Mayfield

[Hawktawk]

Sherman’s wife told the police he had consumed 2 fifths of Jamison. That’s 36 units unless she’s lying . Good lord man I’ve read all the police reports . DUI is bad alway . Dangerous . Talking crap to cops and making threats is worse . Crashing and driving off on 3 wheels , menacing your family and actually fighting with cops is worse. Driving 156 in a 45 zone and killing someone still worse yet . The only comparison with Geno and those 2 is all were drinking and driving . You are splitting hairs to support an argument based on your Geno Bias . And I read the quotes from the judge about what Sherman has done in the community , pillar of the community .

Having been in the legal system for DUI I’m aware of sentencing guidelines . Extreme DUI is 2 to 365 days . What is hit and run ? Scuffling with cop. Attempted break in as his father in law was armed. And what was his penalty ? I’m guessing average guy is getting a couple months . I certainly don’t think he got that or much time at all. I’m done with the discussion .

[RiverDog]

Sherman’s wife told the police he had consumed 2 fifths of Jamison. That’s 36 units unless she’s lying.

Not exactly an impartial source. And like I said, had Sherman really drunk that much alcohol, he wouldn't have been able to stand up, let alone ram a door, so her story plain doesn't add up.

Good lord man I’ve read all the police reports . DUI is bad alway . Dangerous . Talking crap to cops and making threats is worse . Crashing and driving off on 3 wheels , menacing your family and actually fighting with cops is worse. Driving 156 in a 45 zone and killing someone still worse yet . The only comparison with Geno and those 2 is all were drinking and driving . You are splitting hairs to support an argument based on your Geno Bias . And I read the quotes from the judge about what Sherman has done in the community , pillar of the community .

Having been in the legal system for DUI I’m aware of sentencing guidelines . Extreme DUI is 2 to 365 days . What is hit and run ? Scuffling with cop. Attempted break in as his father in law was armed. And what was his penalty ? I’m guessing average guy is getting a couple months . I certainly don’t think he got that or much time at all. I’m done with the discussion .

If there were injuries at the scene of Sherman's accident, he would have been charged with hit and run. But there was only property damage, and obviously there's a question of the threshold of how much damage it takes for it to be a hit and run. If all you do is bend a stop sign and it didn't involve private property, you're not likely to be charged. All he did was hit a concrete barricade, so there couldn't have been a lot of damage except to his own vehicle. Indeed, Sherman was not charged with hit-and-run. He did plead guilty to speeding in construction zone, a criminal infraction, but was given credit for time served when he was arrested.

The other charges, including resisting arrest and DV/trespassing charges, all misdemeanors, were dismissed. They will not proceed with misdemeanor DV/trespassing charges if there wasn't a complainant filed by his father-in-law, and the resisting arrest charge was likely dismissed because he didn't have a history of violence or a criminal record. Prosecutors don't like pursuing resisting arrest charges unless they're really serious because it means pulling several cops out of the rotation to testify in court. In any event, we simply don't have enough evidence to say that Sherman was treated differently than any other suspect.

Bottom line is that we don't have enough evidence to determine whether or not Sherman received favorable treatment as without you or me doing some extensive research, neither of us know what the precedent is for those types of crimes. But as I said, with the news environment like it is today and thanks to the Freedom of Information Act, anyone could examine past sentences for similar crimes and compare them with Serman's, and with such a high profile case as this one, I find it extremely unlikely that any prosecutor or judge would ask for/grant a sentence for anything other than what is standard for such a case.

I'll leave you alone on your Geno love affair, at least for now.

[NorthHawk]

It's not about how much is consumed, it's about BAC as RD said.
You could drink a whole bottle of Vodka then puke your guts out and although still impaired, your BAC would not reflect what you consumed.
Who knows whether Sherman was physically sick before getting into the car or just after. Was he watched all the time he was drinking or
did they leave the room and did Sherman spill a bunch of it? Who knows but these things happen so what is said to be consumed hasn't
much relevance - only the BAC at the time of arrest.
He was impaired. He paid the price and we all hope it's a lessen well learned by him and maybe others who are at risk of substance abuse.

[c_hawkbob]

If all you do is bend a stop sign and it didn't involve private property, you're not likely to be charged.

