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Colorado?

I guess if you don't know enough about American history to realize that there were no airports around during the Revolutionary War that you probably don't know enough about geography to understand that Colorado is about as far away from an international border as you can get, so the statement makes perfect sense.

Trump was speaking in Pittsburgh at the Shale Insight Conference when he began touting his 2020 re-election prospects with the supposed building of hundreds of miles of wall. He curiously added Colorado to the list of places where it’s being built, drawing a standing ovation from the crowd.

“You know why we're going to win New Mexico?” Trump said. “Because they want safety on their border. And they didn't have it. And we're building a wall on the border of New Mexico!

“And we're building a wall in Colorado,” the president said. “We're building a beautiful wall, a big one that really works — you can't get over, you can't get under.”

https://www.seattlepi.com/local-politic ... TltaOiA1mA

But maybe he can just take a Sharpie to a map of the United States and somehow place Colorado on the Mexican border. That oughta fix things for his believers.

Please, someone tell me that our POTUS really isn't that stupid and explain this mistake for me. Where's Idahawkman when we need him?

https://www.newsweek.com/trump-mental-i ... bc-1455644
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basi ... nald-trump
As i've been saying for 3 years, it's not just stupidity. Its mental decline, mental illness. He's obviously not in the corner drooling in a diaper insane but he's not right between the ears, not close...

His comments on everything are becoming more and more unhinged and bear no resemblance to the truth, His Syria comments yesterday were 95% false.Talking about how happy and safe the Kurds are. Saying the ISIS fighters are secure, praising himself for brokering a peace deal as Russia, Turkey and Assad's syrian army divvy up the country and fighting and war crimes continuer to occur, hundreds of thousands of refugees flee towards Iraq.

He also said Tuesday that he had spoken with Mitch McConnell about the phone call to Ukraine and that Mitch had told him the call was "perfect'. The R senators haven't had much to say lately regarding the impeachment inquiry, but when informed of Trump's comments McConnell said "I haven't spoken to the president regarding that call". Asked by the reporter if that meant Trump was lying McConnell said" you have to ask him, I dont recall discussing it with him at all".

I guess you either believe Mitch McConnell who generally chooses his words very carefully or $#1t for brains who blurts out the first thing that comes into his shrunken brain. Dude should be on meds and in therapy and not near the White house.

See there's lying and exaggerating but this is at a pathological level. So many people underestimate the grave danger it places this nation and the entire planet in having this guy as commander in chief.

Trump now says that he was only joking, but if you look at the video, it clearly wasn't made in a situation where he was trying to add some humor.

Mental illness is one possible explanation for the non stop gaffes and misstatements of fact. My theory is that his mind has not been forced to work, mainly because he's lazy and dependent on others to do routine mental tasks for him. As an aging adult, I've read plenty of articles regarding how doing stuff like crossword puzzles, playing cards, even just plain reading helps keep your mind sharp. At least for the past 20-30 years, Trump hasn't had to do anything that would cause him to have to exercise his brain, and combined with his natural laziness, his mental acuity has fallen, or at least that's my explanation. It's either that or he's just plain stupid.

One of my pet peeves is how stupid our succeeding generations are when I read things like 29% of young adults can't find the Pacific Ocean on a map. I guess we can't limit our criticism to Millennials.

Millennials are just captivated by their phones , electronic media etc. with trump it’s a clear decline . As I’ve said google anything he said 20 years ago and compare it to now. I saw a speech pathologist who said he speaks at a 4th grade level now.

Hawktawk wrote:Millennials are just captivated by their phones , electronic media etc. with trump it’s a clear decline . As I’ve said google anything he said 20 years ago and compare it to now. I saw a speech pathologist who said he speaks at a 4th grade level now.

It's a decline, but I'm not ready to attribute it to mental illness. There is a natural process that accompanies aging where people start losing it. My best friend is 81 years old, a PhD, and one of the most intelligent men I know, and he's starting to show signs of "losing his fast ball", as Trump once said of Biden. The difference with my friend is that he's kept his mind busy, kept the electrons firing. Trump's mind has been relatively inactive over the past 20 years or so.

