Trade Metcalf

[tarlhawk]

Pete is hands on but not to the extent that he would smother Waldrons schemes...and Drew Lock is 6' 4" so the middle of the field on crossing patterns might become his forte...DK and Lockett are hard to contain with single coverage...and our current O-line was opening into zone blocks on opponents LB as our season closed so Penny might be the real deal. We don't have to sign an extension for DK and being so young his trade value won't "plummet" if we don't extend him under next years cap...or utilize the rare use of Franchise Tag in 2023. Its not URGENT that we trade DK...can Lock bond with a player who could elevate his skill sets??

[NorthHawk]

Pete is hands on but not to the extent that he would smother Waldrons schemes...and Drew Lock is 6' 4" so the middle of the field on crossing patterns might become his forte...DK and Lockett are hard to contain with single coverage...and our current O-line was opening into zone blocks on opponents LB as our season closed so Penny might be the real deal. We don't have to sign an extension for DK and being so young his trade value won't "plummet" if we don't extend him under next years cap...or utilize the rare use of Franchise Tag in 2023. Its not URGENT that we trade DK...can Lock bond with a player who could elevate his skill sets??

Yes he would smother Waldron’s schemes. He did it with Schottenheimer and pulled in the reins to play
“his brand of football”. He has an Offensive philosophy that is pretty bland relative to today’s Offenses
and it’s predicated on being conservative.

If lock is the QB, expect a very conservative Offense. He’s not had a lot of experience and showed some ability
but also made some big mistakes. With Pete’s focus on protecting the ball, I doubt we see much action for
either Lockett or Metcalf.

[RiverDog]

Pete is hands on but not to the extent that he would smother Waldrons schemes...and Drew Lock is 6' 4" so the middle of the field on crossing patterns might become his forte...DK and Lockett are hard to contain with single coverage...and our current O-line was opening into zone blocks on opponents LB as our season closed so Penny might be the real deal. We don't have to sign an extension for DK and being so young his trade value won't "plummet" if we don't extend him under next years cap...or utilize the rare use of Franchise Tag in 2023. Its not URGENT that we trade DK...can Lock bond with a player who could elevate his skill sets??

Metcalf doesn't require a double team to be shut down, but he does usually require a team's best corner. Jalen Ramsey has done a whale of a job on him.

It's not urgent that we trade Metcalf, but the most opportune time is between now and the draft. Once teams make their selections and set their rosters, the market dries up substantially. And I don't like the idea of slapping the FT on a player simply to trade him. If we're not going to be willing to sign him to a contract north of $25M/year, then why wait?

[Hawktawk]

Keep him . He was uncoverable with a pure junk shelf loser backup throwing to him . Whoever is behind center needs him .

Seattle needs him . Russ should have been traded a year ago when he turned up the volume on his whining and had his agent leak names of teams . I said so at the time and we would have been a year into the process . We already know DK was better with someone else throwing to him this year and happier too but we would really really know.

That’s the mistake John and Pete made , trying to appease Russ one more year . Russ is gone now for less than he’d have brought a year ago . Don’t unilaterally disarm and tell us you’re not rebuilding . There’s one DK in the league .
In other news Noah Fant had kind words for Locke “ his arm is his biggest attribute . I’ve seen some insane throws “. He thinks the potential is there. Interesting he’s caught more balls from Locke as a pro than anyone else has .

[RiverDog]

Keep him . He was uncoverable with a pure junk shelf loser backup throwing to him . Whoever is behind center needs him .

Seattle needs him . Russ should have been traded a year ago when he turned up the volume on his whining and had his agent leak names of teams . I said so at the time and we would have been a year into the process . We already know DK was better with someone else throwing to him this year and happier too but we would really really know.

That’s the mistake John and Pete made , trying to appease Russ one more year . Russ is gone now for less than he’d have brought a year ago . Don’t unilaterally disarm and tell us you’re not rebuilding . There’s one DK in the league .
In other news Noah Fant had kind words for Locke “ his arm is his biggest attribute . I’ve seen some insane throws “. He thinks the potential is there. Interesting he’s caught more balls from Locke as a pro than anyone else has .

Nonsense. Metcalf was not/is not uncoverable. Jalen Ramsey, who gives up 3" in height to Metcalf, has shut him down on a number of occasions. Here's one:

In Los Angeles’ Week 10 victory, Metcalf had just two catches for 28 yards on only four targets. In that game, cornerback Jalen Ramsey largely shut Metcalf down.

And there were others:

This was a matchup that has a history due in part to the Rams and Seahawks meeting three times last season.

