Playoff Situation

[RiverDog]

Just a glance at how it stands now in the NFC:

Both the Eagles (11-1) and the Cowboys (10-4) have qualified for the playoffs with one of them to be crowned the NFC East Champ. The Niners and Vikings have sewed up the NFC West and NFC North respectively. Someone will eventually win the NFC South. That takes care of 5 of the 7 seeds.

With their win last night, the Giants are currently sitting in the 6 hole with an 8-5-1 record. The G-men's remaining schedule is at Minny, vs. Indy, and at Philly. That last game vs. Philly might be a meaningless game to the Eagles as if they beat the Cowboys next Sunday, they'll clinch HFA with two games remaining.

The Commanders (7-6-1) have a slender 1/2 game lead over us and the Lions for the 7th and final seed, both with 7-7 records, and 1.5 game lead over the Packers, assuming they beat the Rams tonight and would go to 6-8. A loss tonight would virtually eliminate them. The Commanders control their own destiny. Their last 3 games are at the Niners then at home against the Browns and Cowboys. There's a chance that last game could be meaningless to the 'Pukes.

We do have an advantage in that we have the tiebreaker over the Lions. Our next opponent, the Chiefs, have already clinched their division but are in a scramble for HFA with the Bills and Bengals. They'll still be pushing hard. The Jets will likely be desperate by the time they come to our house as they're still in the middle of the playoff hunt for a wild card, and the Rams, eliminated from the playoffs, won't have a thing to lose.

Thoughts?

[c_hawkbob]

Playoffs? Don't talk about - playoffs? You kidding me? Playoffs?! I just hope we can win a game!...

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

Our lack of depth and reliance on young players (2nd most snaps for rookies) is going to make the playoff push difficult for sure. Winning 2 of the last 3 is going to be tough, and even then, we'll need some help. Can we do it? Yes. Will I be surprised if we fall short. No.

[RiverDog]

Playoffs? Don't talk about - playoffs? You kidding me? Playoffs?! I just hope we can win a game!...

It isn't as funny without the close-up of Jim Mora Sr. and that look in his eyes.

[RiverDog]

Our lack of depth and reliance on young players (2nd most snaps for rookies) is going to make the playoff push difficult for sure. Winning 2 of the last 3 is going to be tough, and even then, we'll need some help. Can we do it? Yes. Will I be surprised if we fall short. No.

The Chiefs haven't looked all that great against their last two opponents (Donkeys and Texans), both weaklings that they should have beaten easily. I'm not predicting an upset, but they do seem a little more vulnerable than they were a few weeks ago. However, their last two games were on the road, and they have one of the larger HFA's in the game, so who knows. At least on paper, it will be our toughest game of the season.

Both the Jets and Rams will present a challenge. It will be interesting to see how the Rams play in Lambeau vs. the Packers tonight.

[NorthHawk]

I don't think anyone wants to play the Lions at this point. They're one of those team on the rise and although not yet contenders, can be dangerous.
If they have another good draft and FA, they might no longer be thought of as doormats.

[Hawktawk]

I don't think anyone wants to play the Lions at this point. They're one of those team on the rise and although not yet contenders, can be dangerous.
If they have another good draft and FA, they might no longer be thought of as doormats .

That lions win looks pretty good as does the giants win now .
I dunno . We had 4 weeks when we could have beat most teams and lost so many 1 score games with no run defense or run game before and after that stretch .
Most frustrating damn season ever , swept by the worst division in the league . Annoying

If they are true to recent form they will be plucky and lose , maybe all 3 as Geno struggles under the weight of no protection or run game , no Lockett, no defense to get extra posessions and a stigma that he can’t carry the team despite one of the top scoring offenses . It would cost him a lot of money .

It’s kind of what I expect . But if that team finds the magic they left in Munich they could be dangerous for any opponent .

[NorthHawk]

We caught a lot of teams early that have stepped up the latter part of the season.
The Giants were playing well at the time, but the Lions hadn’t yet hit their stride and our opponents win % isn’t that good.
We seemed to be in mid season form before our opponents.

[Hawktawk]

We caught a lot of teams early that have stepped up the latter part of the season.
The Giants were playing well at the time, but the Lions hadn’t yet hit their stride and our opponents win % isn’t that good.
We seemed to be in mid season form before our opponents.

