Russell, JJ, Brees, And Others Pushing Back Against NFL

[RiverDog]

Russell sent out a tweet regarding the NFL's plans to open training camp as scheduled:

I am concerned. My wife is pregnant. Training camp is about to start. And there’s still No Clear Plan on Player Health & Family Safety. We want to play football but we also want to protect our loved ones.

Drew Brees was even more frank:

The NFL’s unwillingness to follow the recommendations of their own medical experts will prevent that. If the NFL doesn’t do their part to keep players healthy there is no football in 2020. It’s that simple. Get it done.

JJ Watt posted an expansive list of what the players don't know, including how often players are to be tested, how a positive test will be handled, that an opt-out for players withy at risk family members still hasn't been agreed on, and so on.

This isn't starting out good.

https://www.nbcsports.com/northwest/sea ... g-covid-19

[c_hawkbob]

Family comes first. These players need to do what they need to do for their families, they have my support even if it means not playing until we have a vaccine.

[jshawaii22]

Let me get this straight. About a week ago it was OK for Russell, in Florida, to go work out with multiple people without any protection or testing and then post it on the internet, but now it's a big issue for the players if the NFL can't test them every day or guarantee them they won't get sick because they might infect someone else?

As you can tell from watching the blogs of the NBA, it's the players themselves that are the issue, even if it's only a few of the scrubs so far that are bringing the Ho's in and ordering food, etc against all the rules. The NFL has the same but far larger issue. If the players don't co-operate, it very well may be all over.

[RiverDog]

Let me get this straight. About a week ago it was OK for Russell, in Florida, to go work out with multiple people without any protection or testing and then post it on the internet, but now it's a big issue for the players if the NFL can't test them every day or guarantee them they won't get sick because they might infect someone else?

As you can tell from watching the blogs of the NBA, it's the players themselves that are the issue, even if it's only a few of the scrubs so far that are bringing the Ho's in and ordering food, etc against all the rules. The NFL has the same but far larger issue. If the players don't co-operate, it very well may be all over.

If it were just one or two players expressing concern, then I could understand it. But there's a bunch of them, high profile stars like Aaron Donald, Patrick Mahomes, and many, many others for this not to be a legitimate concern for them. The stuff on JJ Watt's list is pretty bad.

I'm with Cbob on this one. If they can't do it safely and to the satisfaction of the majority of the players, then I'd rather see them cancel the entire season. It's already so screwed up that it won't be anywhere close to the experience we've all come to know and love.

[obiken]

This game gave them everything, and they have given nothing! They need to start sacrificing their lives for this game! Muhaa haaa haaa haa!! Seriously, 76 NFL players already have the CV, come on, I would be shocked IF we had FB not IF we do'n't have it! Its not like Soccer, Hockey, or Baseball where you can protect and distance yourself. The only sports worse for this disease are Basketball, and Boxing.

[RiverDog]

76 NFL players already have the CV, come on, I would be shocked IF we had FB not IF we do'n't have it! Its not like Soccer, Hockey, or Baseball where you can protect and distance yourself. The only sports worse for this disease are Basketball, and Boxing.

Football is a way worse proposition than any other sport simply because of the numbers of people involved. The more people involved, the more likely that someone will have COVID. It requires many times more people to pull off a professional or major college football game in terms of players, coaches, trainers, referees, and other staff members, many of whom are at risk due to age or health conditions. It's simply not enough to say that the players are all young and healthy and at a reduced risk vs. the general public.

There's been several mid major CFB conferences that have canceled their season, including the Ivy League, but no Power 5 conferences have gone that far...yet. The Pac 12 and Big 10 have canceled all non conference games. The Sun Belt, where the virus is raging the worst, ie Texas and Florida, is the heart of college football. They're going to have to make a decision soon whether or not to go ahead with their season. If the colleges cancel or postpone their season, it seems pretty unlikely that the NFL won't at least postpone theirs.

