Kam is considering holding out

[RiverDog]

Good article by La Canfora. Count me in the camp that hopes the Seahawks FO does not buckle on this. I'm fine with welcoming him back and erasing any fines, and maybe even restructuring his deal in some fashion or another just to make him feel better, but not with raising the guaranteed money level.

I like Kam a lot. I couldn't decide before if he or RW was my favorite player. Easy decision for me now. Bottom line is that each day he sits out, he's not helping our team and he's not honoring the contract he signed with an FO that has treated him very well.

GO SEAHAWKS!!!

RW's my favorite Hawk. No other currently on this team comes close.

But I really liked Kam, at least up until the last month or so. I thought this holdout would be over by now, that Kam would come back and sign some face saving tweak in his existing deal, a few more bucks up front, etc. I'm losing patience real fast, and of the mindset that we look for the best trade deal to the worst possible place, say like Oakland or Jacksonville. What do you think we'd get for him, a #1 plus change?

[burrrton]

I'd be sick to my stomach seeing Kam traded at this point.

Best secondary and defense in the league for 3 years running set up to continue that for the foreseeable future torn apart by one guy because his agent told him the team could manufacture money for him.

Pisses. Me. Off.

[monkey]

Are we sure his agent gave him that advice? I find it hard to believe any agent worth his salt would be that stupid honestly. Kam has ZERO leverage...literally.

BTW here's a link that offers evidence to show that, the front office absolutely should NOT budge on this holdout.
Do yourselves a favor and read this article, it is terrific, and provides strong evidence that all the hand wringing people have been doing about the salary cap, and how we're soon going to implode is ridiculous!
http://www.fieldgulls.com/seahawks-analysis/2015/8/27/9213799/seahawks-salary-cap-analysis-john-schneider-pete-carroll-nfl

[burrrton]

Are we sure his agent gave him that advice?

No- just assuming.

[monkey]

No- just assuming.

Ahh...too bad, I'd much rather blame an idiot agent.

[burrrton]

Ahh...too bad, I'd much rather blame an idiot agent.

Hehe- no, nothing I can pin on anyone specifically.

Get your ass in camp, Kam. Be a part of something special. We need you and you need us.

[RiverDog]

I'd be sick to my stomach seeing Kam traded at this point.

Best secondary and defense in the league for 3 years running set up to continue that for the foreseeable future torn apart by one guy because his agent told him the team could manufacture money for him.

Pisses. Me. Off.

Me, too, and I'm not advocating it, but it's an option that has to be on the table, if for nothing else, to serve as a threat to Kam and/or his agent and show them just who is holding all the aces in this poker game. Eventually Kam would have to realize that he's playing with fire. There's a very good chance that if he were traded, he could find himself in a really bad situation where his talents may not be utilized as successfully as they have been with us.

They're going to have to draw a line in the sand at some point, and I gotta think that we're getting pretty close to it. We're heading into PS Game 3, which is the point where the starting lineup is pretty much determined and the roster has had shook out of it most of the training camp fodder. Kam is an asset that we can't afford to waste, so if he's not going to play for us under our terms, then we have to start considering the unthinkable: Trade him and get what we can for him. As for us fans, we would have to treat it as if he'd sustained a career ending injury. Next man up!

So back to my original question: What do you think we could get in a trade? An All Pro caliber defensive back in his prime is worth a #1 overall and then some, but is someone going to give us that much? Would there be multiple teams bidding for his services that could drive up his value? Atlanta and Jacksonville would be obvious partners due the backgrounds of their head coaches, but would there be others?

[burrrton]

So back to my original question: What do you think we could get in a trade?

I don't even attempt to answer questions like this because any "analysis" from me on things like that invariably goes the way my Fantasy Football picks go: all with my heart and none with my head.

My FF teams would be every Seahawk I could grab, and if we traded Kam, I'd estimate we should get a decade of #1 picks.

[kalibane]

I guarantee you any trade would be underwhelming. SS isn't a marquee position and veteran trades in general tend to get less in return than the value they represent to their current team.