Unless I’m mistaken the Lions scored over 40 on us and did similar things to other teams offensively . They have been a dangerous team most of the year . The Giants were 6-1 and we were 4-3 . I don’t grade any win or loss this year . Ask Dallas

I guess our peak was week 9. Let’s see . Not writing back yet :

[Aseahawkfan]

I expect to lose to the Chiefs.

I think we can beat the Jets and Rams and finish 9-7. Whether that's enough, who knows. Pete should use this opportunity to get his guys thinking about what it takes to win and get in the playoffs at this point.

I'll be fine if we make the playoffs and I'll be fine if we miss them. Team looks on a good path if they can fix the D-line and upgrade the middle of the O-line some.

[mykc14]

I expect to lose to the Chiefs.

I think we can beat the Jets and Rams and finish 9-7. Whether that's enough, who knows. Pete should use this opportunity to get his guys thinking about what it takes to win and get in the playoffs at this point.

I'll be fine if we make the playoffs and I'll be fine if we miss them. Team looks on a good path if they can fix the D-line and upgrade the middle of the O-line some.

I don't know if we are on a good path or not. We are pathetic against the run and I think we are actually in trouble because PC is going to be able to look at this season and say "we are close" because we will either make the playoffs or just miss out. The reality is we are not close. Our defense is TERRIBLE, nowhere near where it needs to be. We have a serious lack of talent in the defense at the DL and LB positions as well as the interior OL. I don't want PC to think we are close. I want him to make some hard choices. Our Safety spending is way out of whack and needs to be fixed. The reality is we are a 4 or 5 win team who has been buoyed by great QB play and an aberration of a month of good defense. This is why I didn't want us to sign Geno- no I didn't think he was going to be this good, but he played well enough to get us close to the playoffs when we shouldn't be. Just missing the playoffs is the worst case scenario for this team- barely making the playoffs is almost as bad. Either way we all know that PC will turn look at this as us being close. Just like he as every year since 2017. The reality is we needed a rebuild a few years ago and he didn't do it, instead he panicked which led to the worst trade in franchise history (Adams). We need a rebuild that is going to take at least two years and we could be really starting year 2 next year, but instead we will draft, attack free agency, and sing our own guys from the perspective that we are close... which we aren't.

[RiverDog]

I expect to lose to the Chiefs.

I think we can beat the Jets and Rams and finish 9-7. Whether that's enough, who knows. Pete should use this opportunity to get his guys thinking about what it takes to win and get in the playoffs at this point.

I'll be fine if we make the playoffs and I'll be fine if we miss them. Team looks on a good path if they can fix the D-line and upgrade the middle of the O-line some.

I can pretty much assure you that we won't be finishing 9-7. It's a 17 game schedule.

[Aseahawkfan]

I can pretty much assure you that we won't be finishing 9-7. It's a 17 game schedule.

My bad. 9 and 8.

[Aseahawkfan]

I don't know if we are on a good path or not. We are pathetic against the run and I think we are actually in trouble because PC is going to be able to look at this season and say "we are close" because we will either make the playoffs or just miss out. The reality is we are not close. Our defense is TERRIBLE, nowhere near where it needs to be. We have a serious lack of talent in the defense at the DL and LB positions as well as the interior OL. I don't want PC to think we are close. I want him to make some hard choices. Our Safety spending is way out of whack and needs to be fixed. The reality is we are a 4 or 5 win team who has been buoyed by great QB play and an aberration of a month of good defense. This is why I didn't want us to sign Geno- no I didn't think he was going to be this good, but he played well enough to get us close to the playoffs when we shouldn't be. Just missing the playoffs is the worst case scenario for this team- barely making the playoffs is almost as bad. Either way we all know that PC will turn look at this as us being close. Just like he as every year since 2017. The reality is we needed a rebuild a few years ago and he didn't do it, instead he panicked which led to the worst trade in franchise history (Adams). We need a rebuild that is going to take at least two years and we could be really starting year 2 next year, but instead we will draft, attack free agency, and sing our own guys from the perspective that we are close... which we aren't.

I gotta disagree with you. The way Geno and the offense played this year, I think you fix the front seven and we're easily a playoff and Super Bowl contending team in the current NFL. I don't see any super dominant teams. If we can get the D-line powered up and stop the run, the young buck CBs will hold against the pass and let Geno and the offense play conservative, grinding, productive offense and we'll make the playoffs.