Ramsey vs. Metcalf in 2020:

Week 10: 0 catches
Week 16: 1 catch, 11 yards
Wildcard: 3 catches, 33 yards

If you want to keep Metcalf, then you'd better get out your wallet. If we keep him, then that means that we'll be resigning him to a contract worth at least $25M, and combined with Lockett's deal, it adds up to over $40M for the wide receiver position, not counting the other 4-5 WR's we'll need to fill out the roster. That's over 20% of the salary cap for one position, and a non critical position at that. Not a good way to run a railroad.

Pete's never going to admit that he's rebuilding. It goes against the grain of his "win forever" motto. But there's no way that we're not rebuilding when we don't have a quarterback and we let our biggest star on defense walk.

[c_hawkbob]

He's talking, again, about that one game Geno had in which he was so successful throwing to DK, and being facetious about describing Geno the way you do (to his mind).

[TriCitySam]

I agree with those who could go either way. Meaning, I love DK and if we can keep him and it's not insane (I don't think you build around a WR), then that's good. But looking at what kind of production we would likely get in our scheme it becomes a question of whether you can replace that production at a cheaper price. If we're only counting on 1,000 yards or so, then maybe be a good trade is in order.

[RiverDog]

I agree with those who could go either way. Meaning, I love DK and if we can keep him and it's not insane (I don't think you build around a WR), then that's good. But looking at what kind of production we would likely get in our scheme it becomes a question of whether you can replace that production at a cheaper price. If we're only counting on 1,000 yards or so, then maybe be a good trade is in order.

Just a FYI, here's Metcalf's receiving yardage totals, ypg (to account for the 17 game season), and overall ranking:

2019 900 56.3 34th
2020 1303 81.4 7th
2021 967 56.9 28th

The other stat that I think is worth a discussion is his receptions-to-target percentage:

2019 58/100 58%
2020 83/129 64%
2021 75/129 58%

And for comparison, Tyler Lockett's ratio over the same span of time:

2019 82/110 75%
2020 83/129 64%
2021 73/107 68%

That doesn't necessarily mean that Metcalf drops the ball a lot, although that obviously could be a factor, but rather it suggests that he's one dimensional, that we're throwing the ball deeper to him on lower percentage passes and don't use him a lot over the middle or on short bubble screens. So do you want to pay $25M+ for that kind of production?

[NorthHawk]

That's pretty much Pete's Offense though. Run then throw deep. Every team knows that's what we are going to do because it hasn't changed
for over 10 years with the exception of early 2020 when Russ and Schotty were able to let loose. We had to do it because the Defense stunk to
high heaven but when it went off the rails for 2 games, Pete pulled back the reins and we went back to the same old, same old.

[RiverDog]

That's pretty much Pete's Offense though. Run then throw deep. Every team knows that's what we are going to do because it hasn't changed
for over 10 years with the exception of early 2020 when Russ and Schotty were able to let loose. We had to do it because the Defense stunk to
high heaven but when it went off the rails for 2 games, Pete pulled back the reins and we went back to the same old, same old.

But how much of that was influenced by Russell's obvious desire to throw deep, especially once we brought in Metcalf? Now that we're going to have a new QB, it's fair to assume that whoever it is isn't likely going to want to be taking as many deep shots, that they'll want to concentrate on the short and intermediate throws in order to build confidence and pad their resume a bit, especially if our QB is Drew Lock, who needs to improve on his accuracy and reduce his turnovers.

Knowing how adverse Pete is to turnovers, it's fair to assume that we'll be concentrating on shorter, easier throws, something we should have been doing more often when Russell was our QB. That doesn't play to the strengths of a receiver like Metcalf.

[NorthHawk]

It’s the basically the same style of Offense he had at USC with Palmer and Sanchez, etc.

[RiverDog]

It’s the basically the same style of Offense he had at USC with Palmer and Sanchez, etc.

How often did Russell throw deep in his earlier years? I don't have any stats available to support my suspicion, but I'm willing to bet that it was a lot less often than in his past 3-4 years.

[NorthHawk]

Sure, Pete’s Offense has that as part of it. Chunk throws I think is what he called it.
So as his confidence in Wilson grew, he allowed more deep throws. But everyone
knew it was coming because the offense barely changed. Same formations same
plays and no imagination.

[RiverDog]

Sure, Pete’s Offense has that as part of it. Chunk throws I think is what he called it.
So as his confidence in Wilson grew, he allowed more deep throws. But everyone
knew it was coming because the offense barely changed. Same formations same
plays and no imagination.

