Preseason Games

[River Dog]

Tonight is the start of the Mike Macdonald era as we travel to LA to take on the Chargers. As a rule, I don't pay much attention to the preseason as they're not much more than a glorified scrimmage, but this year is different. They have an unusual start time for a game on the west coast, 4pm PT. Our local Fox station is carrying it live, but for those of you that live out of market, you'll have to be signed up for NFL+ if you want to watch it.

[NorthHawk]

I'm more interested than normal even though I watched all of the preseason games anyway.
I want to have a look at the DL in particular and the OL is always a concern even if both sides of the ball are vanilla at this time of year. Other than that I hope to see some new players that look like they have a future here.

[River Dog]

Yeah, I'll be watching Olu. I have it set up to record so I can go back and take a closer look.

[Spohawk5092]

very impressed with the throwing arm of new back up QB, Howell.

[trents]

I like what I saw in that first drive by Seattle that resulted in a TD.

1. Sam Howel didn't force anything and he showed some good wheels when pulling the ball down and running for it.
2. The play calling looked fresh and creative. Something we haven't seen for a long time. They kept the chains moving. Not so predictable.
3. The offensive line was moving bodies on the other side.

Preseason game or not, we haven't seen these things in a long time.

[River Dog]

Boy, this new kickoff rule is going to take some getting used to.

The defense looks great! So far, ie middle of the 2nd quarter, the defense hasn't allowed a 1st down.

[trents]

Yep, the D was impressive. Good pressure up front all night and multiple defenders flying to the ball on pass plays. Just seemed like there was a much better energy level as a whole than we've seen in years. The players just looked better prepared than I can remember during the last half of the Pete era.

[Aseahawkfan]

How did Murphy look?

[Vegaseahawk]

I enjoyed the game. McIntosh was good. Howell may turn out to be a gem. But it was a great statement by the defense. Bolts had zero 1st downs until late in the 3rd qtr. It was refreshing to see defensive guys flying around. Murphy disrupted things with a tfl, & an impressive bull rush that caused an incompletion. There weren't a lot of penalties either. The team discipline is better. No turnovers by the Hawks. I love the new kickoff formation. Break a couple of tackles & it's 6 points!

[River Dog]

How did Murphy look?

I saw him make one tackle for a loss, but I didn't get too much of a chance to concentrate on the DL. The fact that we allowed just 77 yards rushing says that he couldn't have played too badly. I recorded the game, so perhaps I'll go back and take a look.

The defensive dominance was truly awesome. The Chargers didn't run a single play from scrimmage from inside our 35-yard line. Lots of energy and excitement on the defensive side of the ball. Secondary played great. Woolen looked good, at least in coverage.

Offense looked so-so. No turnovers. McIntosh ran hard. Sam Howell didn't make any glaring mistakes, no picks or bad sacks. From what I could see, the OL played reasonably well. Got stuffed at the goal line once. Almost reminded me of Pete Ball, low risk, heavy on the run, don't put the D in bad spots.

All in all, it was a fantastic first outing. Let's hope it carries into the regular season.

[Aseahawkfan]

I saw him make one tackle for a loss, but I didn't get too much of a chance to concentrate on the DL. The fact that we allowed just 77 yards rushing says that he couldn't have played too badly. I recorded the game, so perhaps I'll go back and take a look.

The defensive dominance was truly awesome. The Chargers didn't run a single play from scrimmage from inside our 35-yard line. Lots of energy and excitement on the defensive side of the ball. Secondary played great. Woolen looked good, at least in coverage.

Offense looked so-so. No turnovers. McIntosh ran hard. Sam Howell didn't make any glaring mistakes, no picks or bad sacks. From what I could see, the OL played reasonably well. Got stuffed at the goal line once. Almost reminded me of Pete Ball, low risk, heavy on the run, don't put the D in bad spots.

All in all, it was a fantastic first outing. Let's hope it carries into the regular season.

I expect the defense to be better. But can't get much out of watching preseason game 1 where most of the starters aren't playing. Chargers are kind of screwed with their QB out, though Harbaugh has manufactured more than a few reasonable offenses with a fairly average QB like Colin K.

There is only three preseason games now? So game 2 is the starter game now or do they not even bother with a tune up game?

[River Dog]

I expect the defense to be better. But can't get much out of watching preseason game 1 where most of the starters aren't playing. Chargers are kind of screwed with their QB out, though Harbaugh has manufactured more than a few reasonable offenses with a fairly average QB like Colin K.

There is only three preseason games now? So game 2 is the starter game now or do they not even bother with a tune up game?

Yep, just 3 preseason games. They cut one to accommodate the 17-game regular season schedule. No tune-up game although I think a few teams might have intersquad scrimmages.