Do I think Pete should go off course and start trading and selling out in free agency? No. I think he should stick with the rebuild using draft capital and opportunistic free agency moves like he did when he and John first got here. Then build up for a run.

One good draft next year and I think we're competitive again. This isn't the era of Peyton and Brady. This is a wide open era with no dominant teams and every team a good draft or two away from competitiveness.

[Hawktawk]

We are competetive this year . Other than week 2 every loss has come down to the final possession or 2 . The mysterious 4 game win streak we were as hot as anyone , as good as anyone . Running and stopping the run . 4 straight wins by double digits . Somehow it disappeared without a trace .
It’s the most confusing thing ever . Had someone said pre season we will be 7-7 with 3 to play instead of 4-10 mainly because Geno has been damn good I’d not have believed it .
I expected we would run but I was hoping Penny would be here and at a minimum I expected more toughness from Walker as well .
I expected better defense than last year . Good luck on that . My worst biggest miss pre season and in season . I’ll point it out myself just like when 10-7 comes crashing down most likely this weekend .
I think it might be a mistake to throw the baby out with the bath water . Right now I say sign or franchise Geno . Try to keep Lock if he’s cheap . Draft front 7 beasts and interior O line . Bring back Penny .( Pete updated a couple weeks ago that. Penny is ahead of schedule and had told him he was pushing to get back late this season . Pete wasn’t optimistic but I think if we had Rashaad it’s a different story .

These 3 games will determine a lot , win 3 will likely mean 4 . Lose 1 9-8 ? 8-9? Lose them all 7-10 same record as last year ? After starting 6-3 ? Might be on Jodi watch again and I’m not sure how I would feel about it .

[NorthHawk]

With this being such a weird year with some teams being unexpectedly better and others unexpectedly worse, it's made it difficult to really make a solid prediction.
We could as easily end up 10-7 as we could 7-10.
Our remaining games are KC on the road and the Jets and Rams at home. We would expect to lose to KC but who knows what will happen? We've often played better on the road than at home this year.
Speaking of playing at home, it hasn't been as big of an advantage as it used to be over the last few years. Teams are regularly coming here and beating us so that makes it even harder to predict.
So we should win at least 1 game against the Rams which would give us a minimum of 8 wins but I think it's a tossup whether we end up with a winning season or not. The Run game has to come back
from the dead for it to happen and the Defense has to start playing better as well. Other than a few game stretch it has been pretty bad this year.

[RiverDog]

With this being such a weird year with some teams being unexpectedly better and others unexpectedly worse, it's made it difficult to really make a solid prediction.
We could as easily end up 10-7 as we could 7-10.
Our remaining games are KC on the road and the Jets and Rams at home. We would expect to lose to KC but who knows what will happen? We've often played better on the road than at home this year.
Speaking of playing at home, it hasn't been as big of an advantage as it used to be over the last few years. Teams are regularly coming here and beating us so that makes it even harder to predict.
So we should win at least 1 game against the Rams which would give us a minimum of 8 wins but I think it's a tossup whether we end up with a winning season or not. The Run game has to come back
from the dead for it to happen and the Defense has to start playing better as well. Other than a few game stretch it has been pretty bad this year.

The 12's still haven't fully adapted this team as it did the LOB. As I said earlier, I'd never seen as many opposing fans in our house as I did at the Raiders game, and last Thursday, you could hear a large number of very vocal Niners fans. And even when there isn't that many opposing fans, the 12's just don't make the same degree of noise that we used to. Just like the team we root for, we've developed this mediocre, been there, done that attitude. My buddy commented that they need to empty out the jails and mental wards and give them free tickets to the game. Teams don't fear coming up here like they used to.

[Hawktawk]

HFA is bunk for the most part . We were winning 6 to 8 at home in thr glory year of Holmy and the championship era with Carrol and Russel and the LOB. I sat with my buddy at CLink in 2013 and watched us pick Carson Palmer 4 times . Unfortunately Russ completed a whopping 44%. Tebow #s. We wasted a Malcolm smith interception return to the 5 when Hauchka missed a 22 yard field goal . The game ended with a Russ desperation heave to Baldwin that was ruled a pick that bounced off his forearm as he slid on the ground . You could see the rubber flying up where it hit the ground on replay but oh well they can’t get ‘em all right .
A month later we were world champs .
When I went to beast quake on half price tickets at the 50 there were nearly as many saints fans as Hawks fans and a lot of them were wearing brown bags . But……still had an earthquake . You make plays the crowd gets loud . Like Denver . Your game watching us get trucked in the run , can’t run ourselves what’s the use losing your voice ?