It's still a reach to say that Trump's inability to get basic facts straight is due to his aging. It's one thing to mix up two cities in Ohio a few days after an event or mistakenly say that Alabama was in a hurricane forecast, but it's a completely different thing to think that Colorado shares a border with Mexico or that there were airports in the Revolutionary War. I think that part of it is that Trump is just plain dumb.

I do think that they need to add an age criteria to the requirements for POTUS, that no one over the age of 70 can be sworn in. At one time, in 2001, Strom Thurmond was 99 years old and as President Pro Tempore of the Senate, he was 3rd in line to the Presidency.

Trump just talks at this point. The man wings it. He literally thinks he can do no wrong. He thinks he can just say any dumb thing to get votes. The guy flies by the seat of his pants. I doubt he truly want to win the White House again and he's just seeing how far he can push his base and still win. He'll probably write a book someday talking about how dumb the people were to vote for him. I can just see it now, "I could say anything I wanted. I could shoot a baby. I could insult anyone I wanted. I sold these clowns on my 'vision' and made a bunch of money. Then I made a deal and went back to a great life."

Aseahawkfan wrote:Trump just talks at this point. The man wings it. He literally thinks he can do no wrong. He thinks he can just say any dumb thing to get votes. The guy flies by the seat of his pants. I doubt he truly want to win the White House again and he's just seeing how far he can push his base and still win. He'll probably write a book someday talking about how dumb the people were to vote for him. I can just see it now, "I could say anything I wanted. I could shoot a baby. I could insult anyone I wanted. I sold these clowns on my 'vision' and made a bunch of money. Then I made a deal and went back to a great life."

Trump for sure "wings it". He doesn't bother to prepare for news conferences and interviews and sometimes I think that he doesn't even bother to read a teleprompter. It might explain some gaffes, like why he included Alabama in a hurricane forecast. And there's a lot of times that he just plain makes things up, like his history lesson about Andrew Jackson being "very upset" and saying "there's no reason for this (the Civil War)". In that particular case, Trump was displaying his stupidity, not knowing that Jackson died 15 years before the start of the Civil War.

But that doesn't explain some of these horrendous gaffs, like there being airports in the 1700's or Colorado sharing a border with Mexico. A grade schooler wouldn't screw that up. Even when you wing it, a normal person doesn't get those facts wrong. It's like saying that water runs uphill.

As far as him not wanting to be POTUS, IMO he wouldn't be going so ballistic if he didn't want the position. He's like a caged lion.

Trump is cornered,thats why hes going ballistic along with his bobbleheads.

I dont think he EVER wanted to win. I dont think he ever thought he would. The look of shock on his face election night as Melania wept tears of sorrow is all you need to know.
He thought running would enhance his brand, several associates have said as much.He was playing a game using the election to the most sacred important office in the world to profit, gaslight the world. But by golly the Trumptards actually bought his line, Russia kicked in in a mighty way, Hillary thought she could coast home and was the laziest Dem candidate in my memory and the rest is history.The worst president in the history of the country was elected.

I'm still going with my initial thought. Americas *leader* is mentally ill,far worse than me, an admittedly bipolar highly medicated man. Hes totally out of control of his worst impulses, utterly inept at world affairs but being enabled by men who have sold their soul for a seat in congress or position in a cabinet post.I saw a meme yesterday that said the Republicans gave New Mexico back to Mexico rather than challenge his assertion of Colorado being a border state.
He is a danger to America and the entire stability of the world order.And he's still got 40 something % approval.
And those people are so hardened they would agree with his lawyer who argued in court day before yesterday regarding the SDNY investigation into his businesses that he COULD IN FACT SHOOT SOMEONE AND NOT BE INVESTIGATED OR PROSECUTED. That's where we are at folks....

Hawktawk wrote:I saw a meme yesterday that said the Republicans gave New Mexico back to Mexico rather than challenge his assertion of Colorado being a border state.

Now that's funny! Perhaps Trump will pull out his Sharpie and make a little adjustment, thinking no one would notice.

Hawktawk wrote:Trump is cornered,thats why hes going ballistic along with his bobbleheads.