[jshawaii22]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/07/20/nfl-nflpa-agree-to-daily-covid-19-testing/

Looks like step #1 is on the way to being resolved. It was one of the big issues. Maybe the NFL will buy or build their own mobile Covid testing labs.
I saw our state health director show off a system where they test 5 random people at a time, and if the test comes back negative, all 5 are freed up. It's a dramatic improvement in the time and quantity of tests. Hawaii is implementing it at our airports.

In addition, I've seen reports that the teams will need to rent floors of 5 star hotels in each city for months to allow the players to stay, even while at home along with caterers, etc, just like basketball, but spread out into each home team city. No bubbles. It will be on the honor system. (sure it wil)

It was never, in my opinion, that the season would be ended about 'health' before it starts. The players want to play. The NFL has a lot of money to spend on this and will get it done. Same as baseball and basketball, it's going to be all about the $$$$ and if the players co-operate and do the right thing once it's agreed to on paper.

As of yesterday, the teams are asking the players to give a percentage back, if the league has to stop playing. Obviously, the players, once the games start, will expect to be paid the whole year. This is the next big thing. I'll assume it's being negotiated right now.

[Aseahawkfan]

Going to be tough. I know some football players need that check to support their families, while a lot of veterans are financially set so can miss a season. So it will be competing interests based on time in league and financial situation.

And football is as close contact as it gets with lots of heavy breathing, sweat, and spittle. Some of those big uglies on the line are in some of the worst shape and likely most susceptible to the CV.

Might be best to wait for a vaccine. Even then there won't be any assurances.

[jshawaii22]

And negotiations are continuing into the night. NO preseason games now has been agreed to. Cross another issue off the list.

[RiverDog]

And negotiations are continuing into the night. NO preseason games now has been agreed to. Cross another issue off the list.

They've also agreed to daily COVID tests.

[EmeraldBullet]

And negotiations are continuing into the night. NO preseason games now has been agreed to. Cross another issue off the list.

I feel like this could cause an increase in injuries during the season.

[obiken]

I feel like this could cause an increase in injuries during the season.

Yup, nobody talks about that EB.

[RiverDog]

I feel like this could cause an increase in injuries during the season.

Yup, nobody talks about that EB.

Not sure about that. It's not as if players have been sitting around in front of the TV drinking beer and eating pizza. They're going to be in good physical shape. The main purpose of preseason games is personnel evaluation. Where we're likely to see a difference is in the quality of play.

Besides, there's a very good chance that they will have to roll the season opener back a couple weeks.

[RiverDog]

The NFL and players union apparently have agreed on a testing protocol for training camp. Here's what it looks like:

The NFL and NFL Players Association have an agreement in place to conduct daily COVID-19 testing, according to a memo released by the league (first reported by Tom Pelissero of the NFL Network). This will stretch over the first two weeks of training camp, and after that, the league will look at positivity rates. If the rate drops below 5% for players along with individuals in Tier 1 and Tier 2, they will move testing to every other day. Players will also need multiple negative tests before they're allowed to be in club facilities for physicals and team activities.

Tier 1 includes players, coaches, trainers, physicians and necessary personnel. Tier 2 includes GMs, team presidents and football operations employees, among others.

The memo highlights that the pre-entry testing period will include two days of virtual meeting in between tests. Players will be tested on Day 1 and Day 4 of training camp with two days of remote education in between. Day 5 of this pre-entry testing period is when players can enter the club facility and is also when the daily testing begins. For veterans who report to camp on July 28, the earliest they can go through a physical is August 1.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl- ... ning-camp/

Still nothing definitive on preseason games. Reports are that the league has offered to cancel all 4 of them. There's also word that part of the league's proposal is to increase the size of practice squads.

[EmeraldBullet]

But RD, even if they are still in great physical shape they aren't used to the speed and full contact of a real game. It takes time and practice to get adjusted to the speed of the real game. Theres gonna be way more injuries is my prediction. I hope I'm wrong.

[RiverDog]

But RD, even if they are still in great physical shape they aren't used to the speed and full contact of a real game. It takes time and practice to get adjusted to the speed of the real game. Theres gonna be way more injuries is my prediction. I hope I'm wrong.

I'll bet you a cold, frosty one on that! They are going to get nearly 7 weeks of practice before the opener, plus I wouldn't be surprised if in lieu of preseason games that they have a couple of intrasquad scrimmages. The coaches will make sure that they're in game shape.

