Thursday must win...

[mykc14]

If we want the division. Pathetic game today, worst I’ve seen RW play. Thursday feels like one of those games. Win and the ship is headed back in the right direction with 4 of 5 final games very winnable, lose and you are in a he hole in the division. I’m not going to be all doom and gloom until after Thursday if we lose.

[RiverDog]

You don't play "must win" games in Week 11 when you're tied for first. There's lots of football to be played.

But considering our plight and that it's a divisional game, it does carry some special importance, so I get your drift.

[mykc14]

You don't play "must win" games in Week 11 when you're tied for first. There's lots of football to be played.

But considering our plight and that it's a divisional game, it does carry some special importance, so I get your drift.

I tend to agree with this, and I there is a hint of hyperbole in my post but I do think if we want to really feel good about a possible SB run we need to win this game. Yes, if we lose we can still end of 12-4, but we would essentially be 2 games behind the Cardinals for the division. Neither one of us has a difficult schedule after this game. The Cards play the Rams twice and we play them once besides that the rest of both of our games are against teams with losing records. Win this game and we have every chance of righting this ship and making a serious run. Lose this game and we have a huge uphill fight and another early playoff exit.

[Aseahawkfan]

Winning is always nice.

But the realist in me sees a Seahawks team that isn't a real contender. Terrible defense that might be worst we've had for passing at least. Russell has fallen off a cliff for the MVP race. Our RBs lack the durability to maintain a run game. Too many holes in this team. I'm sorry to say it, but Ken Norton should not have a job after this season as a DC. This defense doesn't just lack talent, it's also poorly coached.

[RiverDog]

You don't play "must win" games in Week 11 when you're tied for first. There's lots of football to be played.

But considering our plight and that it's a divisional game, it does carry some special importance, so I get your drift.

I tend to agree with this, and I there is a hint of hyperbole in my post but I do think if we want to really feel good about a possible SB run we need to win this game. Yes, if we lose we can still end of 12-4, but we would essentially be 2 games behind the Cardinals for the division. Neither one of us has a difficult schedule after this game. The Cards play the Rams twice and we play them once besides that the rest of both of our games are against teams with losing records. Win this game and we have every chance of righting this ship and making a serious run. Lose this game and we have a huge uphill fight and another early playoff exit.

You're talking about the regular season and playoff seeding. This is a whacky year, with no or marginal crowds in the stadiums so HFA doesn't have near the value that it has in a normal year. Plus who knows what things will look like with this COVID pandemic exploding. We could see a 16 team playoff. It's a war of attrition.

I don't get too excited about 'must win' games until after Thanksgiving. In my mind, that's when the stretch run begins.

Nevertheless, Thursday does have increased importance. Russell has looked like crap the last few games, and he needs to get back on track.

[mykc14]

Winning is always nice.

But the realist in me sees a Seahawks team that isn't a real contender. Terrible defense that might be worst we've had for passing at least. Russell has fallen off a cliff for the MVP race. Our RBs lack the durability to maintain a run game. Too many holes in this team. I'm sorry to say it, but Ken Norton should not have a job after this season as a DC. This defense doesn't just lack talent, it's also poorly coached.

I think that if we can get healthy, play well, and win against a quality opponent like the Cards we can feel pretty good going forward, although I agree with most of what you said. As far as Norton goes I agree. He hasn't been a good DC in his career and the DC of the worst D in history (at least he worst pass D) probably shouldn't be retained. I would also add that PC and JS need to be held accountable for this mess as well. The defensive failures fall on their feet as much as Norton's, although it will probably be Norton that takes the brunt of the blame at the end of the season. Heck, if the Hawks D looks terrible against he Cards this 10 day mini-bye would be a good time to make a change. Hawks need a different perspective on their D. We'll see if PC realizes it.

[mykc14]

You're talking about the regular season and playoff seeding. This is a whacky year, with no or marginal crowds in the stadiums so HFA doesn't have near the value that it has in a normal year. Plus who knows what things will look like with this COVID pandemic exploding. We could see a 16 team playoff. It's a war of attrition.

I don't get too excited about 'must win' games until after Thanksgiving. In my mind, that's when the stretch run begins.

Nevertheless, Thursday does have increased importance. Russell has looked like crap the last few games, and he needs to get back on track.

I'm not even that concerned about playoff seeding. Yes a high seed is good and I would rather play in Seattle than elsewhere. The #1 seed this year is huge and winning Thursday gives us our last realistic shot at it and having that bye in the first round is huge, but I am thinking more about our ability to beat a playoff caliber team. We haven't done it. If we lose we could still get healthy and put it together I just don't see it happening. I agree about no such thing about a 'must win' game this early, but my post was that this is a 'must win game... if we want to win the division' and I stand by that, but really I'm not that concerned about the division... We could finish 11-5 and not win one game against a playoff team. That doesn't bode well for the playoffs. I do, however agree that there is a lot of football left after Thursday and evening losing the game doesn't officially eliminate us from anything.

[RiverDog]

Winning is always nice.