Single car rollover in a winding canyon road (on the way to work in Utah), no damage to anything but my car, and I was charged with leaving the scene of an accident with more than $500 damage. Might be a state by state thing, but damage to public or someone else's property isn't the threshold for charges in my experience.

[RiverDog]

If all you do is bend a stop sign and it didn't involve private property, you're not likely to be charged.

Single car rollover in a winding canyon road (on the way to work in Utah), no damage to anything but my car, and I was charged with leaving the scene of an accident with more than $500 damage. Might be a state by state thing, but damage to public or someone else's property isn't the threshold for charges in my experience.

I think you're right as I found a RCW code and there is no difference noted between damage of private or personal property regarding hit and run. However, all I could find was "property damage" and no monetary amount was given. But your $500 threshold sounds about right. I know that I had an employee that plead guilty to malicious mischief domestic violence for throwing rocks at his girlfriend's house not knowing that he was pleading guilty to a felony, and when I looked it up, the threshold for a felony was $500+. Our policy at the time was to fire anyone convicted of a felony crime, so we canned him for throwing rocks at his girlfriend's house.

In any event, Sherman was not charged with leaving the scene of the accident:

Here are the five misdemeanor charges filed Friday:

Driving While Under the Influence (1st time: gross misdemeanor), Reckless Endangerment of Roadway Workers (gross misdemeanor), Criminal Trespass in the Second Degree – domestic violence (misdemeanor), Malicious Mischief in the Third Degree - domestic violence (gross misdemeanor) Resisting Arrest (misdemeanor)

He ended up pleading guilty to three of them. Resisting arrest and malicious mischief were dropped, the DUI was reduced to first degree negligent driving, and the speeding in a construction zone was a gross misdemeanor of which Sherman was sentenced to two days in jail but was credited with time already served after his arrest.

But my point is that there's nothing that we know of that would indicate that Sherman received favorable treatment in his sentencing.

[tarlhawk]

I feel like we are looking for a QB to fairly compete with Drew Lock...hence the talk of bringing back Geno Smith and another mystery vet QB ...2nd/3rd Rd QB drafted. Baker would command too much cap room...we seem to be resolved to exploiting the luxury of having a rookie QB under contract as we restock our talent base.

[RiverDog]

I feel like we are looking for a QB to fairly compete with Drew Lock...hence the talk of bringing back Geno Smith and another mystery vet QB ...2nd/3rd Rd QB drafted. Baker would command too much cap room...we seem to be resolved to exploiting the luxury of having a rookie QB under contract as we restock our talent base.

Agreed about Mayfield, but my objections go beyond the financial aspect. I think he's over rated and I don't like the vibe coming out of his former locker room.

I hope we're resolved to exploit the luxury of having a rookie QB. I wouldn't mind spending one of those two 2nd rounders on a QB should one of them fall to us and would rather us get an impact player to fill a spot in the trenches before we pursue our QBOTF.

[c_hawkbob]

If we get past day two without having drafted a QB I still think we may look at Baker. And I think the same can be said of a few teams.

[NorthHawk]

If we get past day two without having drafted a QB I still think we may look at Baker. And I think the same can be said of a few teams.

At that point the Browns might be more enthused about getting rid of him, too but the investigation into Watson may mean a suspension for him by the NFL. They
might be in a jam at the start of the season.
I think we're going to draft a QB at some point this year and maybe in the middle rounds instead of the 7th or UFA.

[Oly]

At that point the Browns might be more enthused about getting rid of him, too but the investigation into Watson may mean a suspension for him by the NFL. They
might be in a jam at the start of the season.
I think we're going to draft a QB at some point this year and maybe in the middle rounds instead of the 7th or UFA.

Good point about the Watson investigation meaning that the Browns might not be eager to trade Mayfield. They clearly think it's a possibility given the contract they gave him. Given that uncertainty, I think the Browns would be very hesitant to let Mayfield go for what I think he's worth: a Day 2 pick at best. I personally wouldn't want the Hawks to give up anything more than a 4th rounder for him. If I'm the Browns, I'd hold onto Mayfield until I know if Watson will play. Who knows the timeline for that decision, but let's say it's not until camp. That leaves two options: (1) Watson can't play, in which case Mayfield has to stay. (2) Watson can play, in which case I will trade low or cut him just to get his attitude out of the locker room. Is it worth forgoing a 3rd round pick via trade for the safety net in case Scenario #1 happens? Again, if I'm the Browns, the answer is yes, meaning I'm not trading Mayfield unless someone makes an offer I can't refuse.

