Next up: the draft

[Stream Hawk]

I am thrilled how much day 3 complements all their skill picks of the first 2 days. And the C at 154, love it:
https://twitter.com/sontseattle/status/ ... pMkhpLC7ng
Note- I am OK bypassing qbs as we need to fill out the roster first. Look out Niners!

[NorthHawk]

Mixed scouting reports about Olu.
His hands are small but he’s played a lot of football.
But he fits what Pete talked about with a shorter Center. He apparently thinks it gives them better leverage.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

Mixed scouting reports about Olu.
His hands are small but he’s played a lot of football.
But he fits what Pete talked about with a shorter Center. He apparently thinks it gives them better leverage.

Have to like he’s got plenty of experience at the position. I would hope he’s worked on compensating for his deficiencies already.

[obiken]

I like the center out of Michigan, Olusegun Oluwatimi (try saying that name 3 times as fast as you can). He started out at the Air Force academy but didn't play, transferred to Virginia where he started in 32 consecutive games before transferring to Michigan for his senior season where he won both the Outland and Rimington trophies. In total, he has 45 career starts at FBS schools. He graduated from Virginia in 4 years with a degree in economics, and along with the fact that they don't enroll dummies at the AF academy, we know that he has some smarts, a necessary ingredient for a successful center.

He's not the best prospect out there but at this point, he's probably the best we can do.

Yeah I dont get his pick Riv, the guy was the best interior lineman for 2022 and we get him here, that makes no sense. Maybe Bob knows what's wrong with him.

[obiken]

Aaaand there's our Center! Day 3 is making me a whole lot happier with our days 1 & 2!

You and me both! To get a 6.15 on day 3, Young is exactly what you were talking about yesterday, a run stuffer! We don;t need him to rush the passer!

[jshawaii22]

I was totally pissed off after we took a RB in the 2nd and then traded out of the 3rd. I was down for a big butt pick and actually turned off the draft. However, and time will tell, but it looks like we have made really good picks so far today that at least will fill the gaps we left on the table.

[HawkSis]

That’s the thing… we have to wait and see. So far, I’m not mad.

[c_hawkbob]

I like the center out of Michigan, Olusegun Oluwatimi (try saying that name 3 times as fast as you can). He started out at the Air Force academy but didn't play, transferred to Virginia where he started in 32 consecutive games before transferring to Michigan for his senior season where he won both the Outland and Rimington trophies. In total, he has 45 career starts at FBS schools. He graduated from Virginia in 4 years with a degree in economics, and along with the fact that they don't enroll dummies at the AF academy, we know that he has some smarts, a necessary ingredient for a successful center.

He's not the best prospect out there but at this point, he's probably the best we can do.

Yeah I dont get his pick Riv, the guy was the best interior lineman for 2022 and we get him here, that makes no sense. Maybe Bob knows what's wrong with him.

Rimington Award (nation's best Center) and Outland Trophy (nation's best lineman) winner last year as well as consensus All-American? There ain't much wrong with him! You can find lists of his negatives but they seem a bit nit picky to me. I think maybe teams like the flexibility to use a prospect at other positions if they're going to spend a higher pick on him, but I think him sliding to us is a gold strike!

[Aseahawkfan]

Finally, we get some fat boys for the middle of the lines.

[RiverDog]

Mixed scouting reports about Olu.
His hands are small but he’s played a lot of football.
But he fits what Pete talked about with a shorter Center. He apparently thinks it gives them better leverage.

Have to like he’s got plenty of experience at the position. I would hope he’s worked on compensating for his deficiencies already.

Yeah, he was the guy I was talking about earlier this AM. He's a little smallish and isn't a great road grader, but he's very experienced at center and does give us some depth. I'm still fuming because we passed up Schmitz for another running back.

[c_hawkbob]

You also called this Safety Riv! Seems we're hitting all the spot's they're putting up as our needs on the draft tracker I'm using.

[NorthHawk]

Another strong run defender Clearly a need/talent pick. He should help out this year.

[c_hawkbob]

And we wrap it up with Kenny McIntosh, RB outa Georgia.

Overall I don't think we got 5 starters/strong contributors like we did last year ... or maybe we did? I loved the players the first two days and the positions we addressed today. I think I like it!