I dont think he EVER wanted to win. I dont think he ever thought he would. The look of shock on his face election night as Melania wept tears of sorrow is all you need to know.
He thought running would enhance his brand, several associates have said as much.He was playing a game using the election to the most sacred important office in the world to profit, gaslight the world. But by golly the Trumptards actually bought his line, Russia kicked in in a mighty way, Hillary thought she could coast home and was the laziest Dem candidate in my memory and the rest is history.The worst president in the history of the country was elected.

I'm still going with my initial thought. Americas *leader* is mentally ill,far worse than me, an admittedly bipolar highly medicated man. Hes totally out of control of his worst impulses, utterly inept at world affairs but being enabled by men who have sold their soul for a seat in congress or position in a cabinet post.I saw a meme yesterday that said the Republicans gave New Mexico back to Mexico rather than challenge his assertion of Colorado being a border state.
He is a danger to America and the entire stability of the world order.And he's still got 40 something % approval.
And those people are so hardened they would agree with his lawyer who argued in court day before yesterday regarding the SDNY investigation into his businesses that he COULD IN FACT SHOOT SOMEONE AND NOT BE INVESTIGATED OR PROSECUTED. That's where we are at folks....

I don't care if you hate the guy. But stop exaggerating. This clown is a danger to no one other than people who get deeply offended by tweets or stupid nicknames. He hasn't done anything that is going to endanger us at all unless you want to keep sending our guys to die and kill in foreign nations over and over and over again attracting attacks from them like flies for invading their homes and supporting dictators that oppress them.

I hope the clown is gone by next year if only so I can stop reading the exaggerations of his policies. He makes tons of gaffes and stupid comments, but his policies don't cause much movement or make life bad. That's just BS exaggeration to make the man seem worse than he is.

You've had presidents that murdered people and don't seem to care. Now you're building up a man that tweets and talks too much as a danger while you ignore the real dangerous and corrupt crap we do? Take out the history books for once you in your life and stop living on outrage and lies.

Aseahawkfan wrote:I don't care if you hate the guy. But stop exaggerating. This clown is a danger to no one other than people who get deeply offended by tweets or stupid nicknames. He hasn't done anything that is going to endanger us at all unless you want to keep sending our guys to die and kill in foreign nations over and over and over again attracting attacks from them like flies for invading their homes and supporting dictators that oppress them.

I hope the clown is gone by next year if only so I can stop reading the exaggerations of his policies. He makes tons of gaffes and stupid comments, but his policies don't cause much movement or make life bad. That's just BS exaggeration to make the man seem worse than he is.

I tend to agree. The nation has been through a lot over the course of the past 250 some years, we can certainly survive another 15 or so months of this buffoon. I don't like appearing arrogant or nationalistic, but other nations need us far more than we need them. Once this ignoramus is out of the way, things will return to normal, at least internationally. I'm a lot more worried about what might happen if we elect one of these socialists like Warren or Sanders than I am another 15 months of Donald Trump.

His tariffs cost me my manufacturing job along with about 1000 other people in a community of 22k. Its affected my life and a thousand others greatly and his playing russian roulette(appropriate analogy for Rump) with the entire world economy threatens to bring about a recession that would dwarf 2008.

But it is his acquiescence to strongment like Kim Jong Un, Erogodon and most important his subservience to Putin with over 7 K nukes pointed right at us that worries me most. His snap decision to pull out of Syria has caused a cross border conflict that has killed hundreds of our former allies the Kurds and displaced hundreds of thousands more , opened up a land bride to Israel for Iran and sees our greatest geopolitical foe Russia patrolling alongside a *nato* ally turkey.His response was"its like 2 kids in a parking lot" sometimes you have to let them fight for a while then pull them back"

And after all that we are sending mechanized armor units BACK INTO SYRIA to potentially clash with Russian or Turkish troops, in order to "defend the oil" in the words of our dear leader. It was nice getting Al Baghdadi but it was apparently in the works for months and was nearly scuttled by Trump's decisions in the region. But of course he will take his victory lap like yesterday even though he arrived in the situation room at 4 pm just before the raid after his 220th round of golf as president. The he goes on TV and blurts out classified details, systems and methods etc like always. I worry about this deranged pig on many levels including economic but its his role as commander in chief that is utterly unacceptable. And I dont want socialism but Ill take it over him. Competency and sanity please.