But the realist in me sees a Seahawks team that isn't a real contender. Terrible defense that might be worst we've had for passing at least. Russell has fallen off a cliff for the MVP race. Our RBs lack the durability to maintain a run game. Too many holes in this team. I'm sorry to say it, but Ken Norton should not have a job after this season as a DC. This defense doesn't just lack talent, it's also poorly coached.

I think that if we can get healthy, play well, and win against a quality opponent like the Cards we can feel pretty good going forward, although I agree with most of what you said. As far as Norton goes I agree. He hasn't been a good DC in his career and the DC of the worst D in history (at least he worst pass D) probably shouldn't be retained. I would also add that PC and JS need to be held accountable for this mess as well. The defensive failures fall on their feet as much as Norton's, although it will probably be Norton that takes the brunt of the blame at the end of the season. Heck, if the Hawks D looks terrible against he Cards this 10 day mini-bye would be a good time to make a change. Hawks need a different perspective on their D. We'll see if PC realizes it.

Not a lot to argue about with either of those two statements. You're preaching to the choir.

[NorthHawk]

The FO didn't do enough in the off season to make the Defense better. They had opportunity after opportunity and did
nothing of note except add players like Irvin and Mayowa, who I love their effort, but aren't dominating Dlinemen.
Offensively they need to add a tough and durable RB as injuries have hit this team hard at RB the last 3 years.

[RiverDog]

I'm not even that concerned about playoff seeding. Yes a high seed is good and I would rather play in Seattle than elsewhere. The #1 seed this year is huge and winning Thursday gives us our last realistic shot at it and having that bye in the first round is huge...

Our last realistic shot? No one is running away with the race for HFA/first round bye.

Losing Thursday would put us into a situation where we don't control our own destiny, but looking at our remaining schedule, it wouldn't be unrealistic for us to run the table and finish 12-4 which would almost certainly guarantee us at least a first round bye.

...but I am thinking more about our ability to beat a playoff caliber team. We haven't done it. If we lose we could still get healthy and put it together I just don't see it happening. I agree about no such thing about a 'must win' game this early, but my post was that this is a 'must win game... if we want to win the division' and I stand by that, but really I'm not that concerned about the division... We could finish 11-5 and not win one game against a playoff team. That doesn't bode well for the playoffs. I do, however agree that there is a lot of football left after Thursday and evening losing the game doesn't officially eliminate us from anything.

We beat the Dolphins and they're currently 6-3 and looking very much like a playoff team, but but your point is valid. We do not have the look of a playoff team, at least not yet. There are some silver linings from yesterday as our defense did show some potential, so I'm going to remain hopeful. But the trend does need to change.

[obiken]

We will not beat the Cards either, so we are looking at a WC at best.

[RiverDog]

We will not beat the Cards either, so we are looking at a WC at best.

You sound awfully sure of yourself, my friend. Russell had one of his worst games vs. the Cards yet we still nearly beat them. In my opinion, it's a 50/50 proposition.

[NorthHawk]

Wow! RD, the forum optimist!
I didn't think I'd ever see the day.
2020 has been such a weird year.

[RiverDog]

Wow! RD, the forum optimist! I didn't think I'd ever see the day. 2020 has been such a weird year.

Yeah, no kidding!

But on the other hand, think of how bad things are if giving us a 50% chance of winning classifies one as an optimist.

[mykc14]

Our last realistic shot? No one is running away with the race for HFA/first round bye.

Losing Thursday would put us into a situation where we don't control our own destiny, but looking at our remaining schedule, it wouldn't be unrealistic for us to run the table and finish 12-4 which would almost certainly guarantee us at least a first round bye.



We beat the Dolphins and they're currently 6-3 and looking very much like a playoff team, but but your point is valid. We do not have the look of a playoff team, at least not yet. There are some silver linings from yesterday as our defense did show some potential, so I'm going to remain hopeful. But the trend does need to change.

I do think it is our last realistic shot. Only one team gets a first round bye this year and falling to 6-4 puts us in too big of a hole to crawl out of for the #1 overall seed, not that home field advantage is huge this year with COVID crowds but that bye is huge. Plus it is a tall order to ask this team to win 3 games in a row against playoff teams.

[obiken]

You sound awfully sure of yourself, my friend. Russell had one of his worst games vs. the Cards yet we still nearly beat them. In my opinion, it's a 50/50 proposition.

Without Carson, come on, their defense is just blitzing or fake blitzing us to the max. Okay that are not the Rams but how do we get it done?

[mykc14]

I'm going to remain hopeful. But the trend does need to change.

Me too, which was one of the original intentions of this thread. I think everything is still in play for this team if we win Thursday. I actually think, that if we get Pocic, Carson, and Griffen back and Adams isn't out we have a good chance of winning on Thursday. I do admit those are alot of 'ifs.'

[RiverDog]

I do think it is our last realistic shot. Only one team gets a first round bye this year and falling to 6-4 puts us in too big of a hole to crawl out of for the #1 overall seed, not that home field advantage is huge this year with COVID crowds but that bye is huge. Plus it is a tall order to ask this team to win 3 games in a row against playoff teams.