I normally don't pay much attention to preseason games, either, and I'm not going to predict great things as a result of this outcome. But I really liked what I saw, particularly on defense. Those guys were excited, flying around the ball, getting pressure on the QB. They should have had a couple more INT's. I came away feeling good about our team, first time I've felt that way in years.

Next Saturday, we play at Tennessee, same kickoff time, 4pm PT.

[c_hawkbob]

I liked the look and movement of our defense, and I feel much better about our depth at QB.

[NorthHawk]

I liked how the Offense although pretty basic was using more quick screens and the RBs being used in the pass game. Even in its basic form it's a more modern Offense.
It looks like the interior of the DL will be much better. Murphy on one play shed a double team and made the play and he bull rushed a Guard to put pressure on the QB. It's only 1 preseason game but he looks like he could be a good addition.
On Defense it looked like MacDonald is trying to put the players in positions where they can maximize their natural talents and Derick Hall stood out at times. CB play was encouraging as well.
Next weeks game will be interesting to see if it was just a Chargers team that hasn't yet caught on to their new schemes or whether the Seahawks are further along than them.
But if last nights game is any indication this team might surprise others at the beginning of the year.

[Spohawk5092]

can someone explain to me in laymans terms EXACTLY why the new kick off rule? The explanation of how it works is WAY to complicated for the average guy. Thank you.

[c_hawkbob]

Why? To lessen full speed head-on collisions. It's a complex mechanism to accomplish that end but it looks like it works.

[c_hawkbob]

How did Murphy look?

I saw him make one tackle for a loss, but I didn't get too much of a chance to concentrate on the DL. The fact that we allowed just 77 yards rushing says that he couldn't have played too badly. I recorded the game, so perhaps I'll go back and take a look.

The defensive dominance was truly awesome. The Chargers didn't run a single play from scrimmage from inside our 35-yard line. Lots of energy and excitement on the defensive side of the ball. Secondary played great. Woolen looked good, at least in coverage.

Offense looked so-so. No turnovers. McIntosh ran hard. Sam Howell didn't make any glaring mistakes, no picks or bad sacks. From what I could see, the OL played reasonably well. Got stuffed at the goal line once. Almost reminded me of Pete Ball, low risk, heavy on the run, don't put the D in bad spots.

All in all, it was a fantastic first outing. Let's hope it carries into the regular season.

I watched it live streaming so I couldn't record live, but I recorded the NFLN rebroadcast and evidently they condensed it by removing all the Bolts' 3 and outs in the first quarter so I couldn't concentrate closely on Murphy as I'd intended. But it seemed watching real time that he was eating double teams almost every running play.

[Oly]

I wasn't able to watch, so grains of salt here. But the thing I'm most interested in seeing is whether there are big mistakes at the individual level. I'm hesitant to give lots of plaudits for good plays, because you never know if that was only available because of vanilla schemes and 3rd stringers. But if I see lots of individual errors, I see that as helpful for evaluating players. So with that in mind, the performance of the defense shows that, at the very least, there weren't lots of big errors, otherwise they'd have given up more yards and points.

[River Dog]

Why? (new kickoff rule) To lessen full speed head-on collisions. It's a complex mechanism to accomplish that end but it looks like it works.

That's definitely part of it, but they're also trying to make the kickoff more exciting as roughly 3/4 of all kickoffs were touchbacks. If you noticed last night, there were several kickoffs returned out to midfield.

I'm still not clear as to what all the specific rules are, and it looks strange to see it for the first time. I guess I'd better get up to speed as there's too many people who have this false impression of me being some sort of an expert and will be quizzing me on it.

[Spohawk5092]

Why? To lessen full speed head-on collisions. It's a complex mechanism to accomplish that end but it looks like it works.

thank you man!!

[River Dog]

Looking at the replay of our failure to score at the 1-yard line 4th and goal, 6:50 in the 3rd, Olu got stuffed, shoved backwards. If he's going to be our starting center, we're going to have problems in short yardage situations.

[4XPIPS]

Well just being one preseason game it's hard not to overreact to certain things, but it goes with out saying that other than getting a win, you will leave the game with a good feeling that the team is headed in the right direction.

For the overall scope of the game sort of reminded me of what Pete Carroll would dream of having. A dominant defense, and a balanced offense and decisive time of possession. This is the type of football Pete was always gunning for, but in reality he is gone and enter the Mike Macdonald era.