But as I stated, we're likely to see a drop off in the quality of the game, more presnap penalties, more blown coverages, more missed assignments, lots of first half timeouts. Offenses will be dumbed down.

Plus there's a good possibility that they'll delay the season opener by several weeks.

[RiverDog]

It looks like the decision to eliminate all 4 preseason games is a done deal. The league and union also agreed to reduce roster size for training camp to 80 per team.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/n ... 483773002/


It looks like they've addressed at least of the players grievances. We'll see how it goes.

Edit: The league announced that all fans in attendance at all NFL games will have to wear masks regardless of the lack of any state or local mandate requiring them. New Jersey has announced that it will not allow any crowds of more than 500 people, essentially banning fans from attending Jets and Giants games. Several teams, including the Atlanta Falcons, have announced that they will allow between 10,000-20,000 fans in attendance.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl- ... -pandemic/

[EmeraldBullet]

I'll bet you a cold, frosty one on that! They are going to get nearly 7 weeks of practice before the opener, plus I wouldn't be surprised if in lieu of preseason games that they have a couple of intrasquad scrimmages. The coaches will make sure that they're in game shape.

But as I stated, we're likely to see a drop off in the quality of the game, more presnap penalties, more blown coverages, more missed assignments, lots of first half timeouts. Offenses will be dumbed down.

Plus there's a good possibility that they'll delay the season opener by several weeks.

I'm willing to take the bet but how will we measure the level of injuries?

[RiverDog]

I'll bet you a cold, frosty one on that! They are going to get nearly 7 weeks of practice before the opener, plus I wouldn't be surprised if in lieu of preseason games that they have a couple of intrasquad scrimmages. The coaches will make sure that they're in game shape.

But as I stated, we're likely to see a drop off in the quality of the game, more presnap penalties, more blown coverages, more missed assignments, lots of first half timeouts. Offenses will be dumbed down.

Plus there's a good possibility that they'll delay the season opener by several weeks.

I'm willing to take the bet but how will we measure the level of injuries?

Number of players that do not play due to injury. The report comes out each week.

[jshawaii22]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/07/24/nflpa-executive-committee-unanimously-recommends-cba-proposal/

Never a dull moment in the NFL. This was a welcome surprise today. Let's play football! Now, just get the rest of the players on-board or at least not bitching about how management is screwing them.

[RiverDog]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2020/07/24/nflpa-executive-committee-unanimously-recommends-cba-proposal/

Never a dull moment in the NFL. This was a welcome surprise today. Let's play football! Now, just get the rest of the players on-board or at least not bitching about how management is screwing them.

There's still some details to be worked out, but at least they're moving forward.

[EmeraldBullet]

Works for me RD. Are we just talking Seahawks or NFL in general? Im down for the bet either way. Honestly I hope you win. If theres less injuries and I get to buy a fellow hawkshacker some beer, that's not really a loss imo.

[RiverDog]

Works for me RD. Are we just talking Seahawks or NFL in general? Im down for the bet either way. Honestly I hope you win. If theres less injuries and I get to buy a fellow hawkshacker some beer, that's not really a loss imo.

Since last season saw an unusual number of Seahawks go down with injuries, it would probably be in your favor to include the entire league. I'm pretty sure that we were above the norm last season.

But I'm not sure if cumulative injury stats from last season are available unless one went to the time and effort to go back through all the weekly injury reports and accumulated all the data for each and every team, 13-16 games per week for 17 weeks, and even then, it would be hard to tell whether or not a player listed as doubtful, probable, et al played or not.

Unless you know of a way to make an accurate assessment that I haven't thought of, we'll just have to use our own judgement and call it a gentleman's bet.

[NorthHawk]

I've heard a few times over the years from different linemen that they thought they needed more physical contact before the games
started to get used to the pounding a game takes on them. It makes a bit of sense from that perspective and would
suggest more injuries might occur if those players are correct. It's also going to be harder on rookie OL because they
will make their mistakes when it counts most.