Besides there could be 70 k HTs in there and I can outshout any 10 broncos and proved it several times in sluggers till they quit trying ……and we wouldn’t win playing the lame ass ball we’re playing .

[NorthHawk]

HFA is a real thing for some teams. I'm not sure it's a deciding factor these days but when it was, some teams would come here and already be psyched out to a degree and with the difference between winning and losing being so small in the NFL,
it made a difference. False starts and not being able to hear the QB can be the difference between a win and a loss. So sure, HF can be a difference maker.

[mykc14]

I gotta disagree with you. The way Geno and the offense played this year, I think you fix the front seven and we're easily a playoff and Super Bowl contending team in the current NFL. I don't see any super dominant teams. If we can get the D-line powered up and stop the run, the young buck CBs will hold against the pass and let Geno and the offense play conservative, grinding, productive offense and we'll make the playoffs.

Do I think Pete should go off course and start trading and selling out in free agency? No. I think he should stick with the rebuild using draft capital and opportunistic free agency moves like he did when he and John first got here. Then build up for a run.

One good draft next year and I think we're competitive again. This isn't the era of Peyton and Brady. This is a wide open era with no dominant teams and every team a good draft or two away from competitiveness.

I hope you are right, I just haven't seen that with PC recently. We have been a bad defense for the past 4 years ranking 28th, 27th, 21st, and 25th and before that we were middle of the road. If PC and JS can build like they did when they first got here then I would agree with you but they have been making moves like we are one player away from winning the SB for the past 5 years when we haven't been. It seems like we have a lot of cap room but if we only have 33 guys under contract and we would need to resign Geno. We really aren't going to have a ton to spend in free agency. The bottom line is our defense is bad and has been for a long time. I do agree that in today's NFL you can get good quickly, but you can also get bad quickly- the NFL is designed for parody and we are/have been smack in the middle of that for the past 5 years. We need an infusion of good, young talent on the DL and a rebuild year this year would have done that. A good example is how much Bruce Irvin has been playing. Why? Is he going to help us in the future? We should be playing Mafe more. I do like what our secondary looks like, but we are going to be paying 2 safeties 36 million next year and they can't dump Adams contract so we are either going to pay both 18 million or dump Diggs without an obvious replacement. Neal has played well but that's at SS. Our LB's aren't great either. Is that the system or the poor DL play? We have to take major steps forward on defense to be a legitimate contender. Offensively we look OK, but we can't run the ball.

The bottom line is we have a head coach who's philosophy centers on being able to run the ball and stop the run neither of which we are able to do well and we haven't done well for some time now. What makes you think that is actually going to change without elite talent infused into the lineup?

[mykc14]

We are competetive this year . Other than week 2 every loss has come down to the final possession or 2 . The mysterious 4 game win streak we were as hot as anyone , as good as anyone . Running and stopping the run . 4 straight wins by double digits . Somehow it disappeared without a trace .
It’s the most confusing thing ever . Had someone said pre season we will be 7-7 with 3 to play instead of 4-10 mainly because Geno has been damn good I’d not have believed it .
I expected we would run but I was hoping Penny would be here and at a minimum I expected more toughness from Walker as well .
I expected better defense than last year . Good luck on that . My worst biggest miss pre season and in season . I’ll point it out myself just like when 10-7 comes crashing down most likely this weekend .
I think it might be a mistake to throw the baby out with the bath water . Right now I say sign or franchise Geno . Try to keep Lock if he’s cheap . Draft front 7 beasts and interior O line . Bring back Penny .( Pete updated a couple weeks ago that. Penny is ahead of schedule and had told him he was pushing to get back late this season . Pete wasn’t optimistic but I think if we had Rashaad it’s a different story .

These 3 games will determine a lot , win 3 will likely mean 4 . Lose 1 9-8 ? 8-9? Lose them all 7-10 same record as last year ? After starting 6-3 ? Might be on Jodi watch again and I’m not sure how I would feel about it .

