2022 Key to offensive ceiling- the O-Line

[RiverDog]

Just read an interesting stat. Only 4 teams in the last 20 years (adjusted to 16 game season) had fewer offensive snaps than the 2021 Seahawks. That was offset some by the top 10 ranking in explosive plays. That is a lot of pressure to put on a defense, as it needs to be on the field too long.

Being 26th in 3rd down conversions and dead last on 4th down is a more telling stat than explosive plays, as was Russell's 3rd down completion percentage, which even before his injury was worst in the league amongst starting QB's. That's one area where I agree with Hawktawk regarding Russell as his penchant for lower percentage sideline routes and not utilizing the middle of the field had a profound effect on our 3rd/4th down conversions.

But it's also a direct reflection on our offensive line, too. Lots of factors in the equation.

So y'all just putting that all on the offense, nothing about the defenses own inability to get off the damn field on 3rd down?

Well, the OP is about the offensive line.

However, to answer your question, our defense wasn't nearly as bad on 3rd downs as our offense. We were ranked 15th:

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/o ... ersion-pct

We were ranked 3rd on opponent 4th down conversion percentage:

https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stat/o ... ersion-pct

[NorthHawk]

The Defense certainly played its part in the struggles but the Offense had way too many 3 and outs and not enough sustained
drives to give them any rest. It was already an under talented group who were having lots of problems on their own but
the Offense also didn’t have the ability to help.
Besides, the topic was the OLine…

[Hawktawk]

Unquestionably an offense that can’t move chains and use clock kills a defense . The LOb could handle it most of the time but not consistently enough to win more than one Lombardi . Whatever the problem , line , scheme , personnel we have to figure it out . The only constant the last ten years is PC and Russ . No excuses if they can’t move chains now .

[RiverDog]

Unquestionably an offense that can’t move chains and use clock kills a defense . The LOb could handle it most of the time but not consistently enough to win more than one Lombardi . Whatever the problem , line , scheme , personnel we have to figure it out . The only constant the last ten years is PC and Russ . No excuses if they can’t move chains now .

No excuses if they can't move the chains now? Why is that?

We have a young experienced offensive line. It's likely that we'll have 5 guys that haven't played together as a unit. Plus we're going up against some pretty impressive defensive players, like both the Bosa brothers, Aaron Donald, Kahlil Mack, Frank Clark, etc. I don't want to call it an 'excuse', but we have to expect that there's going to be a learning curve.

[Aseahawkfan]

So y'all just putting that all on the offense, nothing about the defenses own inability to get off the damn field on 3rd down?

I think the defense sucked too. I think the offense started to do much better a few games after Russ came back after his injury. Team was coming together those last six games.

[NorthHawk]

It was a team effort.

[RiverDog]

So y'all just putting that all on the offense, nothing about the defenses own inability to get off the damn field on 3rd down?

I think the defense sucked too. I think the offense started to do much better a few games after Russ came back after his injury. Team was coming together those last six games.

As I have to keep reminding HT, we must note the quality of our opponents at the end of our schedule last season. In our last 5 games, the only decent team we played was the Rams. The other 4 included the Lions, Bears, Texans, and a Cards team that had peaked a month earlier as they lost 4 of their last 5 regular season games then the Rams blew them out in the wild card round.

[Hawktawk]

You choose to remind me . You don’t have to . I watched the games . Good bad and ugly . I don’t play good team bad team . It’s the show . Everyone will take your head off if you let up for a second . The offense cranked up when Penny started going off . Russel and the offense had a couple of ridiculous games in that stretch . The Rams was an abberation because Russ was protecting his body or something , refusing to keep on the read leading to backs running into a wall . Add in cover 4 to cut down on the deep shots it’s a recipe for 10 points and not much offense . But vs Detroit when you hang a 50 burger on someone despite losing a possession on an onside and also eskridge sliding down at the goal rather than score easily it’s a great offense game . Great . When your back is averaging 6.7 ypc you’re running it well . Asea is right the team was at its best at year end at which point I thought maybe everyone would be back .

Just like completing 20-24, 2 TDs and a rush TD 138 qbr is a great textbook Pete ball game . He’s referred to the game as one of our best of the year . As for our terrible line Geno knows having been sacked 13 times in 13 quarters and still played well enough to be in the competition . We will be more consistent at moving chains imo than the bipolar offense we’ve seen more and more , boom or bust . Bomb or punt . It’s gonna be ok .

[Aseahawkfan]

As I have to keep reminding HT, we must note the quality of our opponents at the end of our schedule last season. In our last 5 games, the only decent team we played was the Rams. The other 4 included the Lions, Bears, Texans, and a Cards team that had peaked a month earlier as they lost 4 of their last 5 regular season games then the Rams blew them out in the wild card round.

