How about that 2022 Draft?

[RiverDog]

Correction it was a Raiders owner (Al Davis) ....not a Raiders coach who said "Just win baby!"

Al Davis might as well have been the coach for as much meddling as he did.

[TriCitySam]

You can't say it's been a good patch of selecting players and it set us up for a big loss of talent.
The players were often there at positions of need but we either traded down past them or didn't select them - it wasn't a matter of drafting in the last part of the draft as many Pro Bowl/ All Pro players are selected in the 2nd or later.

Not every draft is going to be like 2022, but we should expect to improve the talent level. We didn't during this period of time.

I think rather than looking at Seattle in isolation, you have to look at how we stack up against other teams that drafted in the lower 1/3 like we did. As an example: The Ravens are considered by most to be a "good" drafting team. When I looked at this earlier in the year the Ravens had 53 draft picks from '15 to '21 and Seattle had 54. At that time, 23 of those were still on the Ravens roster, 30 on Seattle's. During that period, 11 of the Ravens draft picks became full time starters (I counted more than 8 games as FT) and Seattle had 15 become starters. Seattle drafted 4 PB players, Baltimore 5. Baltimore also wiffed on more than 1 top end pick. I found a similar story looking at other teams as well - the Packers wiffed on 5 1st and 2nd round picks.

So are we the best drafting team, not saying that. But I am saying drafting is a crap shoot, but when compared to our peers we hold up well. We had some bad years (as ALL do) but we also had some good ones - '15 was a lousy draft year for the league, but came away with Lockett and Frank Clark.

Dave Wyman also did an analysis earlier: https://sports.mynorthwest.com/1608503/ ... raft-well/

[Aseahawkfan]

You can't just look at drafting. You have to look at overall roster management. Drafting is one aspect of roster management. You have free agency, drafting, undrafted free agents, trades, salary cap, scouting, and probably more than a few things I haven't thought of. We have had some weak points in a variety of these areas over the years from badge trades to bad drafting in key areas like O and D-line. Prior to this year our defense was getting progressively worse with no hope in sight. Our CB drafting was terrible since the Legion of Boom collapsed creating huge holes in our passing defense.

Everyone is reenergized right now with the Russ trade and high performing rooks. But this is a multiyear process with nothing less than a Super Bowl being acceptable in Seattle any more. Seattle fans are not content to merely make the playoffs, you gotta win and go all the way or at least advance in the playoffs and show progress.

If we win the Super Bowl, then I guess we can all be happy. Job done for a while at least. But barring that, no Seattle fan is going to continue being happy with the status quo we had with Russ of failure in the playoffs. Whole reason the fan base turned on Pete and Russ was mediocre playoff performance with no advancement. People were down on both Pete and Russ before choosing sides and reaching the point we're at now.

Same thing will happen to Pete and Geno if we don't see playoff progress at least. This year just making the playoffs is enough. That won't be enough next year and definitely not the year after.

[NorthHawk]

That’s exactly correct. Roster mgmt is the key. Along with poor drafting, we traded down past pro bowl players for lesser talent and gave up high draft choices for one year rentals of players we didn’t re-sign after their stint here. It severely deleted the
talent pool over those years to the point we went from a team where others waited for our cuts before the season to being one who looked to others to finish their cuts and still have holes throughout to fill.
Drafting early is only one pick per year, but as we’ve seen, teams are built and solidified by drafting well after the first round and we’ve done a real poor job of talent accumulation until this past year when we stopped playing drafting games by trading down
and again selecting players at positions we need. I hope that strategy continues.

[Hawktawk]

Like TCS said . Tri City Sam is on it .

We’re one of the premier franchises really of the last 2 decades . Unquestionably the Pete and john era was perhaps the second most successful in that time frame . 3 non playoff years since 2010.
But just making the playoffs is mediocrity . Making the playoffs.

There are fan bases , coaches that would sever a limb for that track record . Suddenly winning it all is necessary to say Pete and John are worthy . So much so that on a totally optimistic fact based post about maybe the best draft in NFL history it’s degenerated into a bunch of thankless fans whining about the drafts we didn’t absolutely kill .
Beam me up Scottie .

