Waldron

[Hawktawk]

Waldron arrived with much fanfare as a McVeigh disciple , hand picked with Russell’s blessing . He’s flown under my radar through a very uneven year last year with awful to bad to decent to sometimes great when penny broke out . Week one was better than it looked on paper but too many silly mistakes . Last week was abysmal . The biggest thing in my craw was the second *trick* play . The first was fine and was cool because it showed Walkers lateral quickness on a dead on arrival play . So let’s do a pass with our #4 back who has not played qb since HS.

I read an analysis this morning calling it the worst call by a Seahawks OC since 49. Carrol is now saying we need to open it up more “.

So I have a question . Does Waldron have sole authority calling plays in the game ? Or does Pete have input ? He said of the Darwin Award play “ it’s a real cool play we run but we should have burned a timeout there”

so why didn’t we ? As a a fan I watched a qb brilliantly avoid a sack and stick it to Lockett on the 15. If there was ever a moment the 9ers might have felt pressure that was it . Then unilateral disarmnament

So how good is Waldron anyway ? Do we owe Schottie an apology ?

[NorthHawk]

Pete makes the decisions about how we are going to play.
He pulled in the reins on Schottenheimer and Wilson and sets the tone on Offense as to how we will play.
It’s called Peteball and takes its cues from the Offenses of the 70s and 80s. It was the same philosophy
for 3 OCs, so it seems the OC has a bit of a box of play calling parameters.

That being said, we’ve seen some changes this year with throws to RBs but Pete can pull it back at any time.
As well, they don’t seem to be demanding Fant become an inline blocking TE. So maybe there’s some
hope for a more updated Offense.

[obiken]

Pete's gotta go period.

[RiverDog]

If we were to let Waldron go after this season, we would have 4 different OC's in the past 7 seasons. We can't let Pete keep using offensive coordinators as scapegoats as if he's throwing virgins into the volcano trying to appease the Gods. At some point, we need to start holding the head coach responsible for our offensive failures as evidenced by the revolving door with OC's.

So, if we are to conclude that Waldron is incompetent and has to go, it only follows that Pete should go with him.

[I-5]

If we were to let Waldron go after this season, we would have 4 different OC's in the past 7 seasons. We can't let Pete keep using offensive coordinators as scapegoats as if he's throwing virgins into the volcano trying to appease the Gods. At some point, we need to start holding the head coach responsible for our offensive failures as evidenced by the revolving door with OC's.

So, if we are to conclude that Waldron is incompetent and has to go, it only follows that Pete should go with him.

I 100% agree with this logic. Pete is the common denominator, the buck must stop with him.

[NorthHawk]

The season is young so it’s not much of a worry yet.
It wouldn’t surprise me if it came to life mid year just enough for Pete to sell the idea that good fortunes are just ahead.
Then next year we will start poorly again.

[RiverDog]

The season is young so it’s not much of a worry yet.

Yep. The thread is a more appropriate topic for the back 1/4 of the season, not the first 1/4.

[Hawktawk]

]

The season is young so it’s not much of a worry yet.

“RD
Yep. The thread is a more appropriate topic for the back 1/4 of the season, not the first 1/4.[/quote]

It’s the call that brought this to the front of my mind . It’s early , we’re 1-1, we haven’t run the ball . And I am optimistic we will . But after 2 weeks we have the #31 offense , 29 passing and dead last in rushing . I read an analysis about our former dude that insinuated we were running his offense no matter who called the shots on the sidelines . They don’t have that as an explanation anymore and it’s the worst offense of the Carroll era . If Waldron is gone I’m sure Pete and everyone else will be too . But I agree with North . It’s early . Just something to keep an eye on . If they don’t trust the qb in the red zone put in Lock . He’s surely a better option than a running back

[RiverDog]

The season is young so it’s not much of a worry yet.

Yep. The thread is a more appropriate topic for the back 1/4 of the season, not the first 1/4.