Conditional 3rd round pick at most if I'm trying to make you feel good. If I'm being honest about what I really think, like a conditional 4th or 5th round pick. And again, that has no real reflection on how good Kam is, just the nature of veteran trades in the NFL at positions that aren't seen as great value.

That's part of why this hold out makes such little sense. I get the feeling that he doesn't like being the low man on the LOB totem pole in terms of salary but he will never be paid the same money as Earl Thomas just by virtue of the position he plays.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

You are probably right, kalibane. I want to think Kam's body of work with the Seahawks as well as he's the best SS in the league would garner at least a 3rd, maybe a 2nd.

In any case, it would be a real shame to have to trade him, but they may not have a choice. If guys like Bailey and Shead come into their own, and the defense is doing a bang up job, then the FO may really start considering trading a guy that they suddenly find themselves not needing. Fingers crossed Kam comes to his senses.

Side note: Taking our Seahawks blinders off, is there any strong safety in the league in the same tier as Kam?

[kalibane]

Eric Berry is the only guy I can think of but he's coming back from his health issues so who knows where he is right now?

[RiverDog]

I guarantee you any trade would be underwhelming. SS isn't a marquee position and veteran trades in general tend to get less in return than the value they represent to their current team.

Conditional 3rd round pick at most if I'm trying to make you feel good. If I'm being honest about what I really think, like a conditional 4th or 5th round pick. And again, that has no real reflection on how good Kam is, just the nature of veteran trades in the NFL at positions that aren't seen as great value.

That's part of why this hold out makes such little sense. I get the feeling that he doesn't like being the low man on the LOB totem pole in terms of salary but he will never be paid the same money as Earl Thomas just by virtue of the position he plays.

Yea, that's probably true, Kal. A first rounder plus change is probably way too high for a SS, and like I said, I'm not advocating it. But it should at least be considered as part of a threat to Kam and his agent, so perhaps they ought to start making some phone calls and plant a few rumors. I don't think he wants to be traded to some mystery team.

[Seahawks4Ever]

Any team that would be interested in Kam would have not have the ability to be able to redo his contract but also the willingness. Said team would have to be desperate for a SS and believe that their defense /secondary was one player, this player from being truly great.

No matter how such a trade would work out we would be hosed if it were just draft picks. now, if they had a surplus very good Center/ O-Lineman and/or a pick then maybe it would be a win/win.

As for M. Bennett saying that it "wasn't his problem" when asked which player or players might have to be traded and/or let go in order to satisfy his salary demands.

That comment by Bennett shows a bad attitude and a lack of respect toward his fellow team mates. That bad attitude shows a guy who doesn't care whether his team is successful or not. Call it the Super Bowl winner's hang over. Bennett is good, but if I was John and Pete I would be looking to replace him. Malcontents are not good for morale to have in the locker room and are a bad influence on younger players especially rookies guys in their 2nd. year.

[jshawaii22]

Bennett has been in camp EVERY DAY. Bennett has looked (IMHO) the BEST defender on the field in the 2 pre-season games. Bennett has not said anything negative about the FO or his contract since he backed off his 'trade' demand.

I'm not in the clubhouse, so I don't know if he is a cancer, but somehow I doubt it. Contracts are what they are. I doubt many players think they are being paid enough. I would assume most b**** at least a little, especially the starters. I guarantee you that when I was an employee I always thought I was underpaid, but it never impaired my job. If anyone on this team should be bitching about his pay, it's Sweezy. He's been a starter for most of his career, on a 6th (?) round salary and he hasn't said a word, at least not in public.

I would suggest that we don't look to trade our best interior lineman to resign Kam. That would be a much bigger mistake at this point. Trade Kam for draft choices if we have to would be my last choice.

js

[Hawktawk]

I think there might be a lot of interest around the league in Cam,. This isn't any SS. This is Cam Bam, the Dark Knight. I think hes the most important person in the secondary and is grossly underpaid. I dont know the answer. I wonder how much Russ's and then Wags deal might have to do with it.
Its sad..........I cant stand the thought of losing Cam Bam....

[obiken]

Giants have lost 4 safeties! Tell me they wont be #1 on the wait list?