We still went 4-2 and Russell was starting to get his rhythm back.

[RiverDog]

As I have to keep reminding HT, we must note the quality of our opponents at the end of our schedule last season. In our last 5 games, the only decent team we played was the Rams. The other 4 included the Lions, Bears, Texans, and a Cards team that had peaked a month earlier as they lost 4 of their last 5 regular season games then the Rams blew them out in the wild card round.

We still went 4-2 and Russell was starting to get his rhythm back.

That's true. But the strength of our opponents is a qualifier that should be noted.

[Aseahawkfan]

That's true. But the strength of our opponents is a qualifier that should be noted.

And even with the weak teams, we don't have Wagner or Dunlap on defense any more either. And our safeties may not be healthy to start the season. Defense may start off worse.

[RiverDog]

That's true. But the strength of our opponents is a qualifier that should be noted.

And even with the weak teams, we don't have Wagner or Dunlap on defense any more either. And our safeties may not be healthy to start the season. Defense may start off worse.

Good point about our safeties. Both Adams and Diggs will be returning from off season surgeries. That will be one thing to keep an eye on in training camp and preseason, if they are full participants or if they're being limited or held out.

[NorthHawk]

I’m sure they will be held back until the regular season starts. The team knows what they can do so it’s just a matter of keeping
them healthy and fine tuning their timing within the changes on Defense. There’s no sense getting them banged up for nothing.

[tarlhawk]

We added a bunch of UDFA safeties perhaps to get us through camp and preseason without "rushing" to get Diggs/Adams back into our practices... so our QB competition may not be matched against our best safeties during practices but solid safety play to make them compete hard. During training camp you'd like to have your number one offense practice against your number one defensive players...to sharpen up both sides. I did see where Quandre was asked about his recovery and he said if Pete wants to see him do a back flip...he was capable.

[NorthHawk]

They are also evaluating talent in the event they play better than last year’s substitutes. It’s part of improving the talent base.

[Hawktawk]

Well? Doesn’t look like PFF had our line graded very accurately from what I saw . The rookie tackles looked mostly great , especially Lucas who seemed more violent blocking , more physical although Cross gave up no pressures. Of the 3 sacks 2 were judged to be on the QB. It’s one preseason game but it looks to me like a better line then last year already .

[NorthHawk]

Meh. It's too early to make any sort of ranking of rookies.

[RiverDog]

Well? Doesn’t look like PFF had our line graded very accurately from what I saw . The rookie tackles looked mostly great , especially Lucas who seemed more violent blocking , more physical although Cross gave up no pressures. Of the 3 sacks 2 were judged to be on the QB. It’s one preseason game but it looks to me like a better line then last year already .

Before you throw out your back by doing cartwheels over our OL performance, you'd better check and see just what kind of competition they were facing. Did you see TJ Watt? How about Cameron Heyward?

I didn't go back and check to see how much playing time those guys got, but judging from the pregame comments, Tomlin was supposedly holding out most of his defensive starters or at least limiting their playing time, which is pretty standard for most teams:

Don’t expect Minakh Fitzpatrick, TJ Watt, Cameron Heyward and Diontae Johnson to see too much playing time.

Mike Tomlin also mentioned he’s not going to play players that have been dealing with injuries, as that would “be setting them up for failure.” This probably means that starters like Chase Claypool, Najee Harris, Derek Watt, Kevin Dotson and Benny Snell Jr. will get little to no playing time as they have all been dealing with some sort of injury throughout training camp. Other second-team or third-team players that have been battling injuries should not be expected to play, either.

https://www.steelernation.com/what-to-e ... ason-2022/

It's the preseason, for crying out loud. Nothing that happens in any of these games invalidates any of the prognostications.

[Hawktawk]

They were basically the #1 ranked line a few weeks after getting a last place grade from PFF. Cross was the highest rated pass blocking LT. And stop with who we didn’t have to face . They didn’t have to defend all world Wilson , just 2 stiffs ranked #50 and 51 starters in 32 team league ( well Geno anyway) . No DK. No Penny. No Rocket . Please stop . I can fing read a lineup . They are NFL starters trying to get or keep their job, in their house and we had the # 1 line and my prediction is as it was they will be an improvement on last year immediately . Ht is going to be right again .

[Aseahawkfan]

They were basically the #1 ranked line a few weeks after getting a last place grade from PFF. Cross was the highest rated pass blocking LT. And stop with who we didn’t have to face . They didn’t have to defend all world Wilson , just 2 stiffs ranked #50 and 51 starters in 32 team league ( well Geno anyway) . No DK. No Penny. No Rocket . Please stop . I can fing read a lineup . They are NFL starters trying to get or keep their job, in their house and we had the # 1 line and my prediction is as it was they will be an improvement on last year immediately . Ht is going to be right again .