[Aseahawkfan]

My guess is Witherspoon, Jaxon, and Charbonnet have the best chance to start in year 1.

Derek starting will heavily depend on how well he does in the competition in a crowded position group. We have a lot of edge guys competing for those OLB positions.

Still not sure who our ILBs are besides Bobby and Brooks when he gets healthy.

4 to 7th round picks are usually developmental picks with a pretty low chance to start unless they really do well like Tariq early. So that will come down to how well they do in competition.

The Center sounds promising, but there is a reason he lasted until the 4th or later.

[NorthHawk]

It will be interesting to see the battle for starting RB. Don’t count out McIntosh. He was a huge part of the Georgia Offense and is a very physical runner. He’s also said to be ultra competitive. Pete loves those types. I think of him as a Carson type with better speed and hands.

[Aseahawkfan]

I was watching some draft analysis for Charbonnet. He's a bigger guy, north-south type of runner that grinds yards with some receiving ability. Not super fast breakaway speed, but more of a yard grinder type of RB. Seems like he might make a good platoon back.

[c_hawkbob]

K-9 will start, at least to start the year. I think Olu has a better chance of starting.

[RiverDog]

My guess is Witherspoon, Jaxon, and Charbonnet have the best chance to start in year 1.

Derek starting will heavily depend on how well he does in the competition in a crowded position group. We have a lot of edge guys competing for those OLB positions.

Still not sure who our ILBs are besides Bobby and Brooks when he gets healthy.

4 to 7th round picks are usually developmental picks with a pretty low chance to start unless they really do well like Tariq early. So that will come down to how well they do in competition.

The Center sounds promising, but there is a reason he lasted until the 4th or later.

Witherspoon and Jaxon, yes. Charbonnet, no, but like Walker's rookie year before Penny got hurt, he'll get a fair share of carries.

I agree with C-bob about Olu having a better chance of starting than Charbonnet, but we don't have a returning starter or anyone with a decent resume at center so it's not necessarily a good thing for a 5th round pick to have an immediate chance at starting.

[jshawaii22]

When the NFL Stats guys look at games, only the 2 outside receivers are "starters" --Jaxon would (probably) be the starting slot receiver, but won't count, but he'll play 50% of the snaps, at least in the 3 and 4 receiver sets, and some plays outside once he and Geno get used to each other.

Geno has got to be drooling at the thought of getting a '3rd' receiver who the OSU coaches and CJ all said was the 'best of the lot' 2 years ago, before he got hurt. That lot would be Garrett Wilson and Chris Olave.

Only one guaranteed starter at CB with 'Spoon, but Derick Hall could win at outside LB as we are very weak there, Anthony Bradford could beat out either Guard, Cameron Young would be our "only" true, out of college Nose Tackle, so he could conceivably start and you never know about Center.
You know Pete and compete. This summer and training camp will be very interesting. Wish I could go.

[NorthHawk]

A couple of years ago the Packers got their starting Center and LG in the 6th round, So we shouldn’t be immediately dismissive about Olu starting. IOL often do well after being drafted in the mid to late rounds.

[Old but Slow]

This was again a very solid draft, with some surprises and without a QB, but probably an A. There was a report on SDB that Mike Morris has increased his weight from 275 to 295, so if that is good weight, he is athletic enough to impact the DL fairly soon. Olu Oluwatimi fell some because his hands are not just small, but very small for a guy his size (6' 3, 308), measuring just 8 5/8". That said, he had consistent good snaps, so it seemingly is not a problem.

The running back room is going to be crazy strong. Walker is the speed back, but both Charbonnet and McIntosh are better receivers and pass protection blockers. Charbonnet is also a strong runner for short yardage situations.

Witherspoon is a brilliant pick. A strong defensive backfield can give pass rushers an extra second or two which leads to sacks and broken plays. I love it.

Starters? Not many. But lots of depth. Witherspoon will likely start, Bradford could start at RG, and Cameron Young could force himself in. JSN will be the 3d WR almost for sure, Olu Olu could challenge and start later in the season, as could Derick Hall.

No TE, which surprised me some, although they have signed one as an udfa.

Tee it up!

[RiverDog]

A couple of years ago the Packers got their starting Center and LG in the 6th round, So we shouldn’t be immediately dismissive about Olu starting. IOL often do well after being drafted in the mid to late rounds.