Assuming I'm right--which probably isn't a good assumption--that means the Hawks can't plan on Mayfield. They'll have to plan to start camp with a really shitty QB situation, but it also means that in the case that Mayfield becomes available, it will be on the cheap.

[NorthHawk]

Given that if we traded for Mayfield we would have to assume his existing contract, I doubt we trade for him as an $18M hit to the Cap wouldn't be worth the off chance
that he would improve the team enough to justify it.
If he's cut by the Browns then he might be a possibility on a one year prove it type of deal - should he want to come here.

[Hawktawk]

Why are you sure we will start camp with such a “ $h1tty situation “ at QB? If it’s Geno I have all the confidence in the world assuming he’s got Uber or an interlock device. Relatively short sample but HT thinks we would improve on this years record significantly if he played like he did in his 13 quarters . He’s 6.3.5 and used the entire field with an accurate powereful arm
Mobile enough . Beloved by teammates .

. I’m fascinated by Locke and also the fact that Fant has caught 70 plus balls from him
, more than any other Denver Receiver. He says Drew’s arm is his biggest attribute . Said he’s seen some “ insane “ throws Having watched some film I will say he has one of the most high velocity spirals I’ve ever seen . He’s mobile , 6’4”.



I’m gonna trust Pete and John . I have no choice but I have a better sense of optimism about next year than I did about this one because I already knew the QB situation was a mess with a guy who wanted out . PC and JS might just have one hell of an Okeydoke for Denver and their doubters up their sleeve .

[RiverDog]

Why are you sure we will start camp with such a “ $h1tty situation “ at QB? If it’s Geno I have all the confidence in the world assuming he’s got Uber or an interlock device. Relatively short sample but HT thinks we would improve on this years record significantly if he played like he did in his 13 quarters . He’s 6.3.5 and used the entire field with an accurate powereful arm
Mobile enough . Beloved by teammates.

Last time I checked, Geno was a free agent. Has anything changed?

I’m fascinated by Locke and also the fact that Fant has caught 70 plus balls from him
, more than any other Denver Receiver. He says Drew’s arm is his biggest attribute . Said he’s seen some “ insane “ throws Having watched some film I will say he has one of the most high velocity spirals I’ve ever seen . He’s mobile , 6’4”.

I’m gonna trust Pete and John . I have no choice but I have a better sense of optimism about next year than I did about this one because I already knew the QB situation was a mess with a guy who wanted out . PC and JS might just have one hell of an Okeydoke for Denver and their doubters up their sleeve .

Did I read you right, that you feel that our "QB mess" was worse last season than it is now?

[Hawktawk]

Did I read you right, that you feel that our "QB mess" was worse last season than it is now?

Well it’s hindsight now but I said trade Russ now when he made his comments trashing his line and had his agent leaking teams so yeah I knew we had a mess. After 11-29 and the comments I felt it was time regardless of who Russ had been and what he had done . I said before the year Russ was our biggest question . The answer is I was absolutely right . We just delayed the process a year setting the whole team back and probably costing the team another first rounder .
Yeah if we’re going to play Pete ball Genos an improvement over Russ who refused to play it . Lockes a huge wild card with his physical attributes. I’m gonna trust in Pete Carroll with a physically talented athlete that he can develop him like he did so many college studs he coached up every year . Spare the raft of crap but whatever they did with Geno made him a completely different qb than early
In his career . If they do that for Locke with his hose of an arm , mobility and size it’s gonna be a fun season .
Not sure what’s up with Geno . Maybe he’s stupid . His greatest value and opportunity is here .

[NorthHawk]

Russ played Pete Ball to a tee. He was the perfect fit for it but it becomes less interesting over time doing the same things over and over.

[Hawktawk]

Russ played Pete Ball to a tee. He was the perfect fit for it but it becomes less interesting over time doing the same things over and over.

Early in his career yes . Later no

[Hawktawk]

]Russ played Pete Ball to a tee. He was the perfect fit for it but it becomes less interesting over time doing the same things over and over.