It’s the call that brought this to the front of my mind . It’s early , we’re 1-1, we haven’t run the ball . And I am optimistic we will . But after 2 weeks we have the #31 offense , 29 passing and dead last in rushing . I read an analysis about our former dude that insinuated we were running his offense no matter who called the shots on the sidelines . They don’t have that as an explanation anymore and it’s the worst offense of the Carroll era . If Waldron is gone I’m sure Pete and everyone else will be too . But I agree with North . It’s early . Just something to keep an eye on . If they don’t trust the qb in the red zone put in Lock . He’s surely a better option than a running back

I'm not as worked up about the call as you are, certainly not to the point of starting a thread about the OC.

We haven't had a great deal of success running the ball in short yardage situations (we got stuffed at the goal line vs the Broncos last the previous week), it was early in the game, it wasn't a challenging throw as Dallas only had to throw the ball 15 yards or so, it was second down, so he shouldn't have had a do-or-die mentality, and it was the type of play that, if successful, could have resulted in a huge moral boost as players love it when someone besides the QB throws a TD pass. IMO it was more the execution that was to blame than the call itself, Dallas throwing a wounded duck. If the receiver wasn't open, he should have thrown the ball into the cheap seats.

As far as our offensive rankings, yeah, they suck, and the trend looks bad, and not totally unexpected, at least by the majority of us in the forum. But as in Geno's over inflated completion percentage, it's a small sample size. We'll see what happens this weekend vs. a defense much less challenging than the Niners' D.

[Hawktawk]

I can’t believe you are defending that call river . As I’ve said I read a guy who gets paid to write call it the worst call since 49. Sherman and kj among others were brutal on the call . Clearly the only chance we had to make it a game was there . It was a ridiculous idiotic inexcusable call in that situation against that defense , particularly as a second trick play in a row . The first only worked because of Ken Walker . It was totally snuffed. So put back in your QB on second and 6 or whatever it was .


Anyone whose a Seahawks fan whose not blaming the qb for a red zone failure he had no part of saw how stupid the call was .

[RiverDog]

I can’t believe you are defending that call river . As I’ve said I read a guy who gets paid to write call it the worst call since 49. Sherman and kj among others were brutal on the call . Clearly the only chance we had to make it a game was there . It was a ridiculous idiotic inexcusable call in that situation against that defense , particularly as a second trick play in a row . The first only worked because of Ken Walker . It was totally snuffed. So put back in your QB on second and 6 or whatever it was .


Anyone whose a Seahawks fan whose not blaming the qb for a red zone failure he had no part of saw how stupid the call was .

The only chance we had to make a game of it was with 4 minutes left in the 2nd quarter and down 13-0? Come off it, man! In retrospect, yes, it was a bad play call. But it came in Week 2 of a regular season game, not the type of consequences required to elevate it anywhere close to the 'worst since SB 49.' It wasn't the play that lost the game for us. If you lose a game by a score of 27-7, you can't blame the loss on a single play, which is the other thing that differentiates it from SB 49.

After the pick, the Niners got the ball back on their own 7. If our defense gets a 3 and out and forces them to punt from their own end zone, we get the ball back in the midfield area with time enough left in the 2nd half to get back into scoring position, and even if we failed, there was still the entire 2nd half to come back from a two-score deficit, not an impossible task.

The turning point in that game came in the following series. After Dallas' intercepted pass, we let the Niners out of jail then eventually forced them to punt, Lockett muffed it, the Niners took over at our 22, then drove the short distance to make it a 20-0 lead. That's the sequence that put the game into the 90%-win category.

[c_hawkbob]

As a play call alone, in that game situation but irrespective of the importance of the game, it was a worse call that XLIX. But I agree that when taken in the context of the weight of the consequences of the call they are not close to equal.

[Hawktawk]

As a play call alone, in that game situation but irrespective of the importance of the game, it was a worse call that XLIX. But I agree that when taken in the context of the weight of the consequences of the call they are not close to equal.

Everybody gets that Bob. But yeah a pro bowl super bowl winning qb throwing a pass on the goal line is better times 10 then putting it in the hands of a running back for the second playin a row, no misdirection just roll right .

Of all the people on offense who want to see a non quarterback throw a pass it’s the non quarterback with the ball that wants to throw it most . The very best thing Dee Jay could have done under the circumstances was lower his head and get as much as possible as DK was bracketed by 2 defenders .

But a predictable result . We hear about metrics . We hear about a risk averse coach . Then you throw with a running back when the qb is averaging 80% with 1 pick in 6 games . And yeah dink and dunk but the 9ers game was his first appearance in 6 games that he didn’t throw at least one TD pass. There was no reason for the call .

