Penney dinged up again

[Hawktawk]

Held out of first day of OTAs with a hamstring issue . Sounds more precautionary but damn. A good portion of my optimism is based on an explosive chain moving run game which he can surely provide but he’s got to be playing.

Heard Wyman and bob discussing it yesterday the fickle nature of hamstrung issues and that it’s the type of thing that can be hard to get past . It makes me very relieved Walker was drafted . Of course Carson is also out .

[NorthHawk]

There's a big part of me hoping Carson hangs them up.
I'd hate to see him do more damage that would affect his life even more than the usual injuries football inflicts on players.

Regarding Penny, it's good it happened early and maybe with intensive treatment he can stay healthy but he's snake bit with injuries.

[Hawktawk]

There's a big part of me hoping Carson hangs them up.
I'd hate to see him do more damage that would affect his life even more than the usual injuries football inflicts on players.

Regarding Penny, it's good it happened early and maybe with intensive treatment he can stay healthy but he's snake bit with injuries.

With you on Carson . Obviously we all want Penney healthy . It’s like the Alamo . No back door .

[RiverDog]

I can't say that I'm surprised. Now you know why we've all had our reservations about Penny. This isn't the first time he's had problems with hamstring injuries. He missed a game last year due to a hamstring issue.

I'd say that the odds of him playing 1/2 or more of the season are about 5 to 1 against.

[Aseahawkfan]

And with our QB situation Penny is going to be playing against a lot of stacked boxes ready to put the hurt on him. Until Lock or Smith prove they can be a real threat, no one is going to respect them. So it's going to be blitzes and disguised coverages looking to confuse to force turnovers and a nice stacked box to punish whoever is running with no respect for the passing game until it is earned.

[trents]

I can't say that I'm surprised. Now you know why we've all had our reservations about Penny. This isn't the first time he's had problems with hamstring injuries. He missed a game last year due to a hamstring issue.

I'd say that the odds of him playing 1/2 or more of the season are about 5 to 1.

Do you mean to say that the odds of him playing or not playing 1/2 or more of the season are 5 to 1?

[trents]

There's a big part of me hoping Carson hangs them up.
I'd hate to see him do more damage that would affect his life even more than the usual injuries football inflicts on players.

Regarding Penny, it's good it happened early and maybe with intensive treatment he can stay healthy but he's snake bit with injuries.

Yes, there's plenty of time to recover from that hammy. We're not even in training camp yet. And Penny knows the playbook so he doesn't need the reps like if he were a rookie.

[RiverDog]

I can't say that I'm surprised. Now you know why we've all had our reservations about Penny. This isn't the first time he's had problems with hamstring injuries. He missed a game last year due to a hamstring issue.

I'd say that the odds of him playing 1/2 or more of the season are about 5 to 1.

Do you mean to say that the odds of him playing or not playing 1/2 or more of the season are 5 to 1?

Sorry, Trents. I realized my mistake and edited my comment to say that IMO the odds are 5-1 against him being able to play half the season.

[mykc14]

Yes, there's plenty of time to recover from that hammy. We're not even in training camp yet. And Penny knows the playbook so he doesn't need the reps like if he were a rookie.

Obviously there is more than enough time, that's not really the issue. The issue is that he is rarely healthy and this just looks bad. How could anybody have any real confidence that he is going to be healthy enough to make it through a full year of football when he hasn't done it yet and has trouble even making it to mini-camp? At the end of the day this could mean nothing and he is perfectly healthy next year, but it doesn't look good right now. I get that it is mini-camp and all of that and that overall it isn't important for him to be out here, but if he is getting hurt in the off-season, when he isn't being hit by 300lb guys 25 times a game then what is going to happen when the season starts? We have heard this tune before- we know how the song ends...

[RiverDog]

Obviously there is more than enough time, that's not really the issue. The issue is that he is rarely healthy and this just looks bad. How could anybody have any real confidence that he is going to be healthy enough to make it through a full year of football when he hasn't done it yet and has trouble even making it to mini-camp? At the end of the day this could mean nothing and he is perfectly healthy next year, but it doesn't look good right now. I get that it is mini-camp and all of that and that overall it isn't important for him to be out here, but if he is getting hurt in the off-season, when he isn't being hit by 300lb guys 25 times a game then what is going to happen when the season starts? We have heard this tune before- we know how the song ends...