Early in his career yes . Later no. And think about what you are arguing . He’s the PERFECT FIT FOR PETE BALL which got to 2 superbowls but he doesn’t want to play it . Coach knew best . Still does .

[NorthHawk]

Early in his career yes . Later no. And think about what you are arguing . He’s the PERFECT FIT FOR PETE BALL which got to 2 superbowls but he doesn’t want to play it . Coach knew best . Still does .

\

It didn't help that the FO (meaning PC and JS) let the talent drain from the team and pissed off the best QB they ever had.
He may have not been happy playing Pete Ball but he was the best at it. Pete's staid Offense pushed away the most talented player left
on Offense and he's stuck in the past with his Offensive philosophy. We're now on the way to wasting DK's talents as well so Pete's game
will end up meaning we will be stuck in the bottom 10 or maybe worse for the next few years - or until the Defense gets rebuilt.

What is odd is that he willingly embraces change on Defense and gets players who have special qualities and adjusts the Defense to take
advantage of said abilities, but on Offense he boxes players in. It shows a lack of awareness of where the NFL is at today and what is
needed to succeed on both sides of the ball.

[Hawktawk]

The loyalty is admirable . But missing open receivers and taking silly sacks is not the fault of the offense . In his final playoff game he attempted 29 passes and completed 11 with DK, Lockett, Swain , David Moore etc to throw to and Donald out half the game . Oh and beginning the game against a free agent in Wofford and winding up losing to a guy with a broken hand weeks from being traded . Jimmy Garoplolo has more playoff wins in the last 7 years and they play a version of Pete Ball too. North we can beat it to death . You blame Pete all you want . I think the truths in the middle but I don’t care for guys making 35 million getting pist about not getting to run the offense . He ran it off a cliff in 49 and we have 3 wild card wins since . In 2 of our 5 playoff losses since he’s thrown pick 6s and we have trailed by multiple scores before scoring at all in most of the games . North this is the same offense that averaged 11 plus wins most likely over the last decade .

We’ve got a few months to wait to find out. We’re playing Pete ball with one of the best coaches of the decade . We will have DK , Lockett, Penney and maybe Carson , Fant and Dissly and our baby Harvin Eskridge surrounding whoever is behind center.

Russ is playing for an offensive coordinator in his first HC gig who says the offense will be “whatever Russ wants “. He’s finally getting to be Payton Manning . News flash Aaron Rodgers makes his OC look pretty good most of the time .
So we will definitely have an answer soon . Let’s see . Someone is gonna be right and someone wrong . I think JS and PC have a serious chub to clear their name and prove a point . I’m sure Russ feels the same.

[Hawktawk]

And regarding the OP mayfield told reporters he believes Seattle is his next destination. True or not it seems like quite a party foul for the soeculee to be out in front of his skis like that . I’ve come to hope it doesn’t happen .

[RiverDog]

And regarding the OP mayfield told reporters he believes Seattle is his next destination. True or not it seems like quite a party foul for the soeculee to be out in front of his skis like that . I’ve come to hope it doesn’t happen .

It would appear that the Browns and Mayfield are going to have to wait until after the draft before a team comes forward, if one ever does. If a QB hungry team, which includes the Hawks, comes away from the draft w/o a quarterback, then they may be more willing to cut a deal. There's also the possibility that the Browns hold onto him, although at this point, both sides have pretty much burned the bridges.

[c_hawkbob]

And regarding the OP mayfield told reporters he believes Seattle is his next destination. True or not it seems like quite a party foul for the soeculee to be out in front of his skis like that . I’ve come to hope it doesn’t happen .

It would appear that the Browns and Mayfield are going to have to wait until after the draft before a team comes forward, if one ever does. If a QB hungry team, which includes the Hawks, comes away from the draft w/o a quarterback, then they may be more willing to cut a deal. There's also the possibility that the Browns hold onto him, although at this point, both sides have pretty much burned the bridges.

I've already said I think it'll be after the second day of the draft we'll go after him if we haven't drafted a QB.

[RiverDog]

It would appear that the Browns and Mayfield are going to have to wait until after the draft before a team comes forward, if one ever does. If a QB hungry team, which includes the Hawks, comes away from the draft w/o a quarterback, then they may be more willing to cut a deal.

There's also the possibility that the Browns hold onto him, although at this point, both sides have pretty much burned the bridges.