And yes River you should know that a 13 zip game in the second quarter is well within reach . We had the ball to start the second half and could conceivably have had the lead before the 9ers got the ball with a TD there . Instead picked . D finally gets a stop then the muff . The look on Locketts face told the story sitting on the field on his rear end . Short field , 9ers punch it in , 20 zip at the half , 1 point short of the biggest comeback in team history vs Tampa, a game I also attended . Ball game . And it started by getting your running back intercepted . Horrible call in that situation.

[mykc14]

I can’t believe you are defending that call river . As I’ve said I read a guy who gets paid to write call it the worst call since 49. Sherman and kj among others were brutal on the call . Clearly the only chance we had to make it a game was there . It was a ridiculous idiotic inexcusable call in that situation against that defense , particularly as a second trick play in a row . The first only worked because of Ken Walker . It was totally snuffed. So put back in your QB on second and 6 or whatever it was .


Anyone whose a Seahawks fan whose not blaming the qb for a red zone failure he had no part of saw how stupid the call was .

Yeah I agree it was a really a bad, unnecessary call. It was 2nd and short. It wasn't a low risk high reward situation. The Hawks weren't behind the sticks or anything like that. I could see PC/Waldron preparing for the game and saying "it's going to be hard to score on this defense when we get inside the 15 against this defense, let's put this trick play in just in case we need it, but that certainly was not the time.

Also, I'm not putting this play and SB 49 in the same sentence. They aren't comparable.

[NorthHawk]

It was a bad call, but the Offense was and still is desperate to score so I can live with it.
If they had scored on it or if it had been thrown away to play the next down, it would have been better but that play being successful could have created the spark the Offense needed.
We're not going anywhere this year, so why not try to get some enthusiasm from a bit of success?

[obiken]

Pete, Mike Tomlin, and Bill are all Dinosaurs. The league is rapidly moving to offense, and these guys are stuck in neutral while the train is moving past them at 200 mph. Pete needs to go.

[Hawktawk]

It’s 2 games . Second one we were not good enough to win under the best of circumstances most likely . We may have won last 4 but all were dogfights and all started by Russ . We had to house a fake punt to win last game .

Im sure the 9ers were ready for trickery and the result showed . There is no defending the call . What does it say to your qb ? Your offense in general ?it sucked any life the offense showed out of it . Relative to a quarterback throwing a pass I bet the odds of success on a play like that were astronomical . Flush it and move on .
This is the game coming up that will show where this team really is 3 games in on both sides of the ball . I’ll reserve judgement on Pete and Waldron and Hurrt who talked a hell of a game until I see a little more action .

[NorthHawk]

Going to the Wildcat says they don't believe in the QB in critical situations otherwise he would be leading the charge when it counted most.
It can also sow doubt in the minds of the rest of the team. But realistically we aren't winning any awards this year, so, in the big picture it doesn't matter much.

[Hawktawk]

Going to the Wildcat says they don't believe in the QB in critical situations otherwise he would be leading the charge when it counted most.
It can also sow doubt in the minds of the rest of the team. But realistically we aren't winning any awards this year, so, in the big picture it doesn't matter much.

Well exactly although I don’t buy the doom and gloom . It’s early . We’re young. We have 2 backs capable of taking over a game If we can block .
But yes it’s hard for any quarterback with no run game or protection to do anything . But he throws a dime to Lockett while in the middle of being hit 9 times and sacked twice in the game and it’s wildcat time ?

If you want to give your qb and offense confidence you don’t resort to high school plays against a defense like that. Geno threw DK 4 TDs in 13 quarters last year beating Lattimore and Ramsey for 2 of them and Shaq Griffin for 2 so if anyones targeting DK in the endzone it’s the qb completing 80% with at least 1 TD pass in every appearance .

Zero excuse . Dumb . I hope Shane learned . If I see Dee Jay or Walker or Penny or Homer with the ball it needs to be carrying it .

[RiverDog]

Waldron's goal line play call pales in comparison to the play calls/clock management issues Nathanial Hackett continues to have in Denver:

On Sunday against the Houston Texans, the Broncos were down 9-6 at home in the waning moments of the third quarter, a disastrous result against a team that ended their Week 1 with a tie.

