also keep Dunlap!

[RiverDog]

Happy holidays! Beat our defense has looked all year. Still want to blow it up, but I like some of our pieces as building blocks.
On D. Darrell Taylor, R Green, Diggs, Sidney Jones, Tre Brown, Brooks

Offense. Lockett, Lewis, Everett, Penny?

Penny is at the end of his rookie contract. We declined his 5th year option, so it's doubtful that he'll return.

[Stream Hawk]

True Penny could be, or likely is gone. I would just rather keep him on a flier than Carson atp.

[Hawktawk]

Penney looks great . A rare combination . I’d make an effort to retain him but general managers aren’t blind . If he stays healthy he is truly a game changing back

[curmudgeon]

ENOUGH. Clean. The. Entire. House.

[Stream Hawk]

Blow it up. Now.

Fire Pete on-site!

[RiverDog]

Yup. It's time.

[Hawktawk]

Fugly. Fubar . It’s been a fun ride but it’s as embarrassed as I’ve been as a fan in a long time

[Aseahawkfan]

Even when the offense performs, we lose.

[trents]

Hawks didn't play all 60 minutes.

I saw evidence I believe on several of his throws that Russ' finger is not 100% but the weather conditions may have had something to do with it.

River, I think it was you but someone in another thread was leery of this game because Foles was starting and "He's a wily veteran." It was vintage Foles in the fourth quarter, the guy who took the Eagles to a SB win. It was not vintage Russell Wilson. It was the shadow of vintage Wilson that was out there today. There was a day when he would have pulled that one out. No more.

Jason Meyers has cost us a couple of games this year.

[RiverDog]

Even when the offense performs, we lose.

The offense had a chance to win that game. We had a first and ten at the Bears 30 yard line with 4 minutes left. 5 more yards and we're kicking a FG that gives us a 2 score lead with 3 minutes left and drain the Bears of timeouts, but we shoot ourselves in the foot with penalties, then we do a similar move on the last drive when Everitt jumped. It was a team loss.

[RiverDog]

Hawks didn't play all 60 minutes.

I saw evidence I believe on several of his throws that Russ' finger is not 100% but the weather conditions may have had something to do with it.

River, I think it was you but someone in another thread was leery of this game because Foles was starting and "He's a wily veteran." It was vintage Foles in the fourth quarter, the guy who took the Eagles to a SB win. It was not vintage Russell Wilson. It was the shadow of vintage Wilson that was out there today. There was a day when he would have pulled that one out. No more.

Jason Meyers has cost us a couple of games this year.

That was Hawktalk, and his premonition was right on the mark. Foles outplayed our QB.

Agreed about Russell. He looked bad, made a poor decision to run for a first down on a play that would have ended the game had he not gotten bailed out by a penalty, then makes an errant throw to an open receiver.

Chalk up another bad weather sub par performance for Russ.

The missed FG was at 47 yards in poor conditions, so I can't blame Meyers too much, but you're right, he's cost us this year.

[Hawktawk]

The missed FG came after Russ took another 10 yard sack on 3rd down . It’s good from 10 less yards and Meyer sucks but Jesus you can’t take a sack there and Russ is a 10 year vet.

[TriCitySam]

Even when the offense performs, we lose.

RW did not play well. 181 yards and terrible to take a sack at the end. I don't agree with those that want to blow it up, to me that's just fan talk. If you want to have another 3+ losing seasons, that's the way to go. But I think there will be some changes in how we do thinks both in admin and with our personnel.

[RiverDog]

Even when the offense performs, we lose.

RW did not play well. 181 yards and terrible to take a sack at the end. I don't agree with those that want to blow it up, to me that's just fan talk. If you want to have another 3+ losing seasons, that's the way to go. But I think there will be some changes in how we do thinks both in admin and with our personnel.

If we could attribute Russell's play to his injured finger, then it would be so bad as once it heals, he'll be his old self. But I'm becoming increasingly concerned with his decision making. He had zero chance of making that first down on 4th down with the game on the line on the last series. I realize that I wasn't on the field and that I had the benefit of the superimposed first down line, but I can't believe that was his best option.