I've already said I think it'll be after the second day of the draft we'll go after him if we haven't drafted a QB.

I hope we don't, but I'm afraid that you might be right, especially if Pete truly believes that we're not rebuilding. If we do, I hope that it's a low risk trade, like a 3rd day draft pick.

[Aseahawkfan]

Derek Carr just received a 12o million 3 year extension? Sheesh. QB pay seems to be out of control.

[NorthHawk]

Derek Carr just received a 12o million 3 year extension? Sheesh. QB pay seems to be out of control.

In a few years he will be considered underpaid with those salaries increasing so quickly.

[Old but Slow]

With the sky rocketing money being thrown at QBs, teams may begin to adjust by deemphasizing the position. Smart money now seems to aim to go with a point guard/game manager type QB, keeping through his first contract and then rinse and repeat. Surround a middling quarterback with weapons (acquired because money has been saved at QB), and emphasize the running game.

Common wisdom says that you need a franchise QB to win a championship, and while that is often the case, exceptions exist, as a list of Supurb Owl winners will attest. Teams win, and no signal caller can carry a bad team to a title.

Watson, for example, may have some immediate success with the team that is already there, but soon those support players will need new contracts, and there will be no money to sign them. Then comes a team of retreads and wannabes.

Could happen. Or not.

[NorthHawk]

I hope we don't, but I'm afraid that you might be right, especially if Pete truly believes that we're not rebuilding. If we do, I hope that it's a low risk trade, like a 3rd day draft pick.

Didn’t Pete say we we “resetting” and not rebuilding back around 2018?
It didn’t go very well then, so why should we think it will go well this time without a top QB?

[RiverDog]

I hope we don't, but I'm afraid that you might be right, especially if Pete truly believes that we're not rebuilding. If we do, I hope that it's a low risk trade, like a 3rd day draft pick.

Didn’t Pete say we we “resetting” and not rebuilding back around 2018? It didn’t go very well then, so why should we think it will go well this time without a top QB?

Where did I say that I thought it would go well? I'm only saying that if Pete thinks we're not rebuilding, that he might make a move to get Mayfield.

[RiverDog]

With the sky rocketing money being thrown at QBs, teams may begin to adjust by deemphasizing the position. Smart money now seems to aim to go with a point guard/game manager type QB, keeping through his first contract and then rinse and repeat. Surround a middling quarterback with weapons (acquired because money has been saved at QB), and emphasize the running game.

Common wisdom says that you need a franchise QB to win a championship, and while that is often the case, exceptions exist, as a list of Supurb Owl winners will attest. Teams win, and no signal caller can carry a bad team to a title.

Watson, for example, may have some immediate success with the team that is already there, but soon those support players will need new contracts, and there will be no money to sign them. Then comes a team of retreads and wannabes.

Could happen. Or not.

I don't think that they'll ever be able to de-emphasize the quarterback position. The media is always going to want a star to keep viewers tuned in.

But yeah, it is getting way out of balance if a QB like Derek Carr, who hasn't done squat since he came into the league, can bring home that big of a paycheck.

[NorthHawk]

Where did I say that I thought it would go well? I'm only saying that if Pete thinks we're not rebuilding, that he might make a move to get Mayfield.

Sorry, I meant it as a general rhetorical statement.

[RiverDog]

Sorry, I meant it as a general rhetorical statement.

No need to apologize, but thanks all the same.

[Hawktawk]

Derek Carr just received a 12o million 3 year extension? Sheesh. QB pay seems to be out of control.

I thought he played admirably last year with all the turmoil surrounding the team between Gruden and Ruggs and Arnette etc. Not crazy stats but leadership and the first team ever to make a postseason after firing a coach and bringing in a interim coach.

Ill have my popcorn out for Raiders Broncos twice a year with Russel's agent leaking LV as a potential trade destination a year ago .


Speaking of extensions I would think Denver and Russel would be working on something if this is what Carr is gonna make.

[RiverDog]

Speaking of extensions I would think Denver and Russel would be working on something if this is what Carr is gonna make.

Oh, I'm sure that Russell and the Broncos have had quite extensive discussions about a framework for an extension well before the trade. The Broncos wouldn't have traded the resources they did if they hadn't had some sort of understanding or gentleman's agreement. But yea, the Watson and Carr deals likely shook up a lot of people in the Bronco organization.