[RiverDog]

I've heard a few times over the years from different linemen that they thought they needed more physical contact before the games started to get used to the pounding a game takes on them. It makes a bit of sense from that perspective and would
suggest more injuries might occur if those players are correct. It's also going to be harder on rookie OL because they will make their mistakes when it counts most.

How many plays do starters actually get in 4 preseason games, and out of those plays, how many involve aggressive contact vs. a play on the opposite side, etc.?

Plus we have to account for the fact that players are hurt in preseason games, too. In 2014 Sam Bradford suffered a season ending knee injury in a preseason game. In 2017, Julian Edleman was lost for the season in a preseason game. IMO the biggest risk factor involved in injuries is how many full contact plays a player participates in. Indeed, that's been the player's argument in trying to expand the season, because it exposes them to them to more risk.

[jshawaii22]

In this year's Seahawks case, it may not be injuries that derail the team, but the 3 new starters on the right side of the OLine including a new center and 4 if Olson ends up as the starter. OLines need to work in unison, especially on the run plays. Pass protection would seem to be easier to deal with as it's a one-on-one proposition with OLine calls by Russell (like he was doing year when Hunt took over)

Maybe this is the real reason that the word out on the street is that Russell is being given the reigns to call plays from the line of scrimmage and turn the team into a pass-first team and also why we're trying to sign the 2 irresponsible all-pro receivers that may or may not be able to play for any team this year.
Russ knows we need at least 4 downfield threats to open up the defenses. I see a lot more 3 & 4 receiver sets or using 2 tight ends if Dissley can come back.

[RiverDog]

In this year's Seahawks case, it may not be injuries that derail the team, but the 3 new starters on the right side of the OLine including a new center and 4 if Olson ends up as the starter. OLines need to work in unison, especially on the run plays. Pass protection would seem to be easier to deal with as it's a one-on-one proposition with OLine calls by Russell (like he was doing year when Hunt took over)

I agree. Only the QB/WR relationship rivals the OL as a unit dependent on common repetitions to function as a whole.

Maybe this is the real reason that the word out on the street is that Russell is being given the reigns to turn the team into a pass-first team and also why we're trying to sign the 2 irresponsible all-pro receivers that may or may not be able to play for any team this year.

I doubt it. First of all, we don't have the cap space, especially now that we've acquired Jamal Adams. And secondly, I don't think Pete wants another Percy Harvin.

[jshawaii22]

That tidbit about Adams, i didn't catch that while I was typing. Not sure how that changes, but for what we gave up, I assume that we have a contract for him ready to go. Bye Bye any chance to sign Clowney.

[c_hawkbob]

That tidbit about Adams, i didn't catch that while I was typing. Not sure how that changes, but for what we gave up, I assume that we have a contract for him ready to go. Bye Bye any chance to sign Clowney.

Oh I disagree that that's conclusive. I think we always could do both.

[RiverDog]

That tidbit about Adams, i didn't catch that while I was typing. Not sure how that changes, but for what we gave up, I assume that we have a contract for him ready to go. Bye Bye any chance to sign Clowney.

Oh I disagree that that's conclusive. I think we always could do both.

It probably precludes at least one option we had in signing Clowney, which was to a one year contract vs. a multi year deal that would allow us to spread out the cap hit.

[jshawaii22]

We made the trade without a new contract in place, so by trading McDougall we came out about even, so we should have the same cap space.

Adams has 2 years left on his rookie deal and has complained daily about it. I just don't see us forcing him to play for (at least) 2 years) and not screw up the team over it.

it also comes to mind that with the next 2 years cap being way lower, not having a first round pick would save a few million each year to go to Adams type of contract.

[RiverDog]

We made the trade without a new contract in place, so by trading McDougall we came out about even, so we should have the same cap space.

Adams has 2 years left on his rookie deal and has complained daily about it. I just don't see us forcing him to play for (at least) 2 years) and not screw up the team over it.

it also comes to mind that with the next 2 years cap being way lower, not having a first round pick would save a few million each year to go to Adams type of contract.

Thanks, JS. I haven't spent a lot of time looking at the details of his contract, or at least that's my excuse.