Hawktawk wrote:It was nice getting Al Baghdadi but it was apparently in the works for months and was nearly scuttled by Trump's decisions in the region. But of course he will take his victory lap like yesterday even though he arrived in the situation room at 4 pm just before the raid after his 220th round of golf as president. The he goes on TV and blurts out classified details, systems and methods etc like always.

That part bothers me, too, and not j/b there might have been classified details he could have leaked. There's a lot of moderates and borderline radicals in the Middle East that might not view his gloating about our causing the death of a fellow Arab and his children as a positive. All he should have done was to acknowledge the success of the operation, honor the bravery of those that executed the plan, re-affirm our commitment to fighting terrorism, then shut his cake hole. He doesn't have to make up stuff about how Baghdadi was a crying, calling him a whimpering coward, et al. All that does is stir up more hate America sentiment. He reminded me of a professional wrestler.

RiverDog wrote:That part bothers me, too, and not j/b there might have been classified details he could have leaked. There's a lot of moderates and borderline radicals in the Middle East that might not view his gloating about our causing the death of a fellow Arab and his children as a positive. All he should have done was to acknowledge the success of the operation, honor the bravery of those that executed the plan, re-affirm our commitment to fighting terrorism, then shut his cake hole. He doesn't have to make up stuff about how Baghdadi was a crying, calling him a whimpering coward, et al. All that does is stir up more hate America sentiment. He reminded me of a professional wrestler.

He should shut up for the sake of decorum. He can't stop trying to entertain people while he's talking can he?

But nothing he says will change anything in that area of the world. That area has a lot of folks that view us as the enemy for many, many reasons. The only way out of war and inviting attack in that area is to not continue to be involved in the regional conflicts of the area. Since we're heavily invested in backing Israel and controlling oil pricing, we aren't leaving any time soon. So as has been the case for most of our lives, we'll continue to be involved in the conflicts of that region on the side of the Sunni nations (Saudi Arabia, Egypt, UAE, Pakistan, and most of the Middle Eastern nations) against the Shia nations (Syria, Iran).

I'm surprised people continue to believe Iran and Syria are the bad guys when most of the terrorists come from the Sunni nations that we are "allied" with. All that media and government propaganda seems to work better than people taking the time to learn about the conflicts and people in that area.

Par for the course. Another terrorist we have to trust the government claims he was a bad guy dumped in the ocean killed by our guys. What else is new? We kill people there that are supposedly terrorists all the time using drones. No due process. Just trust that our government is not using drone assassination in a manner to kill terrorists rather than crush the enemies of our "allies" that feed us information on who to kill. And somehow we're all ok with it because they are not American. Though I wonder sometimes if they started drone assassinating people in our country if anyone would do anything to stop it given so many seem to want to give up their second amendment right and just let the government have full and total control of weapons in this nation. For our safety of course.

Aseahawkfan wrote:He should shut up for the sake of decorum. He can't stop trying to entertain people while he's talking can he?

But nothing he says will change anything in that area of the world. That area has a lot of folks that view us as the enemy for many, many reasons. The only way out of war and inviting attack in that area is to not continue to be involved in the regional conflicts of the area. Since we're heavily invested in backing Israel and controlling oil pricing, we aren't leaving any time soon. So as has been the case for most of our lives, we'll continue to be involved in the conflicts of that region on the side of the Sunni nations (Saudi Arabia, Egypt, UAE, Pakistan, and most of the Middle Eastern nations) against the Shia nations (Syria, Iran).

I'm surprised people continue to believe Iran and Syria are the bad guys when most of the terrorists come from the Sunni nations that we are "allied" with. All that media and government propaganda seems to work better than people taking the time to learn about the conflicts and people in that area.

Par for the course. Another terrorist we have to trust the government claims he was a bad guy dumped in the ocean killed by our guys. What else is new? We kill people there that are supposedly terrorists all the time using drones. No due process. Just trust that our government is not using drone assassination in a manner to kill terrorists rather than crush the enemies of our "allies" that feed us information on who to kill. And somehow we're all ok with it because they are not American. Though I wonder sometimes if they started drone assassinating people in our country if anyone would do anything to stop it given so many seem to want to give up their second amendment right and just let the government have full and total control of weapons in this nation. For our safety of course.