Of course, there's going to be occasions when late round draft picks end up starting and doing well. Kam Chancellor was a 5th round pick, was the starter going into TC, and we all know how that worked out. I was speaking mainly about preseason expectations, and it's never a good sign when you're plan going into a season is that a 5th round draft pick is your leading candidate to be the starter at a given position.

[obiken]

That’s the thing… we have to wait and see. So far, I’m not mad.

Yeah I gotta give up for the old tyke, he nailed the last 2 drafts. We still have the whole F. Quarterback thing hanging out there though HS. This year we should be okay though.

[obiken]

And we wrap it up with Kenny McIntosh, RB outa Georgia.

Overall I don't think we got 5 starters/strong contributors like we did last year ... or maybe we did? I loved the players the first two days and the positions we addressed today. I think I like it!

Yeah this pick scares me a little CB, what does PC know about Walker that we dont. Charby is a load, I think when Chip Kelly started throwing the ball against us, is when Oregon won the game. He was killing us.

[RiverDog]

Overall I don't think we got 5 starters/strong contributors like we did last year ... or maybe we did? I loved the players the first two days and the positions we addressed today. I think I like it!

I'm disappointed that we didn't get our QBOTF. Although it's something we'll never know, if our brain trust didn't think he was in this draft, then I'm good with it. But anytime you head into a draft with a long-term need at the most important position on the field, a relatively strong class, and the draft capital to trade up to get him if necessary, we've failed. However, I was good with selecting Witherspoon as a Plan B as he was at least one of the top 2 prospects at a critical position, although I wouldn't have minded trading back, pocketing a future first round draft pick, and waiting till next year to find our QBOTF. Plus, I was relieved that we didn't draft Jalen Carter, of whom I regard as the riskiest pick in the top 10.

I generally don't like spending high draft picks, ie 1st and 2nd rounders, on positions I regard as non-essential to building a contender and that are prone to injury, ie running back and wide receiver, two positions where we had very productive and healthy returning starters already in place, especially when we had such glaring needs on both the offensive and defensive lines with what appeared to me to be plenty of candidates to address those needs that were available when our name was called.

The lower draft picks, I'm not all that familiar with. I haven't followed CFB very closely for years, so I don't have a good handle on the depth of the de facto NFL farm system. It's easy to watch the highlight reels, read the strengths and weaknesses analysis by the talking heads, and conclude that we've made out like bandits. But I'm wary of being duped as I have in the past, so I'm going to need to see them in game action before I can get a handle on just how well we did in this draft.

I'm not nearly as enthralled with this year's draft as I was last year's. In 2022, we addressed needs on the OL by dedicating a #1 and #3 to offensive tackles, the running back that we did take was a good value as he had dropped somewhat, was the top RB in one of the two top CFB conferences, and his build seemed to me to be a little less prone to injury. I was OK not going after a QB as unlike this year, that season's class was by all accounts very weak and we had the knowledge that we'd have two #1 picks to address it in the following season's draft. That doesn't exist this year.

Sorry to rain on everyone's parade, but I'm afraid I can't join you guys in your back flips and summersaults, at least not until the preseason.

[NorthHawk]

Yeah this pick scares me a little CB, what does PC know about Walker that we dont. Charby is a load, I think when Chip Kelly started throwing the ball against us, is when Oregon won the game. He was killing us.

McIntosh is a great receiving threat out of the backfield and combined with the inevitable injuries at RB and the loss of Homer, it's a no brainer to get a fresh crop of RBs. I think it also signals that we will emphasize the run game as well with two real good RB draft picks. Mcintosh might have been a Waldron pick in that he can do things in the pass game with RBs we haven't done during the Peteball years and maybe see a lot of wheel routes and throws down the seams to RBs. But what really sets him apart is he's also a real tough runner to tackle, too. It was a value pick of a player who fell a long way below where his talent should have landed him.

Charbonnet is another power RB who has some good speed and is difficult to tackle. He was my favorite after Robinson and Gibbs so getting him was a real surprise. He's also a very good receiver out of the backfield.

The bottom line is there might not be much of a fall off in the run game if one of the 3 gets injured and there might be a battle for the #1 RB position. Not a bad place to be for an Offense that wants and needs to run the ball to be successful.

[TriCitySam]

And we wrap it up with Kenny McIntosh, RB outa Georgia.