With Russell Wilson and the Broncos driving down the field looking for a pivotal score, Hackett once again became the narrative after calling a tight end rush attempt on third and one at the Texans’ 35-yard line that, predictably, failed. Then, on the ensuing field goal attempt, Hackett mismanaged the clock and took a delay of game penalty to back them up five yards, after which… the Broncos punted!

Yes, after risking it all for a 64-yard field goal a week ago, Hackett balked at a 59-yarder.

https://ftw.usatoday.com/lists/broncos- ... s-reaction

Hackett had so much confidence in his kicker that, with everything on the line, he lets him attempt a 64 yard field goal at night, at sea level in Seattle and forgoing a 4th and 5 that had a roughly 50% chance of success, yet the following week, he won't let the same kicker try a 59 yard FG in the 3rd quarter on a warm afternoon in mile high Denver?

So thank your lucky stars that we have Shane Waldron calling plays and not Nathanial Hackett.

[c_hawkbob]

I agree, Waldron's blowing it big. He's a rook, but he just might be blowing a second chance as well as this one if he keeps this up.

[RiverDog]

I agree, Waldron's blowing it big. He's a rook, but he just might be blowing a second chance as well as this one if he keeps this up.

Waldron isn't a rookie. Or did you mean Hackett?

[Hawktawk]

I agree, Waldron's blowing it big. He's a rook, but he just might be blowing a second chance as well as this one if he keeps this up.

I think you meant Hackett . But yes it’s ugly . Predicted by some . He’s called plays once in his life and was fired . He’s bending over backwards to accommodate Russ but his play calling , critical decision making and horrible clock management are really hurting them. He’s got a 50 million qb and a team a qb away and here come the niners . No excuses . If they want to be one of those teams they need to do at home what we couldn’t do on the road . If the fans in Denver are counting down the clock and booing this weekend that’s officially a dumpster fire . I had not mentioned it as the mainstream sports media is all over it , both Russ and Hackett .

[c_hawkbob]

Waldron isn't a rookie. Or did you mean Hackett?

yes I'm sorry, I thought you were describing Hackett's bonehead call ... nevermind.

[RiverDog]

I agree, Waldron's blowing it big. He's a rook, but he just might be blowing a second chance as well as this one if he keeps this up.

I think you meant Hackett . But yes it’s ugly . Predicted by some . He’s called plays once in his life and was fired . He’s bending over backwards to accommodate Russ but his play calling , critical decision making and horrible clock management are really hurting them. He’s got a 50 million qb and a team a qb away and here come the niners . No excuses . If they want to be one of those teams they need to do at home what we couldn’t do on the road . If the fans in Denver are counting down the clock and booing this weekend that’s officially a dumpster fire . I had not mentioned it as the mainstream sports media is all over it , both Russ and Hackett .

Agreed. The way the Denver fans are reacting, you'd think that they'd lost that game. Hackett is about as popular as a bumble bee in a nudist colony. If Denver misses the playoffs, which I think is more likely than not, he could be one-and-done.

[Aseahawkfan]

Agreed. The way the Denver fans are reacting, you'd think that they'd lost that game. Hackett is about as popular as a bumble bee in a nudist colony. If Denver misses the playoffs, which I think is more likely than not, he could be one-and-done.

Still not sure why Denver picked Hackett, but he's gonna need to get a whole lot better if Denver wants to make any noise in the playoffs. I'm not sure why Russ thought he had a good chance to win a Super Bowl there. Maybe he wanted out of there that badly I guess and Hackett at least sold him he would get the chance to run in an offense that he could throw more in without being handcuffed.

[Hawktawk]

Here is a crazy stat for you . Russ didn’t throw much in the middle here . Geno is throwing more in the middle here than Russ did last few years . But Russ is throwing more in the middle in Denver then Geno is here . Just read that yesterday . So he’s been coachable in the offense . But the results are 16ppg average . It’s a Waldron thread but I said it a long time ago . Russ and Pete’s divorce is very sad and is tarnishing both mens legacies but Russ will regret this decision . Granted it’s week 3. If they smoke the 9ers I’ll have another statement to retract . But the man is playing himself off the first ballot right now.