[tarlhawk]

You can't just look at drafting. You have to look at overall roster management.

You bring up some points that are not related to this post (the 2022 Draft)....you're not the only one to take shots at roster management and like the others yours are opinions just as many of my posts are. We as fans are not GMs and have no "track record" to impress others to make further opinions on our observations.


As an approving fan of what our highly paid and highly skilled GM has helped to create I fail to reason with you and others posting here on why you think you speak for all fans in saying we want nothing short of a super bowl win to gain our favor. Really?


Some people have expressed some pretty dismal views of what must happen to find happiness in their forms of entertainment. I have followed the NFL since the early 70's mainly with the Dolphins and the Seahawks (since the arrival of Pete and John in 2010). I lived here in Wash since 1984 but only watched some Seahawk games to stay abreast of what was going on without relying on ESPN. I enjoyed solid coaching from Don Shula then and Pete Carroll now.


So many good things have been happening throughout our tenure with Pete Carroll at the helm. I respected RW as an exciting player....but let him cook? If that means let him supplant a successful coach and GM and a highly paid Offensive Coordinator? No ....the line was drawn and now he's gone.

But hey this post was about the great 2022 draft we had and I expressed my opinion on why I felt we did so well. Onward and upward! Go Hawks

[RiverDog]

But hey this post was about the great 2022 draft we had and I expressed my opinion on why I felt we did so well.

The OP was a little more broad than just the 2022 draft. From your original post:

Excellent staffing and scouting resources to have prepared our draft once again.

After you said the words "once again", you opened up the discussion to previous drafts.

No one is arguing that the 2022 draft was anything less than a sensational draft. Where the disagreements arise is (1) this was arguably the first time in a number of years that we had such a productive draft and (2) that good drafting is just one component of overall roster management. IMO both of those points are fair topics for a discussion like this.

[I-5]

The OP was a little more broad than just the 2022 draft. From your original post:

Excellent staffing and scouting resources to have prepared our draft once again.

After you said the words "once again", you opened up the discussion to previous drafts.

No one is arguing that the 2022 draft was anything less than a sensational draft. Where the disagreements arise is (1) this was arguably the first time in a number of years that we had such a productive draft and (2) that good drafting is just one component of overall roster management. IMO both of those points are fair topics for a discussion like this.

'Once again' is a clear reference to the beginning of the Carroll-Schneider regime when they had 3 mostly stellar drafts from 2010-2012 that netted the players that won the SB for us in 2013. I looked at those drafts, and I think 2022 is right up there with them.

2010 was stellar in terms of overall quality/quantity (Okung, Thomas, Tate, Thurmond, Kam)
2012 netted 2 possible HOF'ers in Bobby and Russ

Time will tell, but this year's rookie class is astounding in terms of the guys who are already making huge contribution in their rookie year. It doesn't take much research to know that this is the first time we've had 2 rookies being discussed as ROFT on each side of the ball, not to mention pro bowl mentions for 2 offensive linemen. It's a ridiculous class.

Also, our later drafts don't get much respect, but 5 players who were drafted in 2020 are playing well in Brooks, Taylor, Lewis, Parkinson and in a more reserve role, Dallas. And out of our 2018 draft class, every player we drafted is still playing in the NFL (2 on teams with more wins than the Hawks), wth the only 2020 player not in the NFL today is Alex McGough, who is playing in the USFL. Our 2015 was not great but netted 2 stars in Tyler Lockett and Frank Clark.

[tarlhawk]

'Once again' is a clear reference to the beginning of the Carroll-Schneider regime when they had 3 mostly stellar drafts from 2010-2012 that netted the players that won the SB for us in 2013. I looked at those drafts, and I think 2022 is right up there with them.

Also, our later drafts don't get much respect, but 5 players who were drafted in 2020 are playing well in Brooks, Taylor, Lewis, Parkinson and in a more reserve role, Dallas.

Yes ...."Once again" references "repeatable" drafting success whether a draft delivers in quantity or in individual stars....the timing of the draft....our placement in the draft....and if the roster needs quantity or individuals. Its utilized as a strong source of competition not always necessarily as replacements. Its a tool that the GM has his finger on the pulse of and who understands what "contract issues" are on the horizon both short term and long term.