Overall I don't think we got 5 starters/strong contributors like we did last year ... or maybe we did? I loved the players the first two days and the positions we addressed today. I think I like it!

Not 5 starters. But it appears the top two are special and while some of the press has knocked the Charbonnet pick - mostly because they don't feel with K-9 we needed another RB - but as we know, it seems fairly easy to have guys miss games due to injury. So I like the pick. The center will be interesting to follow, generally not rated high due to his lack of versatility and being an "unimpressive" athlete. But from what I read he is a bulldozer in a power run game and didn't give up a sack last year. Witherspoon is an animal, hope he keeps personal fouls under control.

[NorthHawk]

I'm disappointed we didn't get a QBOTF in this draft, and I think Levis would have done really well here after a year of study and practice, but here we are.

Here are the picks for 2023:

Devon Witherspoon, CB
One of the top CBs in this draft depending upon what the team wants or needs to do. Attitude and playing style is perfect for a Carroll Defense.

Jaxon Smith-Njigba, WR
The best route runner in the draft. Is probably a top ten route runner in the NFL today. Perfect as a slot receiver.

Derick Hall, OLB/DE
Physical player who can set the edge and provide some pass rush

Zach Charbonnet, RB
Smooth and powerful runner. Always falls forward and breaks a lot of tackles. Good hands and good route runner as a bonus.

Anthony Bradford, G
Powerful run blocker and can really nullify the inside pass rush. He has a good possibility of starting ahead of Phil Haynes.

Cameron Young, NT/DT
Solid run stopper up the middle. Not as much of a pass rush but we are less likely to be gashed up the middle on run plays like we have the last couple of years.

Mike Morris, DE
He dominated at times and faded away at times, but with some consistent coaching he might just be a real find.

Olusegun Oluwatimi, C
Award winning Center. Has small hands, but that's not been a bother to him. Could be a real find and might challenge Evan Brown to start.

Jerrick Reed II, S
Another DB like Witherspoon in attitude. Arrives at the ball carrier at times like a wrecking ball

Kenny McIntosh, RB
Strong runner, great route runner with soft hands, powerful and physical. An upgrade from Travis Homer but maybe not as good on Special Teams.



So what do all of these players outside of Smith-Njigba and maybe Oluwatimi have in common?
They are all supremely physical players who can and have set the tone on both sides of the ball.
That's what this draft seems to have been about. Increasing the talent level and creating that tough attitude and style that we haven't seen since the end of the LoB.

Who has a good chance to start?
Witherspoon, Njigba for sure, Bradford and Young probables, and Oluwatimi quite possible.
Depending on what they do with the Safety position relative to the excess salaries, Jerrick Reed II might also end up starting.
So I see at least 2 starters, probably 3 or 4 and maybe 5 from this draft class.
It was a good draft.

[Hawktawk]

I lost track a bit in the later rounds , was singing kareoki during most of day 2 . I have a few thoughts though .

Love the corner . Riv pointed out that draft day hilights always look good but this guy you only need a few plays . Same for this reciever . Geno has got to be happy as a pig in slop not only getting this guy but a huge vote of confidence with the organization standing Pat . Geno and Drew 1and 2.


Will Levis dropped for a reason or 3 . Some concern over the toe . Some concern over his quirky personality , self aggrandizement beating his shirtless chest . Did skipping his bowl matter ? I’ve been educated on how many players do that now but not too many top QBs . One more comment on Levis. Vrabel made some comments to the press after picking him. “ Ryan Tannehill is our starter . Malik Willis is our backup. Levis is 3rd string and will have to work for everything he gets . “ sounds like coach thinks someone needs to humble themselves .

I’m fine we stood Pat . We can win with Geno , now. It’s a win now strategy .

Which leads to the 4th pick the back from ucla.
I don’t have amnesia regarding our running back room . Last year we were full bore with 2 elite backs . Penny gets hurt and Walker played very well along with the entire team in 4 straight wins. Vs Tampa in the mudhole he was useless with his juky lateral style . Not the same excuse but not much better vs the raiders . Then the first Rams game one explosive run , one other carry with a swearing match with Geno in between and out for 2 or 3 games with some soft tissue sprain Pete couldn’t even describe .