Nice post. That's exactly how I see it. Perhaps it's just our coaching staff being overly cautious, maybe even likely that they are. But it highlights the danger of putting all our eggs in Penny's very precarious basket as some posters in here have insisted on doing.

[Aseahawkfan]

Carson seems done.

Penny is a wild card.

I hope to see some promise from this Kenneth Walker. But running behind a young O-line learning that NFL level D-lines are brutal is going to be rough. I still remember Okung coming in with no injury issues, then finding out how brutal NFL d-lines are compared to college. You gotta grow into a man fast when playing O-line in the NFL.

[I-5]

Nice post. That's exactly how I see it. Perhaps it's just our coaching staff being overly cautious, maybe even likely that they are. But it highlights the danger of putting all our eggs in Penny's very precarious basket as some posters in here have insisted on doing.

I agree as well, and I think the fact the Seahawks used their #41 pick on Walker shows they have no intention of putting all their eggs in one Penny's basket. I was a fan of keeping Penny, but I fully support going for another RB1 type...you never know. You can never have enough good backs if you're a running team.

[Hawktawk]

This right here
I was delighted with the Penney signing and elated with the pick of Walker the more I see of him. We must run . All these 1 read offenses rely on a strong run game to set it up . I guess if there’s a bright side it is that he had the Hammy issue last year and then went on this run. The kid must need better physical therapy or something. We know if he’s out there he’s a weapon . Hopefully the same for Walker

[Old but Slow]

After a time off from playing, it is easy to overdo it and tweak something. I don't see this as a problem, yet, although it remains to be seen how healthy any of them will be when the whistle blows.

Penney gave us a peek at what effect a strong running game can have, and whether it is Penney, Walker, or Carson or some combination of them, it will be interesting to see how well they can execute it. Personally, I am excited about the possibilities. Probably it my old school thinking, but I grew up in the era of Hugh McIlhenny (sp?), Jim Brown, Gayle Sayers, and Lenny Moore, and I love to see a good running attack with talented backs. The big play, pass for 300 yards, clutch catches and all that is fun, but give me a running game to get my juices boiling.

To add: I am a huge Seahawks fan, and often my whole outlook on life is affected by their wins and losses, but beyond that I am also a football fan. Watching the games is a little like looking at works of art, with its variety and sublime skills. Different teams approach the game in singular ways, like the team development of Bellichek, the running game of Lombardi, or the passing attack of Coryell. This Seahawks season will be an examination. Can they take the pieces they have and mold an offense that they have not used in a while, and with a defense under a young talented new coach? Win or lose, it will be interesting. Book it.

[Aseahawkfan]

I'm a big fan of a strong run game too. I don't look at is at Pete Ball myself. Pete's offensive philosophy is a classic defensive football mind set which works amazing if you have the right pieces. Doesn't work as well if you don't have a consistent run game and dominating defense.

I've no fan of the big passing attacks myself. I watched Dan Fouts back in the day launching passes because San Diego didn't have a complete team. That type of team may win a Super Bow here and there, but they are not consistent. Same as a great defensive and run team might win a Super Bowl with an average to maybe bad QB like Tampa Bay and Baltimore.

But the reality is the best teams are complete teams. Run, pass, and play defense with competent special teams.

I recall reading WCO was developed to move the ball with short passes when Walsh had a weak run game. The short passing game would use high percentage short passes to move the ball like a RB to keep the chains moving and avoid turnovers. When you combine that type of attack with a running game as well, it is obviously devastating. That being said it is not superior to the classic Pittsburgh type of play hard defense, run it down their throats, and throw deep off the play action pass game Pete likes to use. It's not Pete Ball, it's just a classic play action pass defensive football mind set that has been around the NFL for decades.

The only thing new in football is the soft rules. But even so, when it comes to the playoffs and push comes to shove the better defense can generally get a win. If we can build a strong defense with a good run game even if Penny, Walker, and Carson sharing time, then we can get something going maybe.