I wasn't intending to get into a discussion about foreign policy in the Middle East. My point was about Trump's rambling, jingoistic, self aggrandizing, probably a lot of make believe (why would those comments be any different than anything else he says), and perhaps classified details regarding the operation to take out the most wanted man in the world.

I agree that Trump probably can't say anything that would make the situation in the Middle East better, but he can say things that can make it worse, both for moderate Arabs as well as for our own troops.

The guy is constantly ragging Obama and to be fair I was too much of the time when he was potus but here's a good comparison. Upon the completion of the raid to kill OBL which was a much bigger deal than Al Bagdaddio Obama delivered a prepared 9 minute speech where he praised special forces, honored the thousands of victims of 911 and that was that. His staff had written speeches beforehand to cover any potential outcome including failure and death of US personnel.
By comparison Trump got to the situation room minutes before the assault without his chief of staff after his 220 something round of golf. He went out the following day and spouted off for 53 minutes, totally politicized this and really blew any momentum he could have gained. Anyone holding their breath expecting this guy to demonstrate a second of presidential behavior will die.

Hawktawk wrote:The guy is constantly ragging Obama and to be fair I was too much of the time when he was potus but here's a good comparison. Upon the completion of the raid to kill OBL which was a much bigger deal than Al Bagdaddio Obama delivered a prepared 9 minute speech where he praised special forces, honored the thousands of victims of 911 and that was that. His staff had written speeches beforehand to cover any potential outcome including failure and death of US personnel.

By comparison Trump got to the situation room minutes before the assault without his chief of staff after his 220 something round of golf. He went out the following day and spouted off for 53 minutes, totally politicized this and really blew any momentum he could have gained. Anyone holding their breath expecting this guy to demonstrate a second of presidential behavior will die.

This has to be a first as I agree with you 100%. I was thinking the same thing regarding Obama and the operation to take out Osama Bin Laden. Obama played it perfectly, not only in his speech announcing the conclusion of the operation, but from start to finish, including the humor in giving the commanding officer crap over ordering a sailor roughly the same height as OBL to lay down beside the corpse rather than get a tape measure.

Trump's really showing how unnerved he is over his impending impeachment. This operation was an easy, no brainer slam dunk event that he could have played to his huge advantage as Commander-in Chief yet he couldn't divorce himself from the very partisan battle going on in the House for even 5 minutes, which is all it would have taken to acknowledge the action. Heck, Jimmy Carter took an embarrassing failure in Desert One, the operation to free the Iran hostages, and parlayed it into a big bump in his popularity as the public sympathized with is decision and willingness to take the blame. Can you imagine how many people Trump would have thrown under the bus to avoid taking responsibility for a failed operation?

RiverDog wrote:I wasn't intending to get into a discussion about foreign policy in the Middle East. My point was about Trump's rambling, jingoistic, self aggrandizing, probably a lot of make believe (why would those comments be any different than anything else he says), and perhaps classified details regarding the operation to take out the most wanted man in the world.

I agree that Trump probably can't say anything that would make the situation in the Middle East better, but he can say things that can make it worse, both for moderate Arabs as well as for our own troops.

I don't much agree he can. That area doesn't speak enough English as a group to care about what Trump says. The things they believe and care about over there would surprise and shock you.

I am more annoyed by how dumb and embarrassing his talk is as an American. What kind of trash talk was that? The guy is acting like an entertainer rather than a president. His speech is either comedy or tragedy depending on how you view an operation to kill a terrorist enemy. Why would you describe things in that manner? The guy acts like he is talking with his buddies at the local high end socialize club and he's telling them some impressive story that any decent person would be surprised and sickened by his description.

Aseahawkfan wrote:I don't much agree he can. That area doesn't speak enough English as a group to care about what Trump says. The things they believe and care about over there would surprise and shock you.

I am more annoyed by how dumb and embarrassing his talk is as an American. What kind of trash talk was that? The guy is acting like an entertainer rather than a president. His speech is either comedy or tragedy depending on how you view an operation to kill a terrorist enemy. Why would you describe things in that manner? The guy acts like he is talking with his buddies at the local high end socialize club and he's telling them some impressive story that any decent person would be surprised and sickened by his description.