I'm not saying we throw the baby out with the bathwater either. I agree that we should commit to Geno at this point as well. Hopefully that allows us to pick a DT early, but at the end of the day our defense and run game are so bad that we can't be taken seriously as SB contenders. We need a serious influx of talent in the DL, LB's, and Interior OL. That is a lot of pieces that need to come together to be really good, probably not realistic to put that together in one off-season, which means that we are at least two years away from hopefully being good enough. If we are going to ride with Geno I think we need to really look at signing him to a 3 year contract and hoping that we draft well and sign the right guys over the next few years, but I don't think we are nearly as close to the SB as our record might suggest. We have played a very weak schedule and will probably miss the playoffs. We don't do well the the things that our head coach has supposedly build us to do well.

[Aseahawkfan]

I don't want to direct this to mykc as I know I'm preaching to the choir and he knows the defensive talent along the D-line is not good enough. So I'm going to make this general.

If Pete and John don't fix the D-line, we won't compete and their jobs will be on the line. If they don't know this, then they don't deserve to have their jobs. If they keep missing on D-line, then we'll have to bring someone else in who won't miss. That's the reality of our situation.

Pete and John are on the clock and that clock is winding down. They have to start hitting on D-line like they have other places this last draft. Russell's gone. They can't blame him anymore like Hawktawk likes to do. It's on Pete now. Geno played well enough to go to the playoffs. Pete's defense did not. Whose fault is it when the expert defensive head coach has a crap defense? Last year according to Hawktawk it was Ken Norton's Jrs fault, whose fault is it this year? The rookie D-coordinator Hurtt or the veteran defensive coach Pete Carroll who calls the shots without the toxic QB? Addition by subtraction, right? How is that addition by subtraction adding up? On defense it looks to me like Carroll is failing to get the talent he needs to execute the defensive game plan.

Russ is bombing in Denver. Pete ain't looking that great in Seattle either because he has not fixed this defense even with the promising young rooks in the secondary. If Pete and John can't get the D-line fixed and fixed fast, they need to be sent packing within a year or two.

[RiverDog]

If Pete and John can't get the D-line fixed and fixed fast, they need to be sent packing within a year or two.

I'm not even going to qualify that by saying "a year or two". The situation our defense is in is damn embarrassing for a coach who is supposed to be the GOAT when it comes to knowing how to build a defense.

I posted this in another thread, but it bears repeating in this one. Going backwards, here's a list of Pete's defenses since he's been with us ranked by total yards:

2022 (thru 14 games): 29th
2021: 28th
2020: 22nd
2019: 26th
2018: 16th
2017: 11th
2016: 5th
2015: 2nd
2014: 1st
2013: 1st
2012: 4th
2011: 9th
2010: 27th

Pete's had plenty of time to rebuild the defense. At some point, we have to come to the conclusion that it's not going to get any better and start holding him accountable instead of letting him continue to throw defensive coordinators into the volcano.

[NorthHawk]

In a year or two will Pete still be here?
At 71, it’s always going to be a topic of discussion and in 2 years will he still want to coach when he’s not being successful?
To me, he’s looked really haggard the last few post game conferences and not like he’s enjoying it.

[RiverDog]

In a year or two will Pete still be here?
At 71, it’s always going to be a topic of discussion and in 2 years will he still want to coach when he’s not being successful?
To me, he’s looked really haggard the last few post game conferences and not like he’s enjoying it.

Yeah, this losing streak has to be killing him. Has he ever lost 4 out of 5 at any point of his coaching career? If he has, it's been a long time ago.

I'm still not advocating that we can him as I want to hold to my personal pledge of waiting until the end of the season before I pass judgment, but this looks like just another mediocre, .500ish team that has become his trademark since the end of the LOB.

[RiverDog]

HFA is bunk for the most part . We were winning 6 to 8 at home in thr glory year of Holmy and the championship era with Carrol and Russel and the LOB. I sat with my buddy at CLink in 2013 and watched us pick Carson Palmer 4 times . Unfortunately Russ completed a whopping 44%. Tebow #s. We wasted a Malcolm smith interception return to the 5 when Hauchka missed a 22 yard field goal . The game ended with a Russ desperation heave to Baldwin that was ruled a pick that bounced off his forearm as he slid on the ground . You could see the rubber flying up where it hit the ground on replay but oh well they can’t get ‘em all right .
A month later we were world champs .
When I went to beast quake on half price tickets at the 50 there were nearly as many saints fans as Hawks fans and a lot of them were wearing brown bags . But……still had an earthquake . You make plays the crowd gets loud . Like Denver . Your game watching us get trucked in the run , can’t run ourselves what’s the use losing your voice ?