Yea, I forgot about the league expanding the playoffs to 14. I was thinking that you were referring to the COVID alternative that would include 16 playoff teams. My bad. Nevertheless, although I haven't done any research, my guess is that 12-4 is good enough for HFA in at least 1 out of every 3 or 4 seasons, which makes it realistic IMO.

I generally don't start worrying about playoff seeding until after the Thanksgiving weekend games. There's too much that can happen. Indeed, last season, a lot of us were counting on the fact that we had the easiest December schedule of all the playoff contenders, and we ended up losing 3 of our last 4.

I agree about the home field advantage aspect, and the prospects of this team winning 3 consecutive playoff games, at least the team we saw yesterday. But we don't know what this team will look like come January.

[TriCitySam]

We will not beat the Cards either, so we are looking at a WC at best.

Yeah, if it ended today, we'd get the last WC NFC playoff spot. Lose Thursday and we're tied with Chicago - although they have to deal with GB on Sunday.

[mykc14]

I just read an article stating that we are the most injured team in the NFL (tied with the niners...). I believe that is based on the amount of guys on the injury report, so take it for what it's worth. Obviously some guys are more important than others, but overall it does show that we at the very least need to get healthy.

[mykc14]

Big win!! Hawks now in a position to do something special still. Can’t slip up against bad team butt if we can go into our home game against that and at 11-3 we should be in position to challenge for that #1 seed!!

[RiverDog]

I just read an article stating that we are the most injured team in the NFL (tied with the niners...). I believe that is based on the amount of guys on the injury report, so take it for what it's worth. Obviously some guys are more important than others, but overall it does show that we at the very least need to get healthy.

Yeah, you have to add some sort of weight to those injury report to make anything out of them. Losing two players, Bosa and Kittle that are arguably the best at their positions, along with their starting quarterback, outweighs all of those we have injured on our roster.

Last night was a huge win. We now have a mini bye to get players like Carson and Pocic back in the lineup and get ourselves ready for a stretch run. A lot has been made about our next 4 opponents' won/loss records, but you have to look at them as 4 straight trap games.

[NorthHawk]

Yes, every game is a possible loss especially if our Defense reverts back to the effort against the Bills.
I think this game had some positives, though with Dunlap and Collier playing pretty well overall along the DL.
I was impressed at how they contained Murray. They took away a lot of his advantage in mobility and also
put pressure on him.

I thought this was going to be a loss - and maybe a big one, but I was pleasantly surprised even if I had
trouble watching the last series of the Cards when they started by moving the ball in chunks before the
Defense finally held. It seemed like a replay of Buffalo and Rams games when those teams looked like
they could move down the field at will.

[RiverDog]

Yes, every game is a possible loss especially if our Defense reverts back to the effort against the Bills.
I think this game had some positives, though with Dunlap and Collier playing pretty well overall along the DL.
I was impressed at how they contained Murray. They took away a lot of his advantage in mobility and also
put pressure on him.

I thought this was going to be a loss - and maybe a big one, but I was pleasantly surprised even if I had
trouble watching the last series of the Cards when they started by moving the ball in chunks before the
Defense finally held. It seemed like a replay of Buffalo and Rams games when those teams looked like
they could move down the field at will.

I agree. I was thinking of starting a thread honoring the heroic job that Ken Norton has done as our DC, but thought better of it.

I'm more optimistic now than I have been at any point in the season as we appear to have become a more balanced team. The last two games have shown a lot of promise defensively and should help to take some of the pressure off Russell and the offense to have to score 30+ points every game.

[Hawktawk]

6 quarters of good defense in a row now including against this super quick whirling dervish Murray. Held the #1 rush offense way down and quieted the Kyler Murray for MVP talk right down.

Dunlap was a score, well worth the wait as the guys we passed on are on IR. Russ was under control, gave a little lesson on how to be a ninja to his understudy. DK WTF man the old bad hands resurfaced or this would have been a blowout. And that doesn't count the pancake "hold" The run game was awesome to see, it totally changes the team.

I feel like I did after the frisco game. This is a team that can house it, bring home the hardware. Of course we know how that worked out the next 2 games . A work of caution from the late great Knox."potential will get you beat"

[RiverDog]

Our run/pass ratio last night was 31 rushes to 28 passes. which is where we need to be. In the Rams loss, we ran the ball just 22 times while throwing it 37 times, or close to a 2:1 pass/run ratio. The Bills game was even worse, with Russell flinging it 41 times while we ran just 17 times, a greater than 2:1 ratio.

[Hawktawk]

Our run/pass ratio last night was 31 rushes to 28 passes. which is where we need to be. In the Rams loss, we ran the ball just 22 times while throwing it 37 times, or close to a 2:1 pass/run ratio. The Bills game was even worse, with Russell flinging it 41 times while we ran just 17 times, a greater than 2:1 ratio.

Hyde was a real improvement with his physicality and quickness and also catching passes and Scarborough looked pretty good on a few runs. If Carson and Penney get back this will be a formidable team. Its no coincidence the D plays better when we are sustaining clock eating drives instead of either scoring in 2 minutes or punting too.