I think you would be surprised at how many people over there speak English. I'm not exactly a world traveler, but from the limited international travel that I've done combined with the experiences related to me from a number of friends I've made from various regions of the world, it's apparent to me that English is rapidly becoming the universal language. Countries and their residents, particularly in 3rd world areas like the Middle East, realize that the surest way out of poverty and despair is getting access to American money, and the easiest way to achieve that goal is to learn to speak English. They teach it in most schools from grade school through high school, many of them requiring it. Additionally, the world is rapidly becoming socially intertwined, with many families having immediate relatives living in western nations and can convey Trump's speech and mannerisms to their families and friends. Advances in electronic communications has accelerated this phenomenon.

Combine all that with Trump's actions, like his immigration policies, his travel ban that was an obvious target at Muslims, and his jumping in bed with a murderous Saudi kingdom that the majority of the Muslim world hates, and a picture begins to take shape that Trump is at war with the entire Muslim world minus the Saudis. My fear is that moderates interpret Trump's obvious hate for anyone that doesn't look and speak like him as a natural extension of the general sentiment in America. His trash talking plays well to a core base of which many either share or rationalize his nationalistic, xenophobic, and racist tendencies as being not as bad as it sounds, but it doesn't play well internationally. No matter who the POTUS is, what they say matters.

I agree completely with your second paragraph, and there's not much that I can add to it that I haven't said already.

RiverDog wrote:I think you would be surprised at how many people over there speak English. I'm not exactly a world traveler, but from the limited international travel that I've done combined with the experiences related to me from a number of friends I've made from various regions of the world, it's apparent to me that English is rapidly becoming the universal language. Countries and their residents, particularly in 3rd world areas like the Middle East, realize that the surest way out of poverty and despair is getting access to American money, and the easiest way to achieve that goal is to learn to speak English. They teach it in most schools from grade school through high school, many of them requiring it. Additionally, the world is rapidly becoming socially intertwined, with many families having immediate relatives living in western nations and can convey Trump's speech and mannerisms to their families and friends. Advances in electronic communications has accelerated this phenomenon.

Combine all that with Trump's actions, like his immigration policies, his travel ban that was an obvious target at Muslims, and his jumping in bed with a murderous Saudi kingdom that the majority of the Muslim world hates, and a picture begins to take shape that Trump is at war with the entire Muslim world minus the Saudis. My fear is that moderates interpret Trump's obvious hate for anyone that doesn't look and speak like him as a natural extension of the general sentiment in America. His trash talking plays well to a core base of which many either share or rationalize his nationalistic, xenophobic, and racist tendencies as being not as bad as it sounds, but it doesn't play well internationally. No matter who the POTUS is, what they say matters.

I talked to plenty of people in those regions. The vast majority don't speak much English save for highly educated folks in the cities or from wealthy families. Even those folks don't learn to speak English well unless they travel. They also don't have access to much television in the most populous Muslim nations. Most don't even have power all the time. They may get some drivel in Arabic that says something bad about Trump on the radio or in the papers or on their phones, but that is par for the course when you're already teaching that America is the big bad. Barring some of the smaller oil nations like Kuwait, UAE, and parts of Saudi Arabia, the majority of those folks live in an old world type of environment without much TV or media. Even their cell networks aren't great.

This idea they live anywhere near like us or even Europe is not reality. Even those that are considered moderate and well off don't have electricity all the time and don't have access to well-developed system of media delivery. They mostly have access to smartphones and even then their networks and access are not as good as western nations. I'm not hugely concerned with what Trump says. The Middle East isn't any more interested in truth than Trump. You could give the most well thought out, diplomatic, and fair speech as a foreign politician and the power brokers and media in the Middle East would still spin it as they want it. There is not a high value on truth in the Middle Eastern media. And the local Imams and elders that manage villages and small communities really don't care about the big stuff in the world.

It's not something I would worry about. I'm sure the press could spin some tragedy up as caused by Trump's words, but the psychos in their region going to kill anyway.

On an amusing side note, this Indian guy worships Trump as a god. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEAD33WdQQw Humans are nutty.