Based on our sustained winning seasons I feel John Schneider has produced at being one of the best GMs. Talent recognition and talent fit is a refined process worked out between John and Pete with other team coaches input. Trusted advice is shared and hectic timing on phones being worked and draft selections being "sent in" to a highly publicized media event known as "Draft Day". I have also in other posts touted the 2020 draft as being representative of a successful draft. Onward and upward! Go Hawks

[NorthHawk]

We didn’t progress as a team in a large part because we didn’t replenish the lost talent.
Trading down is OK, but trading down past players that fit needs and have higher floors for players with lower
floors puts a team in a precarious position. It came back to bite us with us getting very little return for the draft and
trade capital for a number of consecutive years. Ignoring positions of need like Center for about 7 years meant that
the OL could never really work well as a unit and the constant shuffling of OL personnel didn’t help.
It shows this year with us having a relatively stable OL and a competent Center that the group can play well. Too
bad we wasted years by not figuring it out.

[Aseahawkfan]

2022 has been an awesome draft so far. These rooks are unbelievably good.

I'm hoping Pete is back to Win Forever 2.0.

[tarlhawk]

Your center criticism (shared by others) is relevant to our QB play....Justin Britt and Ethan Pocic both 6 ft 6 in and 320 lb range able to absorb/sustain Pass Pro for RW and his penchant for longer play development but their body type/size limited RW passing lane vision. Joey Hunt being shorter 6 ft 2 in and barely 300 lb was a liabilty for bull rushes and pocket collapse so who do you define as excellent pass pro for a QB forced to scramble to see his passing lanes? Austin Blythe looks good with Geno being taller yet mobile enough to be quick strike from the pocket. When strong coverage makes Geno "hang out" to make his progressions....the pocket begins to collapse quickly. RW is a special player for not matching the NFL QB prototype....but his penchant for longer developed plays is difficult to match up an O-line with. Our centers were fine for Geno/Jimmy G. type QBs....just not the QB whose lack of mobility is starting to expose a collapse in performance.

[Old but Slow]

Along that line of thinking, Tarlhawk, RW often left the pocket, so that the offensive line would lose track of him. His style must be a nightmare for linemen.

It is hard to imagine what kind of rookie seasons our new tackles would have had protecting Russell. Probably not so good.

[tarlhawk]

Along that line of thinking, Tarlhawk, RW often left the pocket, so that the offensive line would lose track of him. His style must be a nightmare for linemen.

It is hard to imagine what kind of rookie seasons our new tackles would have had protecting Russell. Probably not so good.

As a fan I appreciated the many exciting cardiac games that RW pulled off with victories. As a fan continuing to study what explains my simple unanswered observations I began to realize certain criticisms of our O-line play seemed unfounded. RW often left the pocket for reasons not so obvious at first....longer extended plays downfield require a difficult lengthy time for the O-line to sustain blocks with modern NFL pass rush specialists being hard to "anchor against" without drawing a holding flag.

Knowing this ....RW bailed on the pocket to buy more time....but refs seem to allow certain types of holding while a QB remains in the pocket but your O-line better not hold any part of your opponents jersey if your QB leaves the pocket....being deemed a runner ....at that point holding flags fly pretty easily then. Russell also bailed the pocket to get sight of passing lanes for him to launch missles further downfield. I became aware of some of this after listening to Doug Baldwin respond to how he knows when to "break off" his route to offer RW an escape pass. He said he knew if RW hadn't delivered his pass yet...he would scramble looking back for the ball to "fly out" in his direction since the linemen often kept his QB "hidden" from direct view...it was a matter of trust.

[Hawktawk]

Along that line of thinking, Tarlhawk, RW often left the pocket, so that the offensive line would lose track of him. His style must be a nightmare for linemen.

It is hard to imagine what kind of rookie seasons our new tackles would have had protecting Russell. Probably not so good.