[NorthHawk]

He modified his list this year to include the Giants and the Eagles so it seems he just wants out.

[trents]

It's more than his finger. We know that because we saw this pattern of ineffective play beginning in the last half of the season last year.

Here's my analysis. Lack of a running game can no longer be blamed for the offense's problems and the unfavorable time of possession differential. The last three games have seen the running game do well. The improvement in the running game suggests the O Line has picked up its game, at least to a degree. I no longer think the O line is our biggest issue. I think we see that when you have a talented back to hand off to like Penny, the O line begins to look better. We also see the defense playing well the last several games and limiting the scoring by other teams. Despite gaining 170 yards on the ground we still lost the time of possession battle in the game against the Bears today.

That basically leaves the performance of the QB, Russ Wilson, as the main culprit for losing games like the one today. He has lost his elusiveness and escapeability. He gets caught much more often than he used to when he leaves the pocket. Also, his throws under pressure are regularly missing the target which is a huge change from three years ago. I think he has lost enough foot speed that he just doesn't get away like he used to and this is also affecting his decision making. I think he doesn't know who he is anymore as an athlete. He is no longer a play maker.

[NorthHawk]

Yardage wise the run game has improved, but has it really?
Can we grind out a series on the ground that takes up 6 or 7 minutes?
We see some chunk plays - and they are happening more often but in between
them we still get bogged down and we are still behind in time of possession.
So the run game is better but it still needs a lot of work.

[Aseahawkfan]

We used to win tight games like this. This is what it looks like when all the tight games go the other way.

[trents]

Yardage wise the run game has improved, but has it really?
Can we grind out a series on the ground that takes up 6 or 7 minutes?
We see some chunk plays - and they are happening more often but in between
them we still get bogged down and we are still behind in time of possession.
So the run game is better but it still needs a lot of work.

You make a good point. But just as instrumental in the time of possession problem is the fact that Russ was missing a lot of dink and dunks that ended drives.

[Hawktawk]

Yardage wise the run game has improved, but has it really?
Can we grind out a series on the ground that takes up 6 or 7 minutes?
We see some chunk plays - and they are happening more often but in between
them we still get bogged down and we are still behind in time of possession.
So the run game is better but it still needs a lot of work.

This isn’t the run game . We rushed for probably a buck 50 plus with huge ypc. AnY decent qb in the league would have ridden that performance to an easy win. We were shut out 4th quarter . We lost to a coach 3 weeks from being shown the door .We had passed for 26 yards in the second half with 1 minute left in the game before a little garbage time yardage which used to be Dangerruss time but is now garbage time .

Russell is shot , a broken player , whatever else may be said of this pitiful team. We better hope the finger is still injured because if it’s not it’s damaged . His accuracy got worse as the game went on .

[Aseahawkfan]

This isn’t the run game . We rushed for probably a buck 50 plus with huge ypc. AnY decent qb in the league would have ridden that performance to an easy win. We were shut out 4th quarter . We lost to a coach 3 weeks from being shown the door .We had passed for 26 yards in the second half with 1 minute left in the game before a little garbage time yardage which used to be Dangerruss time but is now garbage time .

Russell is shot , a broken player , whatever else may be said of this pitiful team. We better hope the finger is still injured because if it’s not it’s damaged . His accuracy got worse as the game went on .

The weather was terrible. He threw for 2 TDs and was highly efficient. We ran the ball well. The close games are going against us now.

You are really hopping on the Russ is done train way too early.

[RiverDog]

This isn’t the run game . We rushed for probably a buck 50 plus with huge ypc. AnY decent qb in the league would have ridden that performance to an easy win. We were shut out 4th quarter . We lost to a coach 3 weeks from being shown the door .We had passed for 26 yards in the second half with 1 minute left in the game before a little garbage time yardage which used to be Dangerruss time but is now garbage time .