The point I'm trying to get to is how useful will Metcalf really be in our offense of the next couple of years? Is it likely that Pete is going to allow more deep throws from someone like Lock that he hasn't developed that confidence level in and that has a bad TD/INT ratio and a low completion percentage?

[NorthHawk]

I think his productivity will fall because of Pete not trusting the QB and more emphasis on the run game.
It’s why I don’t think extending him at a starting QB cost is a good investment.
We’ll see what happens, though.

[tarlhawk]

Waldron and our QB coach (Carl??) will have inputs but hitting DK or Tyler on middle crossing routes can easily turn into explosive plays. Noah Fant said Drew made some insane throws so he'll be tempered on deep routes depending on the pocket time our O-line affords him and he'll be hammered with being "safe" with his tosses.

With confidence he can provide similar opportunities as any QB in the 2022 class...so conservative plays until he gains Pete's trust. DK 's strength is deep routes but he has that power/speed blend that never got exploited under RW because of RW's uncanny deep accuracy. Russel put the work in...we don't know Drew's dedication other than his press conference promises.

[Hawktawk]

He's talking, again, about that one game Geno had in which he was so successful throwing to DK, and being facetious about describing Geno the way you do (to his mind).

In 3 games and a quarter Geno was 17 for 21 targeting Metcalf for 251 yards, 4 TDs including the clincher on the 98 yard drive vs the Rams. Even in his worst game as a starter vs the saints He hooked up with DK on a 60 plus yard td strike beating Marshawn Lattimore like a junkyard dog in the process. That same D shut out Brady a few weeks later. Geno compiled a 151 QBR targeting DK. It was his final game vs the Jags that DK caught 2 absolute lasers for TDs and tweeted post game" Ive never had a ball like that". That was Genos 80% completion 138 QBR game before the heroic Russ fought his way back to health to save the season,,,,, , DK caught his next touchdown pass in Russel's 7th game back vs the bears.In 2 of Genos 3 games he completed over 70% of his passes. Against the Steelers he comnpleted passes to 10 receivers. Against Jax he completed 10 to Lockett in the FIRST HALF. You don't have a clue what you are talking about regarding the remarkably consistent connection Geno had with the receivers..

Bob you're the same guy I always remember. You support the teams stars till their last breath and that is admirable. I do as long as they help Seattle win and are glad to be here. Im ruthless that way, thanks for the memories but GTFO, we can reminisce later.

You hung on to SA, hung on to Hass. But they just faded away with class. I really have no Idea what happened to Russ. 25 games ago I thought he was on his way to his first MVP and here we are. Im as clueless as anyone whats really going on between his ears but he wasn't helping us, he wanted to leave and he did.

Next man up whoever it is but If its Geno Im not nearly as worried as you all are.
Especially if they have DK to throw to.

[Hawktawk]

Keep him . He was uncoverable with a pure junk shelf loser backup throwing to him . Whoever is behind center needs him .

Seattle needs him . Russ should have been traded a year ago when he turned up the volume on his whining and had his agent leak names of teams . I said so at the time and we would have been a year into the process . We already know DK was better with someone else throwing to him this year and happier too but we would really really know.

That’s the mistake John and Pete made , trying to appease Russ one more year . Russ is gone now for less than he’d have brought a year ago . Don’t unilaterally disarm and tell us you’re not rebuilding . There’s one DK in the league .
In other news Noah Fant had kind words for Locke “ his arm is his biggest attribute . I’ve seen some insane throws “. He thinks the potential is there. Interesting he’s caught more balls from Locke as a pro than anyone else has .

Nonsense. Metcalf was not/is not uncoverable. Jalen Ramsey, who gives up 3" in height to Metcalf, has shut him down on a number of occasions. Here's one:

In Los Angeles’ Week 10 victory, Metcalf had just two catches for 28 yards on only four targets. In that game, cornerback Jalen Ramsey largely shut Metcalf down.

And there were others:

This was a matchup that has a history due in part to the Rams and Seahawks meeting three times last season.

Ramsey vs. Metcalf in 2020:

Week 10: 0 catches
Week 16: 1 catch, 11 yards
Wildcard: 3 catches, 33 yards

If you want to keep Metcalf, then you'd better get out your wallet. If we keep him, then that means that we'll be resigning him to a contract worth at least $25M, and combined with Lockett's deal, it adds up to over $40M for the wide receiver position, not counting the other 4-5 WR's we'll need to fill out the roster. That's over 20% of the salary cap for one position, and a non critical position at that. Not a good way to run a railroad.