[RiverDog]

I'm a big fan of a strong run game too. I don't look at is at Pete Ball myself. Pete's offensive philosophy is a classic defensive football mind set which works amazing if you have the right pieces. Doesn't work as well if you don't have a consistent run game and dominating defense.

I've no fan of the big passing attacks myself. I watched Dan Fouts back in the day launching passes because San Diego didn't have a complete team. That type of team may win a Super Bow here and there, but they are not consistent. Same as a great defensive and run team might win a Super Bowl with an average to maybe bad QB like Tampa Bay and Baltimore.

But the reality is the best teams are complete teams. Run, pass, and play defense with competent special teams.

I recall reading WCO was developed to move the ball with short passes when Walsh had a weak run game. The short passing game would use high percentage short passes to move the ball like a RB to keep the chains moving and avoid turnovers. When you combine that type of attack with a running game as well, it is obviously devastating. That being said it is not superior to the classic Pittsburgh type of play hard defense, run it down their throats, and throw deep off the play action pass game Pete likes to use. It's not Pete Ball, it's just a classic play action pass defensive football mind set that has been around the NFL for decades.

The only thing new in football is the soft rules. But even so, when it comes to the playoffs and push comes to shove the better defense can generally get a win. If we can build a strong defense with a good run game even if Penny, Walker, and Carson sharing time, then we can get something going maybe.

I, too, like to see a strong running attack. It's generally a low risk offense, controls the clock, dictates a certain style of play. But there are problems: They aren't much good if you're down by 3 TD's, and they aren't very good at playing behind the sticks. One holding penalty and it kills the drive. Teams have to either be extraordinary disciplined or have at least a serviceable passing game to bail out the running attack if they find themselves in a hole. That's been the problem with Pete Ball: He no longer has a top 5 defense yet he still wants to ground and pound.

Rule changes have helped tilt the balance between run and pass towards the latter. The elimination of bump-and-run tactics. Defenseless receivers. Roughing the passer. Plus the public wants to see a star. A quarterback handles the ball on every play. The running back comes out of the game on 3rd down. Passing offenses results in more scoring, more excitement. Athletic skills are more easily displayed in a passing offense. Quarterbacks put butts in the seats, sells advertising better than a running back. You don't see Jake with State Farm doing a commercial with Derrick Henry.

I played offensive line in high school, so I, too, have a natural affection for a strong running attack. But I like to win, and I don't care what style of offense we have so long as we score more points than the other team.

[NorthHawk]

A balanced Offense is always desirable. It keeps the opposing Defense off balance.
Peteball is far too predictable for today's Defenses to have problems with. A couple of years ago we heard players say the Defense they were playing were calling out
the plays just as they lined up. That's not going to give you long term success in today's NFL. That doesn't mean the Offense has to be exotic, rather it means it has to
vary in it's looks and plays. Pre snap motion helps the QB determine Zone or Man coverage. We rarely do that. When was the last time we ran a bubble screen or jet sweep?
We have had the players to do both but we haven't done it. A quick toss to the RB can get him to the edge quickly, but that doesn't seem to be in our playbook. These plays
are all conservative by nature, and would fit into the protect the ball philosophy, but we rarely if ever use them.
So Defenses have an advantage against our Offense. They know what's coming and can prepare for it. And that's the problem with Peteball.

[Hawktawk]

We ran 3 or 4 jet sweeps vs the bears with eskridge one went for 14 yards on 3rd and 15 and we couldn’t complete a pass on 4th . And North almost nobody stopped anything we were doing because of Penney . Walker is reportedly the same type of impact running back . One only need look at Atlantas horrific collapse in the super bowl to see what happens if you forget to run the ball . Not sexy but it’s the winning formula . You must have a dynamic back or 2. Dee Jay and Collins and Homer not so much .

With beast and with a healthy Carson or Penney we’ve had no problem running if the back is good enough .

[RiverDog]

And North almost nobody stopped anything we were doing because of Penney.

That's not true. During Penny's late season stretch, the Rams stopped him cold: 39 yards on 11 carries. The offense fizzled, 214 total yards and 10 points. It was the only time during that stretch that we faced a quality defense instead of D's like what the Texans and Lions trotted out.