Russell is shot , a broken player , whatever else may be said of this pitiful team. We better hope the finger is still injured because if it’s not it’s damaged . His accuracy got worse as the game went on .

The weather was terrible. He threw for 2 TDs and was highly efficient. We ran the ball well. The close games are going against us now.

You are really hopping on the Russ is done train way too early.

Yes, the weather was bad, but it was worst in the first half and improved as the game went on. Our problems were in the 2nd half when we were 0-3 on 3rd down and 0-1 on 4th. Our longest drive in the 2nd half lasted just 5 plays. The Bears, on the other hand, had 2nd half drives of 5, 10, 13, 5, and 6 plays. That's where TOP got so lopsided and where the game was lost.

We can't blame the weather for our performance. Foles and the Bears' offense played on the same field and under the same conditions as we did and it didn't seem to affect them very much.

I'm not as down on Russell as Hawktalk is, but there's a lot of very good reasons for him to feel the way he does. Russell hasn't played consistently well for some time now, seems to have lost his focus, and is the primary reason why those close games no longer go our way. If he wants a trade, I say let's take the best possible deal and tell him thanks for the memories.

[Hawktawk]

Foles was sacked at least 4 times and hit many more and outplayed Russ badly in crunch time. 35 million dollar QBs aren't there to keep it close with a 4-10 now 5-10 team. He stunk it up second half. His completion % was 59 for the game. Foles threw for almost 100’more yards than Russ . His stat line kind of betrays his play on the field. Hes gone from being the most clutch QB in the league to one of the least with the worst completion % in the league on 3rd down as we saw. It is over. Trade him asap while there's a market.

[NorthHawk]

Code: Select all

This isn’t the run game . We rushed for probably a buck 50 plus with huge ypc. AnY decent qb in the league would have ridden that performance to an easy win. We were shut out 4th quarter . We lost to a coach 3 weeks from being shown the door .We had passed for 26 yards in the second half with 1 minute left in the game before a little garbage time yardage which used to be Dangerruss time but is now garbage time .

If we had a good run game, we could have ground down the clock in the 4th Quarter, but other than some chunk plays the run game couldn't get it done.
The numbers were very good, but the consistency wasn't. And that's been the problem with our run game. We haven't been consistent since Lynch left
and the OL was exposed to be what we have seen since. We showed some encouraging signs, but when it counted we couldn't get it done. And that's
the bottom line.

[Hawktawk]

Listening to Mike Salk on 710 ESPN in Seattle . He’s put the game squarely on Russ . He also played some tape of PC and then Russ regarding the 14 yard sack . PC said flat out “ you can’t take a sack there. “ Russ said roughly “ I had been moving well all day and so Tyler and I have had so much success in the scramble drill I was just trying to run around and see if he could get away . The risk reward when we’re in field goal range is worth it and we were still within field goal range “. This isn’t a direct quote but very close . It’s like him coming off the dreadful games vs the Rams saying he was feeling great. , throwing the ball great . We were 0-5 on our last 5 third down attempts . Most were flat out misses by Russ as was the 4th . And this play isn’t particularly recent either . His self image or at least what he portrays is delusional. If you all want to sign up for more if this have at it . I want to find our Josh Allen, Joe Burroughs , hell Davis Mills is tearing it up. As great as Russ has been he isn’t anymore . It’s not going to improve imo .

[TriCitySam]

If we could attribute Russell's play to his injured finger, then it would be so bad as once it heals, he'll be his old self. But I'm becoming increasingly concerned with his decision making. He had zero chance of making that first down on 4th down with the game on the line on the last series. I realize that I wasn't on the field and that I had the benefit of the superimposed first down line, but I can't believe that was his best option.

He continues to miss seeing open guys - which I guess all QB's do sometimes - but still misses what would seem to be easy connections (again to DK).