Pete's never going to admit that he's rebuilding. It goes against the grain of his "win forever" motto. But there's no way that we're not rebuilding when we don't have a quarterback and we let our biggest star on defense walk.[/quote]

Did you watch the games? Russ had pretty much given up on targeting tightly guarded receivers preferring the out sideline routes and deep shots where his guy gets it or nobody. As a scout said "risk averse with a great deep ball". By comparison Matthew Stafford led the league in picks and pick 6 s.

Geno had no problems finding DK nor would anyone else and if you've seen Locke throw a ball he can throw it about 70 yards. Any NFL QB can throw it to DK and Lockett, part of what POs me about Russell claiming he didnt have any help. Watch the games.
DK was wide open a lot.

[RiverDog]

Did you watch the games? Russ had pretty much given up on targeting tightly guarded receivers preferring the out sideline routes and deep shots where his guy gets it or nobody. As a scout said "risk averse with a great deep ball". By comparison Matthew Stafford led the league in picks and pick 6 s.

Geno had no problems finding DK nor would anyone else and if you've seen Locke throw a ball he can throw it about 70 yards. Any NFL QB can throw it to DK and Lockett, part of what POs me about Russell claiming he didnt have any help. Watch the games.
DK was wide open a lot.

Of course, I watched the games. Are you being sarcastic?

You were putting your usual overblown spin on your latest Flavor of the Day by saying that Metcalf was uncoverable, to which I called BS and showed you several examples to prove that he wasn't. You replied by using your usual, cherry picked small sample of Geno's playing time that not a single poster in here is buying.

So yeah, watch the games. All 17 of them. Good advice, you should try taking it.

[NorthHawk]

Risk averse describes Pete Ball pretty accurately.

[Hawktawk]

Risk averse describes Pete Ball pretty accurately.

The scout is describing Russell’s game , not the scheme . At the conclusion of the second Rams game Russ had attempted 29 passes into the short middle of the field all season . Brady throws 7 balls a game there . Another scout says “ film doesn’t match the stats . Pete ball won a super bowl and would have won 2 but Russ burnt the dessert cooking . I’m fine with Pete ball . I want super bowls .

[Hawktawk]

Did you watch the games? Russ had pretty much given up on targeting tightly guarded receivers preferring the out sideline routes and deep shots where his guy gets it or nobody. As a scout said "risk averse with a great deep ball". By comparison Matthew Stafford led the league in picks and pick 6 s.

Geno had no problems finding DK nor would anyone else and if you've seen Locke throw a ball he can throw it about 70 yards. Any NFL QB can throw it to DK and Lockett, part of what POs me about Russell claiming he didnt have any help. Watch the games.
DK was wide open a lot.

Of course, I watched the games. Are you being sarcastic?

You were putting your usual overblown spin on your latest Flavor of the Day by saying that Metcalf was uncoverable, to which I called BS and showed you several examples to prove that he wasn't. You replied by using your usual, cherry picked small sample of Geno's playing time that not a single poster in here is buying.

So yeah, watch the games. All 17 of them. Good advice, you shoul try taking it.

I watched all of them twice . You should try it . If 17 for 21 for 251 yards and 4 TD s and a QBR of 151 targeting Metcalf over 13 quarters is overblown I’m all for over blown .

Once again you just don’t even get what I am so correct in pointing out . DK went off with someone not named Russ then was shut out for 7 weeks when he came back .
I saw Russ miss seeing him wide open including a certain TD vs the Rams , refuse to throw him balls in tight coverage “ nfl open “ windows . Genos cherry picked 13 quarters who you think sucked would extrapolate to about 1500 yards and 20. TD s to DK alone . If nobody on the board is buying it that’s their blinders on . Facts STATS don’t support your argument . Carroll buys it . But the people who want guys to trade their home run for picks but say they can’t pick correctly , yeah that’s logical

[obiken]

The word on the block is that the Hawks have been offered first rounders for DK Metcalf and Pete has turned them down. If these reports are true, it just confirms Pete’s out to lunch, Metcalf is not worth a first rounder, he’s just not. I haven’t seen it there. Metcalf doesn’t create separation, he drops balls, yes he’s a speedster, but he gets into it too much with the corners that are a guarding him. In other words, he’s a diva and divas disrupt and he needs to go! If we get a first rounder for him, he would be on the next bus if it were me!

[RiverDog]

I watched all of them twice . You should try it . If 17 for 21 for 251 yards and 4 TD s and a QBR of 151 targeting Metcalf over 13 quarters is overblown I’m all for over blown.