[Hawktawk]

And North almost nobody stopped anything we were doing because of Penney.

That's not true. During Penny's late season stretch, the Rams stopped him cold: 39 yards on 11 carries. The offense fizzled, 214 total yards and 10 points. It was the only time during that stretch that we faced a quality defense instead of D's like what the Texans and Lions trotted out.[/quote]


Yeah a few things here . 11 carries with 10 to Dee Jay and 1 to Homer . Penney’s not getting half the carries in any game it the option is Dee Jay who averaged about 4 that evening . To be fair to Pete Penney had only had 1 huge game vs the Texans prior to that game so maybe he didn’t quite get it yet . If a guy has the ability to house it every play he gets 95% of the touches imo.
The last thing is that Russels performance was one of his worst of the year by far . He was in pistol in read ootion and refused to run even though the defense wasn’t respecting him at all , focusing on the handoff every time .Russ was dreadful through the air even though they were stacking the box and daring him to throw . He took 3 sacks and every one was 3 to5 seconds after the snap with receivers running wide open all over the field . Even the bad no call on Dee Jays PI happened because the ball was 5 yards short on 4 th down . Hard to judge a game when the qb looks like crap . The only decent play we saw vs the Rams was Genos 1 quarter . And I did say almost nobody . I called A Penney alert after the Second 9er game and he only averaged 3.5 on 7 Carrie’s .but I saw the burst was there
I’m not too concerned with Penney’s ability if he stays healthy .

[RiverDog]

Yeah a few things here . 11 carries with 10 to Dee Jay and 1 to Homer . Penney’s not getting half the carries in any game it the option is Dee Jay who averaged about 4 that evening . To be fair to Pete Penney had only had 1 huge game vs the Texans prior to that game so maybe he didn’t quite get it yet . If a guy has the ability to house it every play he gets 95% of the touches imo.

I'm apparently not getting what you're trying to say. Are you saying that Penny isn't getting half the carries in any game? He had more carries than any other running back in all of our last 5 games, including the loss to the Rams.

I also don't understand you're comment that Penny "didn't quite get it yet". He's been with the team for 4 frigging years.

Why can't you just say that Penny had a bad game against the Rams? Why do you feel the urge to make excuses for his poor outings?

[Old but Slow]

River, to be fair to Hawktalk, I think he meant that "he didn't get it yet" was referring to Pete, not Penny.

[RiverDog]

River, to be fair to Hawktalk, I think he meant that "he didn't get it yet" was referring to Pete, not Penny.

Ah, IC. That clears up some of the confusion. Thanks!

[Aseahawkfan]

I'm apparently not getting what you're trying to say. Are you saying that Penny isn't getting half the carries in any game? He had more carries than any other running back in all of our last 5 games, including the loss to the Rams.

I also don't understand you're comment that Penny "didn't quite get it yet". He's been with the team for 4 frigging years.

Why can't you just say that Penny had a bad game against the Rams? Why do you feel the urge to make excuses for his poor outings?

3 more months until we see what kind of team we really are. Hopefully not as bad as some of us think, but I'm fairly certain the pie in the sky scenario hawktawk paints is pretty far off too. We're in a tough division. We have a fairly tough schedule as well. And a lot of unknown at a lot of positions other than just QB. If we had other top flight units, maybe could do some Baltimore of Philly type of run with some real average to bad QB play. But we have questionable units at nearly every position except WR and punter. Even our LB crew will be Jordyn Brooks taking over for Bobby, then some up and comers. I'm confident Brooks is good enough to take over. Not so confident Diggs, Jamal Adams, Penny, and Carson all come back healthy. I think we'll be lucky to get one of them back fully healthy and I'm not sure which one.

I'm expecting a very inconsistent, down year with the usual people having injury issues and hopefully some progress from some of the draft picks. Main thing is to see the draft picks develop as that is the compensation for the loss of the franchise QB. If they don't develop, I think the heat is going to be very strong on Carroll and Schneider. But if we see positive development from the draft picks, then hope will be reborn.

[RiverDog]

I'm apparently not getting what you're trying to say. Are you saying that Penny isn't getting half the carries in any game? He had more carries than any other running back in all of our last 5 games, including the loss to the Rams.