Besides there could be 70 k HTs in there and I can outshout any 10 broncos and proved it several times in sluggers till they quit trying ……and we wouldn’t win playing the lame ass ball we’re playing .

I'm not sure how often you've attended Hawk home games, but I make it over there at least once a season if not 2 or 3 times a season, and it's simply not the same that it used to be. Anyone that has been a long time fan like me will agree. You're in denial if you can't see and hear the difference.

Here's a copy and paste of some comments made from another forum that I frequent that was discussing the subject, all from different posters, and a near unanimous opinion that the atmosphere is much different than it used to be:

I was at the game (vs. Niners last Thursday) and it felt more like a home game (for the Niners). Seattle fans didn’t show up like they use to anymore.

Yes, it was noticeable too. There were times when we were on D I could hear the chants for Defense. And even stranger for that stadium, I could hear Purdy's cadence on quite a few snaps.

yes, it was embarrassing. Our crowd is garbage now. zero seat etiquette, constantly getting up and going back and for during the game. Not loud at all. The amount of SF fans there was embarrassing, and they were LOUD. The days of crazy loud fans and intimidation factor are over.

I was actually thinking last night that I can’t hear the crowd on my TV and I was able to hear Purdy go through the cadence. That’s just bad.

Can't blame people for not wanting to lose their voice for this defense, especially after last week.

It's clear the 12's have mailed it in. From the ho hum 12 flag raisers to the late arriving, apathetic crowd who barely cares to scream and yell, it's pretty bad.

It sounded damn quiet on TV...didnt affect Purdy at all.

Whats embarrassing is that there are more people from CA, then there are Seattleites.. they suck the bounty of our NW and root from whence they came from.. wish they would just go back home.

The yuppies took over the stadium and made it quiet years ago, this is not new. It is getting worse though that's for sure.

I live across the country and so I watched it on TV. It seemed pretty loud when we were on OFFENSE. Idiot Seahawk fans or just a lot of 9er fans at the game?

an embarrassing amount of 9er fans and they were loud.

While what we have at Lumen is maybe 50% of what it used to be, it's still better than many stadiums across the country. National media and many opposing players still consider this THE most loudest place to play in the NFL to this day, but that may be more of reputation and history than current reality.

There's lots more where that came from, and they all say the same thing.

[Aseahawkfan]

I'm not even going to qualify that by saying "a year or two". The situation our defense is in is damn embarrassing for a coach who is supposed to be the GOAT when it comes to knowing how to build a defense.

I posted this in another thread, but it bears repeating in this one. Going backwards, here's a list of Pete's defenses since he's been with us ranked by total yards:

2022 (thru 14 games): 29th
2021: 28th
2020: 22nd
2019: 26th
2018: 16th
2017: 11th
2016: 5th
2015: 2nd
2014: 1st
2013: 1st
2012: 4th
2011: 9th
2010: 27th

Pete's had plenty of time to rebuild the defense. At some point, we have to come to the conclusion that it's not going to get any better and start holding him accountable instead of letting him continue to throw defensive coordinators into the volcano.

Pete ain't the GOAT of defensive coaching, but he's up there with the great defensive minds of the league, especially so in the modern day.

Who would be the best D-coordinator of all time? Knoll or Landry? I know Landry wrote the book on NFL defenses. A lot of his concepts are still used to this day. Who are the great D-coordinators? Bill B is one. Buddy Ryan built that weird scheme they used in Chicago to amazing effect.

[Aseahawkfan]

Yeah, this losing streak has to be killing him. Has he ever lost 4 out of 5 at any point of his coaching career? If he has, it's been a long time ago.

I'm still not advocating that we can him as I want to hold to my personal pledge of waiting until the end of the season before I pass judgment, but this looks like just another mediocre, .500ish team that has become his trademark since the end of the LOB.

Russ kept us competitive when the LOB fell apart as much as you don't want to admit it. LoB fell apart around 2017 to 2018. Russ kept the team chugging along with a 10-6, 11-5, and 12-4 record until he was hurt in 2021 and we ended with a 7 and 10 record.

Geno isn't Prime Russ as good as he's been. Pete's been letting this defense fall off a cliff for years now. I hope next draft he can get it turned around. I hate having this this weak ass defense.

[RiverDog]

Pete ain't the GOAT of defensive coaching, but he's up there with the great defensive minds of the league, especially so in the modern day.