Once again you just don’t even get what I am so correct in pointing out . DK went off with someone not named Russ then was shut out for 7 weeks when he came back .
I saw Russ miss seeing him wide open including a certain TD vs the Rams , refuse to throw him balls in tight coverage “ nfl open “ windows . Genos cherry picked 13 quarters who you think sucked would extrapolate to about 1500 yards and 20. TD s to DK alone . If nobody on the board is buying it that’s their blinders on . Facts STATS don’t support your argument . Carroll buys it . But the people who want guys to trade their home run for picks but say they can’t pick correctly , yeah that’s logical

Interesting what some people view as 'facts'. Extrapolating 13 quarters of football over a 68 quarter season isn't cherry picking, it's a 'fact'. Got it!

[NorthHawk]

The scout is describing Russell’s game , not the scheme . At the conclusion of the second Rams game Russ had attempted 29 passes into the short middle of the field all season . Brady throws 7 balls a game there . Another scout says “ film doesn’t match the stats . Pete ball won a super bowl and would have won 2 but Russ burnt the dessert cooking . I’m fine with Pete ball . I want super bowls

The scheme and coaching of it determines the game.
Russ would probably have been a different QB with a much more well rounded game had he been in a diverse Offense.

That INT was a result of a bad call where it limited the talents of who was at the time the most dangerous and creative
QB in the game. If they were going to throw they should have rolled him out to put pressure on the edge
and give Russ options with the ball.

[Aseahawkfan]

The scout is describing Russell’s game , not the scheme . At the conclusion of the second Rams game Russ had attempted 29 passes into the short middle of the field all season . Brady throws 7 balls a game there . Another scout says “ film doesn’t match the stats . Pete ball won a super bowl and would have won 2 but Russ burnt the dessert cooking . I’m fine with Pete ball . I want super bowls .

If you liked Super Bowls, you wouldn't support the garbage roster management and maintenance that have led us into the gutter we're in now which Russell had nothing to do with. It was all Pete and John making stupid trades and drafting people that did not work out.

I'm glad you seem to overlook this team wasn't winning Super Bowls or even competing for them until who arrived....Russell Wilson. It wasn't Pete Ball that won the games. It was having a complete team built around an elite QB that finally took us to the next level for the greatest Seahawks football ever, which Russell Wilson was a huge part of. He was in fact the difference maker. Without Russell we don't even get to a Super Bowl, much less two of them.

You keep trying to blame him for that stupid play call. Fact is he shouldn't even have put in position to have to throw into that rubbish situation. We had Russ and we had Beast. Basically the best read-option running QB in the game and the most brutal RB. Somehow clever Bevell thought throwing into the middle of a stacked goal line defense was a better play than the read option and Pete signed off on that play.

You don't get to pretend Russell wasn't the factor that made us going to the Super Bowl possible. You don't get to fabricate that trash. What was our record before Russell arrived playing Pete Ball? I'll tell you...two years of 7 and 9. Then what? We draft an under-sized QB that the league thinks sucks but Pete and John believe in. Then what is our record? 11-5, 13-3 (tied for our best record ever), and 12-4 (never had back to back seasons like this in our history) and two Super Bowl visits and one win.

So what was the difference? Pete Ball and Pete's coaching? Or the stud QB who made the offense sing? I know what I think it is. I know what's going to be proven next year when you watch Pete Ball without Russell Wilson.

But not sure why you're trying to push a bunch of rubbish when we all know that what took this team to to the next level was drafting the best QB in franchise history which led to the best Seattle football in franchise history as we had the best team we've ever had. If not for Russell, we wouldn't even have sniffed a Super Bowl. Would have been years of wasting the best defense we ever fielded as well as one of the hardest running RBs ever to put on a Seattle uniform.

I doubt we'll ever see a team that good in Seattle. Pete and John have sent nearly every member of that amazing Super Bowl team out in a way that makes them feel jilted and mistreated including Bobby Wagner who never did a thing to deserve being treated like he was treated.

[Hawktawk]

If you liked Super Bowls, you wouldn't support the garbage roster management and maintenance that have led us into the gutter we're in now which Russell had nothing to do with. It was all Pete and John making stupid trades and drafting people that did not work out.

I'm glad you seem to overlook this team wasn't winning Super Bowls or even competing for them until who arrived....Russell Wilson. It wasn't Pete Ball that won the games. It was having a complete team built around an elite QB that finally took us to the next level for the greatest Seahawks football ever, which Russell Wilson was a huge part of. He was in fact the difference maker. Without Russell we don't even get to a Super Bowl, much less two of them.