[HumanCockroach]

You can add a team that utilizes hard hitting safety near the line of scrimmage, say one who's defense was predicated on being great because of one, who just retired. The Steelers come instantly to mind, Kam and Polamalu are incredibly similar players in that regard.

[RiverDog]

You can add a team that utilizes hard hitting safety near the line of scrimmage, say one who's defense was predicated on being great because of one, who just retired. The Steelers come instantly to mind, Kam and Polamalu are incredibly similar players in that regard.

Maybe I just didn't watch enough of him, but I never got the impression that Polamalu was a heavy duty, snot bubbler type of a hitter like Kam is. I could never imagine TP playing linebacker, but I sure as heck could imagine Kam at LB.

[obiken]

Suppose, that they cant get Kam signed, Giants offer Beckham, or Cruz, that would be a tough trade to turn down. Now I would turn it down but, IF you give RW the 2nd best TE, 2nd best WR, and the best RB, in the league our offense would be just killer. He would shove the blitz's up their buttocks, bad OL or no bad OL.
I still think its BS he will be back by game 7 at the latest. Too much money to lose.

[Hawktawk]

Suppose, that they cant get Kam signed, Giants offer Beckham, or Cruz, that would be a tough trade to turn down. Now I would turn it down but, IF you give RW the 2nd best TE, 2nd best WR, and the best RB, in the league our offense would be just killer. He would shove the blitz's up their buttocks, bad OL or no bad OL.
I still think its BS he will be back by game 7 at the latest. Too much money to lose.

Maybe they would let go of oft injured Cruz but no way is Beckham leaving anywhere. I dont know how long into the regular season Seattle can afford to wait. I doubt its 6 or 7 weeks.

[NorthHawk]

If he's not playing, the team isn't paying anything, so it's not like they can't let it continue all year if necessary.
He's not a distraction in the traditional sense - and reports are that he's helping the young Safeties learn and develop into possible starters some day.
As long as the backups can produce at a level that keeps the Defense performing well as a whole, the pressure will remain low to make any moves.

[RiverDog]

Suppose, that they cant get Kam signed, Giants offer Beckham, or Cruz, that would be a tough trade to turn down. Now I would turn it down but, IF you give RW the 2nd best TE, 2nd best WR, and the best RB, in the league our offense would be just killer. He would shove the blitz's up their buttocks, bad OL or no bad OL.
I still think its BS he will be back by game 7 at the latest. Too much money to lose.

IMO the Giants wouldn't trade Beckham for Sherman or Thomas let alone Chancellor. Beckham is perhaps the best young WR in the game today, and WR is quite a bit higher value than a strong safety/linebacker. Victor Cruz, maybe. But the most likely trade scenario for a trade would be draft choices.

[NorthHawk]

Or maybe a proven good Offensive Lineman if they go that route.

[Seahawks4Ever]

I know that Bennett has been in camp every single day. he is there because he is not stupid. But, what also is in camp with him is his raunchy attitude. He is a team leader, a player younger players look up to. He said that "it isn't his problem" when asked which player or players the Hawks should get rid of to satisfy his salary demands. Well, technically it may not be his problem but it will become his problem if he has to take on even more duties and play more snaps to take up the slack.

It is being intellectually dishonest of him to demand more money than he recently agreed to when the team has very little "wiggle room" in both cap space and available money w/o either cutting or trading away (at the team's disadvantage) a player or two. Possibly even a current fellow starter.

Bennett is aware of the situation and knows full well the pressure he would put on the team should they give in to his demands. So, just the fact that he would put the team through these unnecessary distractions can adversely affect the morale of the whole team.

So, while he is in camp, just his constantly carping to MRob and other members of the press is bad for the chemistry of the locker room. No matter how good a player he is, at some point the Hawks may have to trade him, but I would NOT trade him to where he wants to go to, which is probably what is really behind his chipping his teeth about his contract.

[c_hawkbob]

But, what also is in camp with him is his raunchy attitude.

Gonna need some evidence of that beyond reiterating that he's still happy with his contract to the press.

He's said that it's important to him that he take a leadership role, which is quite the opposite of grumbling about being unhappy to team mates. I have heard no one at all accuse him of displaying a "raunchy attitude" in the locker room.