As a fan I appreciated the many exciting cardiac games that RW pulled off with victories. As a fan continuing to study what explains my simple unanswered observations I began to realize certain criticisms of our O-line play seemed unfounded. RW often left the pocket for reasons not so obvious at first....longer extended plays downfield require a difficult lengthy time for the O-line to sustain blocks with modern NFL pass rush specialists being hard to "anchor against" without drawing a holding flag.

Knowing this ....RW bailed on the pocket to buy more time....but refs seem to allow certain types of holding while a QB remains in the pocket but your O-line better not hold any part of your opponents jersey if your QB leaves the pocket....being deemed a runner ....at that point holding flags fly pretty easily then. Russell also bailed the pocket to get sight of passing lanes for him to launch missles further downfield. I became aware of some of this after listening to Doug Baldwin respond to how he knows when to "break off" his route to offer RW an escape pass. He said he knew if RW hadn't delivered his pass yet...he would scramble looking back for the ball to "fly out" in his direction since the linemen often kept his QB "hidden" from direct view...it was a matter of trust.[/quote]

Russ didn't appreciate his receivers here over the years, the great hands, ability to tap toes and run down scramble balls. Its no coincidence his completion % is career worst. Serves him right for his "mental leaders" comments "not all on my shoulders anymore"

After analyzing RWs film his last 2 seasons I suspected we might see addition by subtraction with a grip and rip first read stick it in a mail slot decisive QB. Whether it was Geno or Drew. I saw Duane Brown punch the air many times as Russ would spin out early into stupid sacks.
Although Geno took an amazing 13 sacks, 1 per quarter in relief last year. Geno has been roughed up some and had multi sack games this year making his performance even more impressive but I'm sure our total is down from last few years. HIs ability to make calls at the line of scrimmage is really helping the line as well. He is as much in control of the line of scrimmage as any QB in my memory.

Russ is on a pace for his career high in sacks. I recall some idiot Denver linemen tweeting "you wont get hit too much here Russ" I said oh yeah he will get hit too much.

I have a Denver fan friend who called it like I did. he said he cant believe Denver brass didn't spend more time watching film of the last 2 years. I feel sorry for the Denver fan base. I really do. Imagine us trading for Arod or something and be sitting at 3-7 with no draft picks short of mortgaging stars like Chubb. Im happy for us obviously and have no sympathy for Denver brass. They are big boys. They seem to have blown it short of some miraculous turnaround.

[NorthHawk]

Your center criticism (shared by others) is relevant to our QB play....Justin Britt and Ethan Pocic both 6 ft 6 in and 320 lb range able to absorb/sustain Pass Pro for RW and his penchant for longer play development but their body type/size limited RW passing lane vision. Joey Hunt being shorter 6 ft 2 in and barely 300 lb was a liabilty for bull rushes and pocket collapse so who do you define as excellent pass pro for a QB forced to scramble to see his passing lanes? Austin Blythe looks good with Geno being taller yet mobile enough to be quick strike from the pocket. When strong coverage makes Geno "hang out" to make his progressions....the pocket begins to collapse quickly. RW is a special player for not matching the NFL QB prototype....but his penchant for longer developed plays is difficult to match up an O-line with. Our centers were fine for Geno/Jimmy G. type QBs....just not the QB whose lack of mobility is starting to expose a collapse in performance.

I think you are minimizing the importance of a good Center.
Wilson played pretty well when Unger was here but the line play was significantly worse after he left and never really got much better. That may have set in Wilson's mind the flight reflex we see today.
The Center's contribution to getting players lined up and on the same page is crucial and it's even more so with a rookie lineman in the mix. I think Blythe might be the unsung hero of our Offense so far.

[Hawktawk]

Blythe was getting eaten alive earlier in the year . Both in run and pass pro. A lot of the sacks we don’t have is because Geno is hanging in and getting the ball out while being laid out . Russ would be bailing on those plays . As much attention as Geno is getting I think his impact on this line and offense in general is a bit underestimated .

[NorthHawk]

I'm talking about the mind set and being prepared mentally for what the opposition is doing and what is expected of each player.
Centers play a big part of that during the game so even if they get beat the others around them can be very effective.
But his play in all has been better than most of what we've seen since Unger was traded without a plan to replace him.