You keep trying to blame him for that stupid play call. Fact is he shouldn't even have put in position to have to throw into that rubbish situation. We had Russ and we had Beast. Basically the best read-option running QB in the game and the most brutal RB. Somehow clever Bevell thought throwing into the middle of a stacked goal line defense was a better play than the read option and Pete signed off on that play.

You don't get to pretend Russell wasn't the factor that made us going to the Super Bowl possible. You don't get to fabricate that trash. What was our record before Russell arrived playing Pete Ball? I'll tell you...two years of 7 and 9. Then what? We draft an under-sized QB that the league thinks sucks but Pete and John believe in. Then what is our record? 11-5, 13-3 (tied for our best record ever), and 12-4 (never had back to back seasons like this in our history) and two Super Bowl visits and one win.

So what was the difference? Pete Ball and Pete's coaching? Or the stud QB who made the offense sing? I know what I think it is. I know what's going to be proven next year when you watch Pete Ball without Russell Wilson.

But not sure why you're trying to push a bunch of rubbish when we all know that what took this team to to the next level was drafting the best QB in franchise history which led to the best Seattle football in franchise history as we had the best team we've ever had. If not for Russell, we wouldn't even have sniffed a Super Bowl. Would have been years of wasting the best defense we ever fielded as well as one of the hardest running RBs ever to put on a Seattle uniform.

I doubt we'll ever see a team that good in Seattle. Pete and John have sent nearly every member of that amazing Super Bowl team out in a way that makes them feel jilted and mistreated including Bobby Wagner who never did a thing to deserve being treated like he was treated.

Russ was a missing piece in the glory years of the franchise . No question . He’s one of the greatest dual threat qbs in history . He’s been clutch so many times . But when I hear he was the only difference I say wait a minute . Bennett and Avril who were dominant edge rushers arrived in FA . Sherman , Chancellor and ET grew up and grew together . Wagner and Irvin were drafted . turban who was an effective change up . Zach Miller was signed along with Baldwin . Our 2013 super bowl run I give Russ a ton of credit for doing enough to win games with the line completely decimated by injury . But without Sherman we lose the NFC title game . The super bowl was Russell’s most flawless playoff game ever and he doesn’t get enough credit for it .

In 49 he threw it to the other team . That after spending almost the entire first half going 3 and out . His comments captured on sound FX” where did he come from “ ? Make clear he didn’t identify him pre snap . Worst of all the balls high and out in front or it’s still a TD . And I think I read you saying that’s what screwed everything up. I agree .
We have 3 wild card wins since that day . 1 was a gift when Blair Walsh shanked a 22 yarder .

We have a situation where we are going to find out someone’s right and someone’s wrong . I don’t agree Pete and John are garbage and when we’re discussing trading a guy who we got at the end of the second for a first and a second it shows how ridiculous you people sound saying trade that guy for picks. They can’t draft right ?

[NorthHawk]

In Seattle Wilson had 24 4th Quarter comeback wins and 32 game winning drives along with
4 Post season comeback game winning drives.
There are only a few other QBs who could have done that and I seriously doubt any QB that
has been on our roster during the PC/JS regime could have come close. Did some of his comeback attempts fail?
Of course, and he had some bad games too but he was far more successful than not.

And our HC couldn’t adjust to todays game to keep him.
Pretty pathetic.

[Hawktawk]

In Seattle Wilson had 24 4th Quarter comeback wins and 32 game winning drives along with
4 Post season comeback game winning drives.
There are only a few other QBs who could have done that and I seriously doubt any QB that
has been on our roster during the PC/JS regime could have come close. Did some of his comeback attempts fail?
Of course, and he had some bad games too but he was far more successful than not.

And our HC couldn’t adjust to todays game to keep him.
Pretty pathetic.

North . I’ve watched every game . Every highlight and there have been many . Every comeback . And every failure . I’ve said repeatedly Russ is a hall of fame player . His ten year stats alone make him that due to all the firsts he accomplished plus 2 Super Bowls and a Lombardi .