"The Good, the Bad, the Ugly"

The "Good" to me was no serious injuries, and for the most part everyone was playing at full speed. Yes we hardly saw any starters out there, but it was good to get some players to shine given their limited opportunity. For offense my take was Kenny McIntosh. I think he ran hard, and showed some shifty-ness at times. He definitely will be playing a lot of special teams for us, but I think he will be solid option as our third tailback. For defense, I would have to say I was actually impressed how "not-out" of position Riq Woolen was early in the game. He wasn't yards away in coverage and was actually pretty tight up on his wide receiver, also almost had a interception. He did not play much, but it looked improved. Byron Murphy was disruptive up the middle, and he did let a QB sack slip out of his hands, and I am pretty sure he would want that back. Overall defense did look pretty good, flying around but it was mostly against Easton Stick, who was quite terrible to honest. Dickson looks to be in All-pro form with his accurate punts, and he looks to be one of the top punters in the league.

The "Bad", what really jumped out at me was McClendon Curtis playing right tackle. I know Fant Cross or Lucas weren't playing, but Curtis is not the answer at right tackle as he was beat almost on every pass play. I know they were trying him at guard, but if they have to use him at tackle he will need help. On special teams, I am not sure if this was done from coaching but we did force a lot of three and outs and fair caught quite a bit of punts that I felt were returnable. Again not sure if that was coaches call, but if you watch back you can see a few of those punts should have been returned.

The "Ugly", well I have to say it and that is Jason Myers missing an extra point. I know it's preseason but his inconsistency is a bit concerning. I figure we will be in some dog fights this season and a few games will come down to made extra points, and field goals. Jason has been in the league 10 years, and should be making extra points like layups. Hopefully he cleans it up and be consistent again this season.

It's just one preseason game, and most starters weren't out there but clear to see that our team doesn't look like a total rebuild with a new coaching staff. I just don't get that feeling. I seriously feel like we are taking what we had last year and improving it slowly for this season.

[Old but Slow]

The decision to eliminate a pre-season game in order to have 17 games is a mistake driven by greed. One less game for young players to make a statement, which is unfair to them, and we end up with an unbalanced schedule in which some will have 8 home games and some will have 9. How is that good?

And I am very excited from what I am seeing, strong tackling (hooray), great effort, and an amazing amount of cohesiveness.

[River Dog]

The decision to eliminate a pre-season game in order to have 17 games is a mistake driven by greed. One less game for young players to make a statement, which is unfair to them, and we end up with an unbalanced schedule in which some will have 8 home games and some will have 9. How is that good?

And I am very excited from what I am seeing, strong tackling (hooray), great effort, and an amazing amount of cohesiveness.

It's a different subject, but I've been hoping that they'll designate that 17th game to be played at a neutral site, whether that be an international venue or an out of market domestic city.

[NorthHawk]

It won't matter in the near future as they are going to an 18 game season and eventually a 20 game schedule.
They are already talking with the NFLPA about the changes expected to come about in the next year or so.
Some of the topics include extra bye week or weeks and the extension of the schedule including playoffs into late February along with moving the draft in some way.

[c_hawkbob]

I'll buy 18, in fact it's pretty certain, but eventually 20? I doubt it.

[NorthHawk]

It was mentioned by I think Jones that they would like to eliminate all preseason games and just go with the schedule.
That would make it 20 games and since they would get more revenue, it seems in keeping with the anything for a buck focus of the owners.
Eventually Mark Cuban's comment about pigs getting slaughtered might become reality.

[Aseahawkfan]

18 games has to happen to equalize the home games versus away games. 20 sheesh. These guys could barely last 16.

[4XPIPS]

I'll buy 18, in fact it's pretty certain, but eventually 20? I doubt it.

Yes there are talks about 18, and it will happen sooner than we think. Also in conjunction with the 18 games season there were NFL podcasters talking there is the potential to increase the active roster to 57 to 58 players, with the game day roster being 53 to 55 player. This would work along with the longer playing season.

[River Dog]

I'll buy 18, in fact it's pretty certain, but eventually 20? I doubt it.

Me, too. 20 would really be stretching it. I doubt that the player's union would be able to be talked into it unless they had a major roster expansion, which would just mean more players being put on the payroll.

[NorthHawk]

Well they've been talking about going into the season without any preseason games for a couple of years but they still want the revenue that those games provided - and more.
The NFLPA talked about it and suggested that there would be at least 1 other bye week and maybe 2 along with expanded rosters and expanded Practice Squad.

I think it's inevitable. And I also think the product will suffer because of it.

[River Dog]

Well they've been talking about going into the season without any preseason games for a couple of years but they still want the revenue that those games provided - and more.
The NFLPA talked about it and suggested that there would be at least 1 other bye week and maybe 2 along with expanded rosters and expanded Practice Squad.

I think it's inevitable. And I also think the product will suffer because of it.

Agreed, especially with your last sentence. At some point, they're going to overreach, kill the goose that laid the golden egg. The more games they have, the lesser the importance of any given game.

Surveys have shown that a much smaller percentage of Gen Z identifies themselves as sports fans than preceding generations, and with participation in football on a decades long decline, there's going to be a progressively smaller market for them to sell their product.