Who would be the best D-coordinator of all time? Knoll or Landry? I know Landry wrote the book on NFL defenses. A lot of his concepts are still used to this day. Who are the great D-coordinators? Bill B is one. Buddy Ryan built that weird scheme they used in Chicago to amazing effect.

Well, the GOAT description was a bit of sarcasm.

Tom Landry and Chuck Knoll would rank right up there. They had to build their defenses almost completely through the draft as there was no free agency. For a more contemporary name, Monty Kiffen would have to be mentioned. Pete deserves to be in any conversation that involves great defenses and great defensive minds.

Speaking of Buddy Ryan. I had a truck driver that worked for me whose brother played for Ryan as a defensive tackle when Ryan was at Arizona. He said that Ryan didn't even know the names of his starters.

[Hawktawk]

His record on defenses was pretty amazing till the last few years . We lost Bennett , Avril , Sherman , ET in that time . We had promising guys like Blair get hurt and never come all the way back ( diggs is one this year ) McDowell smashed his skull and apparently destroyed his mind although he was on a talented browns defense till caught jogging nude . Collier was a terrible miss. Waste of a roster spot .
We had horrible luck with injuries throughout the roster on both sides of the ball . terrible time of possession , league worst 3rd down posession most of the last few years . That was Russ . But I was way too hard on Kenny . We lost games last year giving up 13,15,17,at one point prior to the commanders game we were dead last in yards and #5 in scoring or some damn thing . Ken did a damn good job with what he had. I wonder what he might do with these promising kids .

Pete’s teams bend but don’t break . We’re sitting here at 7-7 and have blown games scoring 23-24-32-34 with like 7 rookies starting . We can’t stop the run . We can’t run .

But here they are 5.5 over under in Vegas . Geno listed as the #36 option as a starting qb option pre season , in the 5th category all by himself by highly respected unbiased reporter with Seattle ties mike Sando . Rook tackles . Total rebuild right ? Yeah it kinda is and we’re still 7-7.
Let’s get it on .

[RiverDog]

Pete’s teams bend but don’t break.

Our points defense this season is ranked in exactly the same place as our total yard defense, 29th, so that argument rings pretty hollow.

[Hawktawk]

]

Pete’s teams bend but don’t break.

Our points defense this season is ranked in exactly the same place as our total yard defense, 29th, so that argument rings pretty hollow.[/quote]


This year sure . Prior to that I’d like to see the scoring defense , red zone defense etc . Gonna show stats show them all .


The Lob led is scoring 5 times but yards only twice . We must have done something right on defense prior to this year . Kinda like 2020 22nd in yards on a 12-4 team that Jesus Christ superstar played pretty bad second half of the year .
Nobody’s debating this is the absolute worst defense I’ve ever seen in Seattle . Going to a 3-4 was a monumental failure with our people . Hurtt is not a leader of men and doesn’t deserve another chance barring a run that starts Saturday that’s similar to the 4 game stretch .

[RiverDog]

Nobody’s debating this is the absolute worst defense I’ve ever seen in Seattle . Going to a 3-4 was a monumental failure with our people . Hurtt is not a leader of men and doesn’t deserve another chance barring a run that starts Saturday that’s similar to the 4 game stretch .

So in other words, Pete is nothing more than the piano player in the whorehouse, hammering away at the ivory and singing a gay old song completely oblivious of the constant parade of ladies of the evening and their johns going to the bedrooms upstairs. Is that what you're telling me?

[Aseahawkfan]

So in other words, Pete is nothing more than the piano player in the whorehouse, hammering away at the ivory and singing a gay old song completely oblivious of the constant parade of ladies of the evening and their johns going to the bedrooms upstairs. Is that what you're telling me?

It's Russell's fault.

[RiverDog]

So in other words, Pete is nothing more than the piano player in the whorehouse, hammering away at the ivory and singing a gay old song completely oblivious of the constant parade of ladies of the evening and their johns going to the bedrooms upstairs. Is that what you're telling me?

It's Russell's fault.

Yeah, it was Russell that insisted that Pete sell the farm for Jamal Adams so he could have more weapons on offense.