None of that has anything to do with right now . As Wilson’s legend grew his ego grew faster . His greatest burning desire became celebrity , being the center of attention . His game fell off a cliff beginning with the careless 3 pick game vs AZ. The
Play DK made running down Baker and defensive stop preventing a score is a main reason I want him back . But we lost in overtime to a team that had never led in a game . From that point on Russ threw 11 picks the rest of the season including the pick 6 in a dreadful 11-29 performance vs the Rams with Donald out half of it . Stop blaming the offense . He threw those picks . He completed 11 balls out of 29. This year he just quit throwing in the middle , quit looking for his check downs .
Yeah he has a lot of comeback wins like all the greats . It means you played a lot of games , that you were behind in many and you and your teammates were clutch in the end . Someone’s caught every ball Russell threw and rheees a reason ADB was surly . He saved Russ a few games . Rice squeezed the you mad bro TD . Mathews who nobody heard of caught 2 TDs in a super bowl after saving Russell’s bacon in the NFC championship with an onsides recovery. Unfortunately he couldn’t save the season in the end .
Tell me his last clutch game he pulled out late ? I honestly can’t recall . I remember a loss to Colt McCoy 2 years in a row . He had 3 last minute drive opportunities , entered numerous games with a 1 score
into the 4 th quarter such as the Rams and even down only 3 vs the Packers as Russ hung up a goose egg clearly unable to grip or throw a ball .

A big FU to people like us North by a guy in his way out the door . Selfish attention getting behavior that truly ruined my season as a fan. When he said he was ready a day after PC said it would be “ really close” old HT said “ I hope so go hang one on Rodgerona . “

but I was also sceptical knowing who Russ had become . I rest my case or I suppose someone will argue he was doing it for the team. Forcing his way back after the Jags game Geno had played flawlessly along with the entire team to play a team that has owned him healthy . Along with not Trading him a year ago the next biggest mistake was putting him back out there too early . Good luck with that Denver

[NorthHawk]

I don't believe he changed much at all. He was all in during the season, but he wasn't given the chance to be the best he can be because of Pete Ball.
It's like an architect who is limited to designing condos and never theaters or stadiums. That person would want to experience something different
especially when he sees his peers doing so and being successful at it. It would be frustrating as hell knowing that the boss won't let you do things
that others talk about and are applauded for just because your boss wants to stick to condos.
I don't blame him for leaving. If it's not rewarding and you feel stuck in neutral then it's time to move on, but if the boss wasn't stuck in the past
you'd be very happy and want to stay.
It wasn't a big FU by Wilson. It's a big FU by Carroll to us fans who wanted to see the limits of Wilson's talents but will never do so here now.
As far as productivity? Outside the finger injury I don't see any dropoff. He still has the arm talent and he can read the play as well as he ever
has, but maybe his foot speed is down but that's all. He can still throw one of or the best deep ball and has a rifle on out patterns but Pete's focus
on being 'risk averse' as stated earlier means his talents were being wasted. And he knew it. That's a large part of why he wanted to leave and
I don't blame him.

[Hawktawk]

Time will tell North . We had 1 wild card win in the last 5 years over Philly and 50 year old Josh McCown . I don’t think Russ reads the field worth a damn before or after the snap anymore . He sees the rush and not the field . In his last game as a Seahawk he failed to account for Chandler Jones either by audible or having the sense to unload the ball to the first read or the cheerleader . Instead the now patented bail out and strip 6. He followed it up with an overthrow of Homer on a short out route leading to a pick to the 1 foot line . 14 points by our 35 million guy to the other team . In the end he threw 3 TDs and Penney ran wild in a 38-30 victory . But all year Russ made incredibly poor choices in situational awareness for a 10 year HOF vet . 6-8 as a starter don’t lie .

[Hawktawk]

Now Deebo wants out . Demanding a trade from the 9ers . DK at Off-season workouts means more all the time . If it’s the going rate for receivers we have the biggest baddest one and we don’t have to spend draft picks . Lock him up

[NorthHawk]

They still have to figure out how they are going to get him the ball.
It may end up he’ll be wasting his talents in a moribund Offense
with a bad QB at the helm.

[Hawktawk]

They still have to figure out how they are going to get him the ball.
It may end up he’ll be wasting his talents in a moribund Offense
with a bad QB at the helm.

Maybe he doesn’t like being the entire offense both running and catching the ball . Wideouts lining up in the backfield take extra punishment.

I hope he leaves . But regardless of the qb being mediocre he was in a super bowl and NFC championship in the last 3 years in part because of himself . So it’s a formula for success , stud wideout that can do it all and a journeyman QB throwing to him then there’s Kittle at tight end and they run and play salty defense . Pete ball .

And we swept that team last year . Lots of lessons about what works and what doesn’t . Answer is everything both works and doesn’t depending on the situation and personnel. It’s a crap shoot .

[Aseahawkfan]

In Seattle Wilson had 24 4th Quarter comeback wins and 32 game winning drives along with
4 Post season comeback game winning drives.
There are only a few other QBs who could have done that and I seriously doubt any QB that
has been on our roster during the PC/JS regime could have come close. Did some of his comeback attempts fail?
Of course, and he had some bad games too but he was far more successful than not.