It's easy to throw mud, but think about this: During his career Russ has had his best games playing street ball. Thru 3 different OC's, except for a few games here and there, we have yet to see an offense that has been really effective. Maybe one year our passing attack was in the top ten, but mostly in the bottom third. I know folks think it's cause Pete wants to run the ball, but we were 16th this year in R/P ratio; 19th in '20; 22nd in '17; 17th in '16. We were in the top 5 in '15, '18 and '19, but always around 4th or 5th. So there have mostly been a lot of teams that run more than we do, but we certainly didn't have explosive passing games in those years. And yeah, our OL has not been very good....but maybe, RW is just not that good at running an offensive system. It's street ball or die.....so you can change OC's again, even bring in a whole new coaching staff, but I'm not sure it will change. RW does what he does.

[trents]

Russ has never been a good game manager IMO. Historically, he has been wonderful at improvisation and also at throwing the deep, home run ball. He (and the team) have never been good at screens and short flares, the kinds of passes that augment a power running game so as to sustain long drives that gives their own defense a blow and tires out the opposing defense. The concerning thing to me is that Russ seems to have lost some agility and quickness such that his improvisation isn't working anymore.

[Hawktawk]

Russ has never been a good game manager IMO. Historically, he has been wonderful at improvisation and also at throwing the deep, home run ball. He (and the team) have never been good at screens and short flares, the kinds of passes that augment a power running game so as to sustain long drives that gives their own defense a blow and tires out the opposing defense. The concerning thing to me is that Russ seems to have lost some agility and quickness such that his improvisation isn't working anymore.

Yeah this right here^^^^^I agree with you and TCS. Russ has always been sandlot player, perfectly capable as pocket player but his dynamic plays have always been some of the biggest of his career. Hes definitely slower , I think a lot slower recently but like a lot of us his brain doesn't realize it yet. I believe Russ ran 4.5 at the combine and also very quick and elusive. Now that its going away hes got to change how he plays and if he cant hes gonna be done as a starter sooner than anyone thinks. I heard Mark Schlereth discussing shorter QBs. He started out with Mayfield and said hes short with a powerful arm but he is slow and short slow QBs are not successful. "taller guys last longer"He mentioned RW and Brees as guys who have made it work but when the discussion came to Russ he said that he thinks a change of scenery is needed. And Russ has never come close to Brees as a game manager.

[trents]

A 4.5 in the 40 is certainly not elite speed but is good enough if coupled with superior pocket instincts and field vision, which Russ has always had. But as that "good enough" speed has deteriorated those other attributes are no longer enough to get him out of trouble. He used to do a great job of keeping his eyes down the field when scrambling and this allowed him to find open receivers before the defense closed in on him. Now, what I think I see is he is so concerned about escaping the pursuit that he is not spotting open receivers which means he keeps the ball even longer.

Yeah, he's going to have to reinvent himself if he is to experience success again and one thing that will mean is learning to getting rid of the ball when there are no open receivers in order to avoid sack losses. He still throws a great deep ball and still has a strong arm.

[RiverDog]

A 4.5 in the 40 is certainly not elite speed but is good enough if coupled with superior pocket instincts and field vision, which Russ has always had. But as that "good enough" speed has deteriorated those other attributes are no longer enough to get him out of trouble. He used to do a great job of keeping his eyes down the field when scrambling and this allowed him to find open receivers before the defense closed in on him. Now, what I think I see is he is so concerned about escaping the pursuit that he is not spotting open receivers which means he keeps the ball even longer.

Yeah, he's going to have to reinvent himself if he is to experience success again and one thing that will mean is learning to getting rid of the ball when there are no open receivers in order to avoid sack losses. He still throws a great deep ball and still has a strong arm.

I agree with this take. I've said all along that as Russell ages, that his game is going to have to mature with him, that he's not going to be able to rely on his Houdini escapes and elusiveness that made him the most exciting, dynamic player in the league like he was when he first started out. There are times when he's under pressure that I think that he senses that he's not going to be able to escape and elude like he used to, starts to get happy feet and makes poor decisions. I also think that he's got a little bit of a chip on his shoulder, that he wants to play hero ball and win games on 40-50 yard bombs, holding onto the ball and looking for downfield receivers rather than taking what the defense gives him and move the sticks.