I also don't understand you're comment that Penny "didn't quite get it yet". He's been with the team for 4 frigging years.

Why can't you just say that Penny had a bad game against the Rams? Why do you feel the urge to make excuses for his poor outings?

3 more months until we see what kind of team we really are. Hopefully not as bad as some of us think, but I'm fairly certain the pie in the sky scenario hawktawk paints is pretty far off too. We're in a tough division. We have a fairly tough schedule as well. And a lot of unknown at a lot of positions other than just QB. If we had other top flight units, maybe could do some Baltimore of Philly type of run with some real average to bad QB play. But we have questionable units at nearly every position except WR and punter. Even our LB crew will be Jordyn Brooks taking over for Bobby, then some up and comers. I'm confident Brooks is good enough to take over. Not so confident Diggs, Jamal Adams, Penny, and Carson all come back healthy. I think we'll be lucky to get one of them back fully healthy and I'm not sure which one.

I'm expecting a very inconsistent, down year with the usual people having injury issues and hopefully some progress from some of the draft picks. Main thing is to see the draft picks develop as that is the compensation for the loss of the franchise QB. If they don't develop, I think the heat is going to be very strong on Carroll and Schneider. But if we see positive development from the draft picks, then hope will be reborn.

I try to stay away from predictions this far out. The schedule doesn't look all that imposing. We have teams like the Lions and Jets, plus the NFC South is a pretty soft division with teams like the Panthers, Falcons, and Saints. We have the tendency to look at our team in a vacuum, not taking into consideration of the other teams around us that may have problems that exceed those of our own. The Cards have problems with their star QB. The Niners also have a quarterback controversy.

I have very little confidence that Penny will be able to stay healthy for more than half the season. To hear Hawktalk tell it, the only reason he missed any games was due to his major knee injury, but that's not true at all. He's missed games to hamstring pulls, calf muscle strains, knee strains. Even if he does manage to stay healthy, I'm not confident that he's finally 'found it'. The fact that we spent a 2nd day pick on a RB and resigned Penny to a one year prove it deal strongly suggests that Pete isn't that confident, either.

[NorthHawk]

From what I've been reading, the Saints think they have a chance to win it all this year.
Even if they fall short, they look like they might be better than you think, RD. They have a lot of talent there, but what remains to be seen
is the play calling now that Payton is gone. The Cards are an unknown to me as they seem to be heading into some turbulence, but the 49ers
have so much talent on both sides of the ball that they will be a tough out for us since we have a couple of major changes on this team with
the new OTs and the loss of leadership from Wilson and Wagner not to mention some structural changes to the Defense.

[Hawktawk]

[list=][/list]

Yeah a few things here . 11 carries with 10 to Dee Jay and 1 to Homer . Penney’s not getting half the carries in any game it the option is Dee Jay who averaged about 4 that evening . To be fair to Pete Penney had only had 1 huge game vs the Texans prior to that game so maybe he didn’t quite get it yet . If a guy has the ability to house it every play he gets 95% of the touches imo.

I'm apparently not getting what you're trying to say. Are you saying that Penny isn't getting half the carries in any game? He had more carries than any other running back in all of our last 5 games, including the loss to the Rams.

I also don't understand you're comment that Penny "didn't quite get it yet". He's been with the team for 4 frigging years.

Why can't you just say that Penny had a bad game against the Rams? Why do you feel the urge to make excuses for his poor outings?

Penney had 11 carries mostly from the pistol since Russell’s healed hand didn’t take many snaps under center . Russ refused to run or really even carry out the fake. My point about Carrie’s you should understand and do but you like arguing with me is a bell cow back needs fed . Not a couple handoffs mixed with someone else . He had one more touch then Dee Jay . In his entire career Dee Jay wouldn’t do 1 time what I saw Penney do twice in 1 game which was beat a pro bowl safety with the angle to the end zone . He’d have started in 2018 if I was HC .

[RiverDog]

Why can't you just say that Penny had a bad game against the Rams? Why do you feel the urge to make excuses for his poor outings?