[4XPIPS]

With week 2 in the books of the preseason I think it's only fair to analyze players that are going to be on the team and some have a fighting chance. Anything after the 2nd half of the Titans game is pretty much a moot point, because I believe almost 95% of those players won't make the 53. It's great to see players like Ty Okada make a play, and play with a bloody ear, but I just don't see him making the cut.

Offense looks sharp with Howell running the system. I think this in part as Grubb is a recent college OC, and Howell isn't far removed from playing recent college FB. I think that instant understanding of the system is adapting quite well with Howell. He looks sharp, and tossed an absolute dime to Easton for a TD, probably one the prettiest TD tosses of the preseason. He showed touch, and at times he fired some lasers down the seems for huge chunk plays. The o-line is still not looking great, with mostly backups out there but the protection looks bad, but Howell was able to move around the pocket make plays. Kenny McIntosh looked great again. He doesn't have a huge build for a tailback, but showed toughness in his runs with good break-tackle ability. I almost feel like Kenny McIntosh at times looks better as runner than Zach Charbonnet. if we are just taking preseason stats a gage. Kenny McIntosh has done much better with
below average o-line talent. I think using Preseason stats is a fair comparison, considering all teams are using non-starters and mostly backups.

Zach Charbonnet Preseason Stats 2023/2024 (4 Games played thus far)

12 Attempts
52 Yards
4.3 Avg
29 Long


Kenny McIntosh Stats 2024 (2 Games played thus far)
16 Attempts
86 Yards
5.4 avg
14 Long

This could be scheme, new coaches, or just better play calling. However, I am excited to have Kenny McIntosh as a third or potential RB2 for us.

For the defense it's starting to look exciting for us. The constant shifting, and sending pressure from all different angles. Seeing Derrick Hall just absolute speed rush to the QB, and watching Tyrice Knight command the middle. I think Knight is far from a finished product, but he is exactly the type of linebacker that Mike Macdonald is going to build around. The LB core is the most critical part of Macdonald's defense and seeing Knight make adjustments and break up screen plays shows me he has the potential to be a huge star in this defense. With the Baker and Dodson not even playing at all in preseason and nursing injuries, it has given Tyrice Knight and Jon Rhattigan a chance to show case their skillset and talent.

Secondary still looks lost at times, and I believe Coby Bryant may get cut. If Malik was a decent passer and didn't miss on wide open throws, this secondary would have been torched for bigger gains early in the first half.

Lastly, Jason Myers is concerning for us. I just hope he can snap out of it make those extra points which should be automatic at this point. Dee Williams looked good in the return game, but I don't think he makes the team.

Overall still a lot to get excited about, but again just doesn't feel like a rebuild at all and it feels like this team could be sneaky good this year.

[jshawaii22]

In preseason RB stats are almost meaningless as it more depends on if you played against the other teams #1, #2, or FA's and did you have our first or second Oline at the time of each carry.

However, I will admit I think that Sam Howell looked better than I thought because above all, he was accurate with the bulk of the throws. I also noticed that the other teams were blitzing us a lot, which I thought didn't happen much in preseason.

[River Dog]

In preseason RB stats are almost meaningless as it more depends on if you played against the other teams #1, #2, or FA's and did you have our first or second Oline at the time of each carry.

However, I will admit I think that Sam Howell looked better than I thought because above all, he was accurate with the bulk of the throws. I also noticed that the other teams were blitzing us a lot, which I thought didn't happen much in preseason.

It's not just the running backs' preseason stats that are meaningless. All preseason stats are meaningless, for the reason you mentioned. Same with the final score.

You really have to watch the games to get a feel for a player in the preseason.

But I agree with you about Howell. He looks promising.

[NorthHawk]

Howell has been no where near as bad as I had assumed from the results in Washington. I think he was thrown to the wolves too early to adjust to the NFL and with little help from his OL and game planning.
He may take a while to fully settle in, but he could be a serviceable backup and maybe a starter in time but it seems unlikely at this point he will become a franchise type QB.

[Stream Hawk]

Bigger question- Is Geno a franchise quarterback?

[River Dog]

Bigger question- Is Geno a franchise quarterback?

The simple answer is no.

[Aseahawkfan]

Bigger question- Is Geno a franchise quarterback?

33 year old QB who can't get your over the hump to the Super Bowl? I would say no. Good bridge QB, great backup. Glad he made some money at the end of his career which I hope he manages well into retirement.

But he's not the future. He's the present to keep the offense running reasonably well for the fans, but we'll be looking for the next franchise guy which I hope John can find next year or very soon.

[c_hawkbob]

For as terrible as y'all are saying Geno is he sure looked sharp in his only drive of the preseason. Not sayin he's our future but I wont be surprised if we do extend im another year or two if he stays sharp well into the season.