[Hawktawk]

I’d love to dig back to Adams first year with a record 9.5 sacks by a DB. See how many people were really all that upset . If we had a healthy Jamaal Adams we’d have 9 or ten wins . So sick and tired of it .blah blah blah Adams . Jesus . Nobody’s perfect . Sick and tired of whining unthankful fans that are spoiled rotten . You never had the likes of Pete Carroll and you won’t have another when he’s gone . Terrible fans .
And yeah from about mid 2020 Russ was a big part of the problem if you’re reading this Asea . Yes he was and look at him now .

[trents]

We caught a lot of teams early that have stepped up the latter part of the season.
The Giants were playing well at the time, but the Lions hadn’t yet hit their stride and our opponents win % isn’t that good.
We seemed to be in mid season form before our opponents.

We peaked too early.

[obiken]

We peaked too early.

Peaked? come on, we beat bad teams and no good teams, there was no rise and fall.

[RiverDog]

I’d love to dig back to Adams first year with a record 9.5 sacks by a DB. See how many people were really all that upset . If we had a healthy Jamaal Adams we’d have 9 or ten wins . So sick and tired of it .blah blah blah Adams . Jesus . Nobody’s perfect . Sick and tired of whining unthankful fans that are spoiled rotten . You never had the likes of Pete Carroll and you won’t have another when he’s gone . Terrible fans .
And yeah from about mid 2020 Russ was a big part of the problem if you’re reading this Asea . Yes he was and look at him now .

I was rather neutral of the Adams trade, saying that I trusted Pete's judgment, at least when it came to defense, and said back then it had better work, that if it didn't, I was holding Pete accountable. Initially, it looked like a great move as initially, Adams did well. But it was fool's gold, a mirage created by a historically bad pass rush. Adams thrived in a vacuum. With even an average defense, his considerable pass rushing skills is less of an asset. You can't sustain a consistent pass rush by blitzing your safety. Teams figured it out.

As time wore on, it became apparent that Adams was a liability in pass coverage, and his ball skills horrible, not at all like the All Pro safety he was advertised as being. We're lots better off with Ryan Neal in there.

And please, stop with this 'nobody's perfect' rant. No one expected Pete to pump out teams season after season like only Belichick has. But he's had 7 fricking years and 3 DC's to rebuild his defense, and it hasn't happened, if anything, it's gotten worse. How many more years are you giving Pete? One more year? Two? Five? Ten? Or is your love of him unconditional and unlimited?

[Hawktawk]

I’m not sure about Pete myself . I allude to 2020 to demonstrate that as recently as that year the defense played much better down the stretch. And regardless of how the defense was the team made the postseason all but 2 years . Was Russell a huge part of those winning years ? Of course . Duh.
Till mid 2020 then tell me about his big comeback , game winning drive , carry the team . I can’t remember a one after mid 2020. 21 was a mess offensively with defense up and down .

This year we’ve had no defense most games .

Then there’s this mysterious 4 game stretch . Come off getting railed by an H back , smoked like a joint by Taysem hill and the Saints . The refs must have had bong hits pre game . Lose scoring 32. I wanted Hurrts head .

Then ….19-9 over AZ with a fumble in the end zone by Dixon and Geno throwing 1 pick and no TDs. That was some defense . Then the Chargers and you self hating good team bad team fans that was a statement win over a damn solid playoff contending team . Blew them out .

Then the Giants who led the league in rushing at the time and were 6-1. Beat them up , shut down the run .

Then that AZ team that we had beat because they didn’t have Hopkins or their kicker first time , beat them 31-17 the second time . Over that 4 game stretch we had the #1 rush defense , #1 pass rush , Offensive player of the month in Geno , offensive ROTM Ken Walker , defense ROTM in freak . Vegas had us at #6 odds to win the Super Bowl .

Then we went to Munich …………..a total setup . Not awake . Can’t stand up on 1” cleats. Walker falling down trying to cut .

Im curious what compensation the groundskeeper got for turning the field to jello . A Ferrari trying to race in mud . Flags getting picked up . Couldn’t quite overcome it and had 2 weeks to think about it . It would have been better not to have a bye there IMO

It’s no coincidence Tompon and the Bucs have as bad a record as us since coming back to the US and look like a far worse team than us , far worse qb.
Slow bad team with no chance on dry turf . SF 35-TB 7 Brady 2 picks pick 6 .
I detest Roger Goodell. Yaaal like it up the nether region have at it . I don’t .

Say what you will that’s when the season collapsed .

But those players are still on the team for the most part . It’s a 3 game season . If we wind up 7-10 I think it’s all got to be on the table including Pete’s job security . I agree with that .