Penney had 11 carries mostly from the pistol since Russell’s healed hand didn’t take many snaps under center . Russ refused to run or really even carry out the fake. My point about Carrie’s you should understand and do but you like arguing with me is a bell cow back needs fed . Not a couple handoffs mixed with someone else . He had one more touch then Dee Jay . In his entire career Dee Jay wouldn’t do 1 time what I saw Penney do twice in 1 game which was beat a pro bowl safety with the angle to the end zone . He’d have started in 2018 if I was HC .

I could understand your point had that been in Russell's first couple of games back from injury as he obviously returned way too soon, but his hand wasn't that big of an issue vs. the Rams. It was Russell's 5th game after returning from his injury. Besides, Penny gained 137 yards on 16 carries vs. the Texans the week before. Why wasn't Russell's hand an issue in that game?

Come on, man. Just go ahead and say it. Penny had a bad game against a very good team. Quit making excuses for him.

[Aseahawkfan]

I try to stay away from predictions this far out. The schedule doesn't look all that imposing. We have teams like the Lions and Jets, plus the NFC South is a pretty soft division with teams like the Panthers, Falcons, and Saints. We have the tendency to look at our team in a vacuum, not taking into consideration of the other teams around us that may have problems that exceed those of our own. The Cards have problems with their star QB. The Niners also have a quarterback controversy.

I have very little confidence that Penny will be able to stay healthy for more than half the season. To hear Hawktalk tell it, the only reason he missed any games was due to his major knee injury, but that's not true at all. He's missed games to hamstring pulls, calf muscle strains, knee strains. Even if he does manage to stay healthy, I'm not confident that he's finally 'found it'. The fact that we spent a 2nd day pick on a RB and resigned Penny to a one year prove it deal strongly suggests that Pete isn't that confident, either.

To me it isn't a prediction, it's just what's gonna happen. I expect a 6 to 9 win season. I guess we could sneak into the playoffs if enough teams are bad. No real contention in the playoffs. It will be the usual slow continued degradation and up and down years like we saw with Holmgren, Knox, and Carroll before Carroll finally retires or is let go and we move in another direction. To me we're at that point in the football cycle. I've seen it play out so many times over the years that it's a bit like the sun rising or gravity. Carroll kept us in a longer up period than usual, so it's been fun this time. And we finally got a Super Bowl, so that was cool. And not just any Super Bowl, but one of the most dominating Super Bowl victories in history. And we now get to brag about having one of the best defenses in history with a name like the Steel Curtain or The People Purple Eaters. So it's been a great 10 years. I'm sad we're on the downside now, but hey, it was gonna happen at some point.

I'm still gonna watch and see what happens like I always do even during the down years hoping for the best. I feel like we're in for a few years of the most exciting part of the Seahawks year being the draft.

I know you been watching long enough to know the periods I'm talking about and the football cycle.

But maybe we'll see Carroll pull off a 2nd coming. If any coach was gonna do it, it would be a coach like Carroll. So I do have some hope.

[RiverDog]

To me it isn't a prediction, it's just what's gonna happen. I expect a 6 to 9 win season. I guess we could sneak into the playoffs if enough teams are bad. No real contention in the playoffs. It will be the usual slow continued degradation and up and down years like we saw with Holmgren, Knox, and Carroll before Carroll finally retires or is let go and we move in another direction. To me we're at that point in the football cycle. I've seen it play out so many times over the years that it's a bit like the sun rising or gravity. Carroll kept us in a longer up period than usual, so it's been fun this time. And we finally got a Super Bowl, so that was cool. And not just any Super Bowl, but one of the most dominating Super Bowl victories in history. And we now get to brag about having one of the best defenses in history with a name like the Steel Curtain or The People Purple Eaters. So it's been a great 10 years. I'm sad we're on the downside now, but hey, it was gonna happen at some point.

I'm still gonna watch and see what happens like I always do even during the down years hoping for the best. I feel like we're in for a few years of the most exciting part of the Seahawks year being the draft.

I know you been watching long enough to know the periods I'm talking about and the football cycle.

But maybe we'll see Carroll pull off a 2nd coming. If any coach was gonna do it, it would be a coach like Carroll. So I do have some hope.

Like you, I do get the feeling that we're heading into a couple of years in a down cycle. I think Vegas has the over/under at 5.5 wins, but if I were a betting man, I'd take over, but only because it's easier to win 6 games than it is to lose 12.