And our HC couldn’t adjust to todays game to keep him.
Pretty pathetic.

A certain segment of the fan base only wants to focus on Russ's mistakes and not all the games he won to even get us to the playoffs as Carroll and Schneider failed to keep this team replenished of talent and keep the defense competitive.

They just ignore the defensive downfall. Ignore Carroll firing D-coordinators and O-coordinators while not taking the blame on himself and John for failing to provide the necessary talent to compete.

The only difference between Bevell and every O-coordinator since and Chris Rashard and Ken Norton Jr. and Dan Quinn and Gus Bradley is the level of talent that we had before.

No wants to see the talent has fallen off a cliff and Pete and John have been failing in the draft and free agency on a yearly basis. Their big blockbuster trade for a strong safety with Jamal Adams was just another in a long line of moves that doesn't work out near as well as Pete and John sold us it would. But all these Down on Russ fans don't want to see it for some reason.

Well, I see it. Jamal Adams is not the guy making this defense so much better he was worth 2 1st round picks. And the D-line draft picks have been subpar and so have the signings. Our CBs are a rotating group of names I barely remember. Chris Carson hasn't been able to stay healthy. Only bright spots of the team have been Russell Wilson throwing to the DK and Tyler. That is literally the only thing we've been able to rely on for the 3 years. Oh, and Bobby getting a bunch of tackles. Other than that, no other reliable units on this team.

[obiken]

YUP! This year with the Broncos there are going to be a lot of Hawk fans munching on Crow!

[Hawktawk]

YUP! This year with the Broncos there are going to be a lot of Hawk fans munching on Crow!

Are you rooting for Russell over the Seahawks ? You want this to fail so you can win your argument ? Russ might get smashed when he comes back to Lumen. I hope he goes 0-17 and gets cut .

[c_hawkbob]

YUP! This year with the Broncos there are going to be a lot of Hawk fans munching on Crow!

Are you rooting for Russell over the Seahawks ? You want this to fail so you can win your argument ? Russ might get smashed when he comes back to Lumen. I hope he goes 0-17 and gets cut .

Oh come on, so now anybody that doesn't share your delusion is anti-Hawks?

Russ didn't steal my lunch money, I wish him nothing but the best (when he's not playing the Hawks), and I think he's going to kill it in Denver.

[RiverDog]

YUP! This year with the Broncos there are going to be a lot of Hawk fans munching on Crow!

Are you rooting for Russell over the Seahawks ? You want this to fail so you can win your argument ? Russ might get smashed when he comes back to Lumen. I hope he goes 0-17 and gets cut .

Oh come on, so now anybody that doesn't share your delusion is anti-Hawks?

Russ didn't steal my lunch money, I wish him nothing but the best (when he's not playing the Hawks), and I think he's going to kill it in Denver.

I come down in the middle of this debate. I want to Broncos to go 0-17 this season not because Russell is playing for them, but because it will yield us higher draft choices in 2023. Outside of that, while I wish Russell well as I would any friend, I honestly don't care how he does in Denver and will not be rooting for him/them to win or lose.

Of course, I'll be rooting for the Hawks to crush the Broncos this fall as I do with any team we play. There will be some undeniable pressure on both parties as the Hawks and Broncos had similar seasons last year, and the outcome will unavoidably get used as evidence to support various angles in these types of arguments.

[Aseahawkfan]

I'm indifferent to Russ at this point myself. I know he's an elite QB and still great. He's a great guy and nothing he's done changes that. Wish we had kept him. But he's off the team and we get a better draft pick if the Broncos do poorly, so that is the better outcome for us. So I hope the Broncos lose a lot.

After that, probably won't keep up with Russ much.

My bigger concern is I think Pete Carroll's shelf-life is over. He's reached that point every great coach reaches other than Bill B where they've run out of ideas, lost of their way, and are coasting on past accomplishments. I haven't seen many head coaches other than Bill B work their magic to two eras of Super Bowl winning football with the same team. I haven't seen too many do it even with different teams. I'm still not sure Bill B will even do it without Tom Brady.

Coaches reach their shelf-life. Pete's had an amazing decade plus in Seattle and done it about as well as a coach can do other than more rings. But can he do it again? I'm not sure. It's pretty rare that a coach does it again after reaching the pinnacle Pete has reached. Maybe John Harbaugh has been another coach who has rebuilt a Super Bowl team after reaching the mountain top, falling, and rising again. I think he's younger than Pete.

I guess we'll see if Pete and John can make the magic happen again.