If you want to see some of what they think, give Al Jazeera English a watch for a little taste. It's way different in Arabic though. There's lots of general entertainment, mostly from Egypt and Lebanon I believe. You get even more info talking to residents from that region. Ask them about 9/11. Enjoy the discussions. Majority of folks are like our conspiracy theorists here in my experience. Common belief in the Middle East in my experience is 9/11 was carried out by Israel and the Zionists.

They don't much care what we think on a daily basis. Now Muslims in America are likely unhappy. All his rhetoric affects them far more than their fellows around the world. I imagine it doesn't make them too happy hearing the president's additional commentary. Not sure it will radicalize anyone more than they already are. Seems we could have Mr. Rogers as president and some loon would find a way to twist what he said into some reason to do violence. Some humans are just crazy and it doesn't matter what public figures do or say cuz crazy going to do crazy.

Aseahawkfan wrote:I talked to plenty of people in those regions. The vast majority don't speak much English save for highly educated folks in the cities or from wealthy families. Even those folks don't learn to speak English well unless they travel. They also don't have access to much television in the most populous Muslim nations. Most don't even have power all the time. They may get some drivel in Arabic that says something bad about Trump on the radio or in the papers or on their phones, but that is par for the course when you're already teaching that America is the big bad. Barring some of the smaller oil nations like Kuwait, UAE, and parts of Saudi Arabia, the majority of those folks live in an old world type of environment without much TV or media. Even their cell networks aren't great.

This idea they live anywhere near like us or even Europe is not reality. Even those that are considered moderate and well off don't have electricity all the time and don't have access to well-developed system of media delivery. They mostly have access to smartphones and even then their networks and access are not as good as western nations. I'm not hugely concerned with what Trump says. The Middle East isn't any more interested in truth than Trump. You could give the most well thought out, diplomatic, and fair speech as a foreign politician and the power brokers and media in the Middle East would still spin it as they want it. There is not a high value on truth in the Middle Eastern media. And the local Imams and elders that manage villages and small communities really don't care about the big stuff in the world.

The thing is that it's the educated folks with access to the media that become the leaders of any movement (MLK and the civil rights movement is a good example), and if we taint those folks with a negative view of America, they'll convince others to follow them. Even though the audience might be limited, we still need to be sending a positive message like we did to the peoples behind the Iron Curtain from 1945-1990.

RiverDog wrote:The thing is that it's the educated folks with access to the media that become the leaders of any movement (MLK and the civil rights movement is a good example), and if we taint those folks with a negative view of America, they'll convince others to follow them. Even though the audience might be limited, we still need to be sending a positive message like we did to the peoples behind the Iron Curtain from 1945-1990.

They already have a negative view of America. I wish you would read some Middle East news and propaganda. Watch the clerics and leaders they listen to like Moqtada Al Sadr and Zair Naik. I was one of the only people not surprised by Omar's talk. What she said is pretty much the normal belief of what constitute moderate Muslims. Trump is not going to create any more of a negative view of America than is already taught in Muslim nations.

To Muslim nations we are the enemy. We are the supporter of Israel's control of Palestine where the third most holy shrine in Islam is located. We are oppressors of Islam because we back dictators and cause wars in their regions of the world. We support Zionism and are a morally corrupt nation. When we went to Pakistan to help with earthquake relief back in 2005, a Pakistani guy had to assure his relatives in Pakistan that we weren't invading their country.

Americans don't seem to understand how they view us over there and how much truly vile crap we have done in their nations. They teach history about American interactions in Muslim nations very differently in those nations. And we are the bad guy. Iraqi and Iranian people blame our government for a war that killed a million of their people. The Iraqi guy I talked to said the Iraqi people view the removal of Saddam Hussein as something we owed them for putting him into power and helping him maintain power all the years we did oppressing them and causing a lot of their pain and suffering. And he said it is our fault Iraq and Iran went to war because we told Saddam Hussein to make war on Iran after the Shah fell.

And you think Trump will make that worse? Doubtful. Very doubtful. It's very hard for any American leader to improve our relations with that area of the world after all the crap we have done there. How does Trump make this any worse when we're basically viewed as this great evil nation by Islamic people around the world? I'm never going to buy that narrative. We are very badly viewed by Islamic people in those areas of the world for very good reasons. Until we change how we interact with that area of the world, that view is unlikely to change.