What are you even talking about?

[Hawktawk]

They were basically the #1 ranked line a few weeks after getting a last place grade from PFF. Cross was the highest rated pass blocking LT. And stop with who we didn’t have to face . They didn’t have to defend all world Wilson , just 2 stiffs ranked #50 and 51 starters in 32 team league ( well Geno anyway) . No DK. No Penny. No Rocket . Please stop . I can fing read a lineup . They are NFL starters trying to get or keep their job, in their house and we had the # 1 line and my prediction is as it was they will be an improvement on last year immediately . Ht is going to be right again .

Asea"What are you even talking about?[/quote]

Huh? I thought it was self explanatory. I think it was RD that shared PFFs 32 rank grade for our line a couple weeks ago and I said BS and everyone including you reminded me rookie tackles are never good blah blah blah dog meat interior linemen, no QB, were screwed behind this horrible line.
I read an article this morning that said they looked like a "seasoned veteran line" after being predicted to be one of the worst.

Preseason cuts both ways. Thats the first time that line has played in anger and they were nearly perfect I get its preseason after 50 years watching the god damn game! really do guys but that is not going to be the worst line in the NFL, not close. Might be one of the best when the skill people get cranked up. Thats what Im talking about.GO HAWKS!!!

[NorthHawk]

I think we better get their busts ready for Canton!!!

[Hawktawk]

I think we better get their busts ready for Canton!!!

Mmmmhhhm
How about they aren’t 32 at all which is all old HT said weeks ago but being HT it just draws sarcasm . I’ll be right about the line and the team .

[c_hawkbob]

When and by whom were they "basically the #1 ranked line" or did you just pull that outa your arse for effect?

[RiverDog]

Preseason cuts both ways. Thats the first time that line has played in anger and they were nearly perfect I get its preseason after 50 years watching the god damn game! really do guys but that is not going to be the worst line in the NFL, not close. Might be one of the best when the skill people get cranked up. Thats what Im talking about.GO HAWKS!!!

The preseason doesn't cut either way. We simply cannot judge one way or another how this line is going to look when the whistle blows for real. We were playing our starters against Pittsburgh's 2nd and 3rd stringers.

[obiken]

Yeah judging anything on Pre-season is a joke. The Bears beat the Chiefs, yeah thats not gonna happen in real life! River, as I said on another post I would like to believe in this year but there is just no way I can, we just do not have the personnel. Going to the 3-4 in my view, is a gadget move by coach who is 70 and is done. Its been 12 years since he took over, most coaches are done at 5 to 7 years max.

[Hawktawk]

When and by whom were they "basically the #1 ranked line" or did you just pull that outa your arse for effect?

I have no clue how to link but I read a stat that the Seahawks line was graded #1 for first preseason game . I’ll stand corrected if I’m wrong or the article was incorrect .I heard Cross graded #1 left tackle and Lucas very highly . As I’ve said repeatedly I’m a speed reader that retains well and if I said it I read it . I speculate and predict but I don’t make up other peoples quotes or mis represent the work of sports writers . Misinterpret ? Maybe . My bottom line Bob is this is going to be a good line . Not 32 by any chance . And I think you will see more optimistic developments because this is huge one . But optimism draws sarcasm .

[c_hawkbob]

When and by whom were they "basically the #1 ranked line" or did you just pull that outa your arse for effect?

I have no clue how to link but I read a stat that the Seahawks line was graded #1 for first preseason game . I’ll stand corrected if I’m wrong or the article was incorrect .I heard Cross graded #1 left tackle and Lucas very highly . As I’ve said repeatedly I’m a speed reader that retains well and if I said it I read it . I speculate and predict but I don’t make up other peoples quotes or mis represent the work of sports writers . Misinterpret ? Maybe . My bottom line Bob is this is going to be a good line . Not 32 by any chance . And I think you will see more optimistic developments because this is huge one . But optimism draws sarcasm .

OK, in the "credit where credit is due" department, I did find this from PFF:

OFFENSIVE LINE
It was a stellar performance from what some consider to be the worst offensive line in the NFL. Seattle's group allowed just one pressure — a measly hurry — across 145 pass-blocking snaps.
Rookie Charles Cross remained clean in pass protection on 23 pass-blocking snaps.

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-preseason- ... eahawks-25

Not exactly "#1 ranked in the NFL" but a glowing review from an objective source none the less. (Although dude musta quit watching just before that strip sack ...)