I'm hoping that this past draft is the leading act of a "come to Jesus" moment Pete. I didn't see any of his typical reaches, his getting cute, the arrogance that led him to believe that draft positioning didn't matter, that he could spin straw into gold with lower round picks. If he really has had a significant change in the way he approaches football, then maybe he can pull it off. But I'm not holding my breath, either.

[Hawktawk]

[quote="RiverDog"]

[quote="Hawktawk"]Penney had 11 carries mostly from the pistol since Russell’s healed hand didn’t take many snaps under center . Russ refused to run or really even carry out the fake. My point about Carrie’s you should understand and do but you like arguing with me is a bell cow back needs fed . Not a couple handoffs mixed with someone else . He had one more touch then Dee Jay . In his entire career Dee Jay wouldn’t do 1 time what I saw Penney do twice in 1 game which was beat a pro bowl safety with the angle to the end zone . He’d have started in 2018 if I was HC .

I could understand your point had that been in Russell's first couple of games back from injury as he obviously returned way too soon, but his hand wasn't that big of an issue vs. the Rams. It was Russell's 5th game after returning from his injury. Besides, Penny gained 137 yards on 16 carries vs. the Texans the week before. Why wasn't Russell's hand an issue in that game?

Come on, man. Just go ahead and say it. Penny had a bad game against a very good team. Quit making excuses for him.




Penny had a bad average on 11 touches . Just like his even worse average on 7 touches vs the 9ers . After the game I said look out for Penney . Because he showed the power and burst on a couple of those touches . Look it up .

What might happen on carry 12? 13? 14? If he got all 22 carries and averaged 3.8 it’s a really bad game for him
. We know the dude has a 6.1 ypc average on 10 touches or more . Derrick Henry had about 30 yards vs seattle in the first half . How did that end up ? Carson had 20 yards on 14 carries in a playoff game and Penney had 27 on 4 in that same game . That’s a bad game Carson had there .

And again I watch the games , watched that one twice . It was surely Russels most checked out game of the year , all about protecting his body , not taking opportunities to run, one of the worst PFF grades of his career and like I say he was in the pistol most of the night . Refused to throw over the middle at all leading to the astounding observations of the broadcast team he had only thrown over the short middle 29 times all season . Seattle fans will be pleasantly surprised to see a normal functional offense again .

[NorthHawk]

Russell went to 2 Super Bowls not throwing over the middle and had over 30 comeback wins doing the same.

[Hawktawk]

Russell went to 2 Super Bowls not throwing over the middle and had over 30 comeback wins doing the same.

As recently as the beginning of last season I remember a quote from Bill Belichick prior to playing Seattle . “ he forces you to defend every square inch of the field “ in heaping praise on Wilson . I completely agreed at the time and when he had something like 25 TDs first 7 games I was sure he would win the MVP. Earlier in his career Russ threw everywhere . One over the middle we all want back . I think it’s still on his mind .

The offense under Russell has always been a bit hit or miss. Great QBs which he surely was have comebacks because they were behind . Now there’s no comebacks including 0 for 3 in 2 minute game end situations losing to 2 backups last year
It was not franchise play . Not worth the drama , It was time .

[NorthHawk]

Of course an opposing coach is going to say good things. Do you really expect him to say how they are going to defend
him?
Belichick is the last person in football who would say his plan is to take away the sidelines and force the QB to
throw inside the hash marks. It would take away his advantage.

[Hawktawk]

Russell lit them up anyway but we needed a goal line tackle of Newton to win . As for the GOAT bus comments about 2020 Wilson were genuine , not that monotone bs he always says about every team . The broadcaster pointed it out .
Russ had quit throwing between the hashes . Period . Brady attempts 7 such balls a game . Who has had more success ? It’s where you move chains , make room for your run game , control the clock . But it’s the riskiest place to throw as well . As an anylist said this year “ risk averse with a great deep ball”

I think it bears noting the Rams won the Super Bowl with a qb who threw 17 picks . Maybe risky balls not thrown leading to sacks and punts is a bigger problem then letting it fly in an NFL open window once in a while.