In those games we had an injured homer and injured DeeJay and lost them . Not sure we won a game neither Walker or Penny played in . KW returned to play mostly great other then dissapearing second half of KC . But then the playoff game he was quite effective in the first half then seemed not to be on the field much in the second half . Hurt ? gassed ? Upset about something , I’ve seen enough of Dee Jay trying to carry the load . He can’t .

Love watching KW . I don’t trust him . He’s no beast mode. I think bringing in a top shelf back is smart . Even the Georgia kid looks interesting . Can’t really speak intelligently to the rest of the draft but I feel like it was a good solid one overall . A bit surprising . Win now draft .

[NorthHawk]

It’s not a win now draft.

We did the win now strategy for a number of years when we traded for veterans like Clowney, Richardson and Adams.
Win now is trading away the future for established veterans.
This is a rebuild and addition of talent. It’s a continuation of last years draft and will take next years draft to set us up for a strong run two years from now. We have a lot of unproven talent that has to play a year or two to really hit their stride to the point of a championship run. Even though we have added the talent it remains to be seen if our Defense can actually improve and if it doesn’t, will we return to the old 4-3 under defense that we succeeded with in the past? Once that has been determined we can add talent that fits.

[RiverDog]

It’s not a win now draft.

We did the win now strategy for a number of years when we traded for veterans like Clowney, Richardson and Adams.
Win now is trading away the future for established veterans.

This is a rebuild and addition of talent. It’s a continuation of last years draft and will take next years draft to set us up for a strong run two years from now. We have a lot of unproven talent that has to play a year or two to really hit their stride to the point of a championship run. Even though we have added the talent it remains to be seen if our Defense can actually improve and if it doesn’t, will we return to the old 4-3 under defense that we succeeded with in the past? Once that has been determined we can add talent that fits.

I agree with this thought. Another example is our selection of Jaxon with a #20 overall, a receiver destined to start out as a #3 receiver, is definitely not the trademark of a win now approach. He's obviously expected to be Lockett's replacement in a couple of years.

It the past 2 drafts, we had 9 selections. In 2021, we had just three because Pete was still under the illusion that we were just a player or two away from another championship team. He seems to have experienced a cold slap in the face.

[Hawktawk]

Its win now. Geno and Drew is win now. If you think you're 3 years away you take Levis.
We were a playoff team last year and led at the half in our wild card loss. Were at least the second best team in our division and SF really has no Idea what they are doing at QB. The wideout we drafted will probably be on the field 40% of the time.Sounds like the style of the back is more vertical, a nice change up without wasting a play giving it to Dee Jay.

Its not a rebuild. Its a reload. Here you all go again doubting Pete, Geno, John. Id think you would learn. We need a little more D is all.We lost games scoring 23, 24 (twice) 32, and 34. A little defense and a little more pop in our offense we will be fine, could well win the division.
Im going with 11-6 NFC West champs then let's see. Pete isn't sticking around for a rebuild. WIN NOW BABY

[Aseahawkfan]

I would have liked a high quality DT to be available at 5, but Jalen Carter looked like snakeoil to me. Glad we didn't take him. If a better DT had been available, doubt he would have lasted until 5. We took the best guy available at 5. Witherspoon looks like a Seattle secondary player.

Not sure bout Njigba because he is a one year wonder near as I can tell. But it was a hell of a year. He does look like an amazing player when healthy. It is risky taking a guy with one healthy full year under his belt. He'll either be a steal or an injury bust in my opinion. We'll see how much he wants to make it in the NFL.

Derick had Seahawk written all over him. Only way he fails is lack of talent or injury. That dude doesn't know the word quit. He looks as physical as they come. That guy is going to give us everything he's got all the time. If he has the talent to make it at the NFL level, he's going to make it.

Charbonnett looked like a solid add to the RB room.

4th round and later players are usually depth at best. Not expecting much from these players. If one or two work out, that will be great.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

It’s Column A and Column B. Witherspoon, JSN, Bradford, Young, Charbonnet, and the DE from Michigan will contribute immediately. Last years class has a year under their belt. The team is arguably more talented this year than last and they managed to go 9-8. They’ll legit challenge the NFCW and I think it’s another WC appearance this year. Of course, need to see that happen, but I think they have an eye on a quick turn around.