[mykc14]

With the sky rocketing money being thrown at QBs, teams may begin to adjust by deemphasizing the position. Smart money now seems to aim to go with a point guard/game manager type QB, keeping through his first contract and then rinse and repeat. Surround a middling quarterback with weapons (acquired because money has been saved at QB), and emphasize the running game.

Common wisdom says that you need a franchise QB to win a championship, and while that is often the case, exceptions exist, as a list of Supurb Owl winners will attest. Teams win, and no signal caller can carry a bad team to a title.

Watson, for example, may have some immediate success with the team that is already there, but soon those support players will need new contracts, and there will be no money to sign them. Then comes a team of retreads and wannabes.

Could happen. Or not.

I actually agree that this may happen. It's not sustainable (especially a contract like Watson's, perhaps the stupidest contract in NFL history) and what I was alluding to when I started the thread about us ever being able to win with RW. No QB has every won the SB when they are taking up more than 13% of the cap and most were under 10%. I'm sure eventually it will happen when, what I am going to call "The Tom Brady Effect," is no longer in play but it still seems extremely difficult. You just don't have the depth or overall talent on your roster to make it through three tough games in the playoffs.

I am glad the Hawks are on the front of this movement. RW has some decent cap years for the Broncos right now because the Hawks are paying his dead money but I don't think there is anyway the Broncos will be competitive when RW's cap hit gets in that 13% plus of the cap range.

[TriCitySam]

For the Broncos RW has a $24MM cap # this year and $27MM next - but that's his last year, and so will want the new contract next year. They'll get two years with him, but then it get expensive. So, he'll be 36 after that and cost a lot. So Denver better cash in in the next 2 years.

[RiverDog]

For the Broncos RW has a $24MM cap # this year and $27MM next - but that's his last year, and so will want the new contract next year. They'll get two years with him, but then it get expensive. So, he'll be 36 after that and cost a lot. So Denver better cash in in the next 2 years.

Yup. Especially now that Watson signed for $50m/season and a wanna be like Derek Carr signed for an embarrassingly overpaid $40M. The more I see, the better I feel about the Wilson trade.

[c_hawkbob]

For the Broncos RW has a $24MM cap # this year and $27MM next - but that's his last year, and so will want the new contract next year. They'll get two years with him, but then it get expensive. So, he'll be 36 after that and cost a lot. So Denver better cash in in the next 2 years.

Yup. Especially now that Watson signed for $50m/season and a wanna be like Derek Carr signed for an embarrassingly overpaid $40M. The more I see, the better I feel about the Wilson trade.

Not me. The more I see the more evident it is that Wilson wasn't overpaid and that we're gonna wind up having to pay more to get much less. Or just suck until we get a new front office.

[NorthHawk]

I read something yesterday that said the guaranteed money for Carr is only $25M over the life of the contract.

Regarding salaries I’ve heard/read a number of people talking about the Cap increasing by about 20% or to about
$240M or more in the next few years with the new TV/gambling/streaming contracts. So the QB salaries might
not be so bad but the fully guaranteed part really rocks the boat and may put other teams in a bind in negotiations.

[mykc14]

For the Broncos RW has a $24MM cap # this year and $27MM next - but that's his last year, and so will want the new contract next year. They'll get two years with him, but then it get expensive. So, he'll be 36 after that and cost a lot. So Denver better cash in in the next 2 years.

I would say they have three years, maybe even 4 depending on how they structure his next contract. Even if he has a 50 mil/year average they could probably get two years at under 35 mil/year, but then they will be paying out their a$$. That is what other big QB contracts have done. They can also add a few void years if they really want to push that money down the road. A good example might be Aaron Rodgers who has cap hits 28, 31, 40, 59, 53...

[mykc14]

I read something yesterday that said the guaranteed money for Carr is only $25M over the life of the contract.

Regarding salaries I’ve heard/read a number of people talking about the Cap increasing by about 20% or to about
$240M or more in the next few years with the new TV/gambling/streaming contracts. So the QB salaries might
not be so bad but the fully guaranteed part really rocks the boat and may put other teams in a bind in negotiations.

Yeah, the Raiders are in pretty good shape if they want to move on from him for any reason.