[Aseahawkfan]

It’s Column A and Column B. Witherspoon, JSN, Bradford, Young, Charbonnet, and the DE from Michigan will contribute immediately. Last years class has a year under their belt. The team is arguably more talented this year than last and they managed to go 9-8. They’ll legit challenge the NFCW and I think it’s another WC appearance this year. Of course, need to see that happen, but I think they have an eye on a quick turn around.

If the run defense gets turned around, we can take the division. If not, wild card likely at best.

[NorthHawk]

Its win now. Geno and Drew is win now. If you think you're 3 years away you take Levis.
We were a playoff team last year and led at the half in our wild card loss. Were at least the second best team in our division and SF really has no Idea what they are doing at QB. The wideout we drafted will probably be on the field 40% of the time.Sounds like the style of the back is more vertical, a nice change up without wasting a play giving it to Dee Jay.

Its not a rebuild. Its a reload. Here you all go again doubting Pete, Geno, John. Id think you would learn. We need a little more D is all.We lost games scoring 23, 24 (twice) 32, and 34. A little defense and a little more pop in our offense we will be fine, could well win the division.
Im going with 11-6 NFC West champs then let's see. Pete isn't sticking around for a rebuild. WIN NOW BABY

Pete thinks he can win every year, but we’re no where near to competing even with this draft. It does set us up for e few years down the road. And we still don’t have a franchise QB.

check this link out:

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/1652419991830921222

[NorthHawk]

It’s Column A and Column B. Witherspoon, JSN, Bradford, Young, Charbonnet, and the DE from Michigan will contribute immediately. Last years class has a year under their belt. The team is arguably more talented this year than last and they managed to go 9-8. They’ll legit challenge the NFCW and I think it’s another WC appearance this year. Of course, need to see that happen, but I think they have an eye on a quick turn around.

I think SF is still the class of the division. They spent a huge amount of draft capital on building their defense over the last 4 or 5 years and have an established roster of stars. Along with Shanahan creating a more than serviceable Offense (even without a superstar QB) they are going to be tough to beat. The only things that might derail them are a setback after losing DeMarko Ryan as DC or injuries to critical positions.
Our defense with the new players has yet to prove itself under fire. We had problems last year and will only be able to tell if things have changed after we see them play.

[RiverDog]

Its win now. Geno and Drew is win now. If you think you're 3 years away you take Levis.
We were a playoff team last year and led at the half in our wild card loss. Were at least the second best team in our division and SF really has no Idea what they are doing at QB. The wideout we drafted will probably be on the field 40% of the time.Sounds like the style of the back is more vertical, a nice change up without wasting a play giving it to Dee Jay.

Its not a rebuild. Its a reload. Here you all go again doubting Pete, Geno, John. Id think you would learn. We need a little more D is all.We lost games scoring 23, 24 (twice) 32, and 34. A little defense and a little more pop in our offense we will be fine, could well win the division.
Im going with 11-6 NFC West champs then let's see. Pete isn't sticking around for a rebuild. WIN NOW BABY

We weren't taking Levis, nor was anyone else, which is why he fell all the way out of the first round. Our failure to take him is no indication whatsoever that we're not still in rebuild mode.

And please, don't lecture anyone on learning, Mr. 10 win minimum.

[obiken]

I think SF is still the class of the division. They spent a huge amount of draft capital on building their defense over the last 4 or 5 years and have an established roster of stars. Along with Shanahan creating a more than serviceable Offense (even without a superstar QB) they are going to be tough to beat. The only things that might derail them are a setback after losing DeMarko Ryan as DC or injuries to critical positions.
Our defense with the new players has yet to prove itself under fire. We had problems last year and will only be able to tell if things have changed after we see them play.

The problem is the QB position NH, shockingly I know, but I have to agree with Talky on this one, I think we should wind the West, especially given their QB situation. 11-6? We wont know till the schedules come out. River has a good point on the QBOTF, the problem is there wasnt much left and there is 0 way the Cards were going to deal with a division Rival that help put them in that position.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

Pete Carroll and John Schneider came in and made 200+ roster moves and managed to win the wild card against an 11-5 team their first season. Second season was a miss, but 3rd season was another WC win and a very close loss to Atlanta the the 4th season was an all the way.

Last year’s roster was much better than the 2010 roster. This team is no where near the type of rebuild that was undertaken back then.