'The Chant'

[I-5]

Trump to crowd, during rally:"They are always telling us how to run it, how to do this. You know what? If they don't love it, tell them to leave it"

Trump the day after the rally talking about the 'send them back' chant: "I was not happy with it. I disagree with it. But again, I didn't say that, they did...It was quite a chant"

It's ok to say you support his policies and call out this BS at the same time. Everyone knows exactly what he's doing, and that throwing red meat to his base is the ONLY chance he has. Whatever you do, just don't try to spin it as anything but what it is.

[burrrton]

I made it clear in the other thread what I thought of his tweet, but "if you hate it so much, you're free to leave" is a common turn-of-phrase, and ''sending' someone somewhere (what the skids in the crowd were chanting for) is different than telling them they have the option of moving to the places they claim are so much better.

Further, he did distance himself from the 'send them home' crap, something I think we can agree is a remarkable thing for him to do (which I take as an indication of his acknowledgement it's a terrible thing to advocate).

The Trump haters *really* need to figure out how to process his behavior rationally. You can't sh*t the bed yelling "HOLOCAUST LITERALLY HITLER RAWR RAWR" over ICE detention centers then expect anyone to take you seriously when you want to criticize bigoted language.

It's ok to say you support his policies and call out this BS at the same time.

Agreed. It's also OK for you to admit he might not be the second coming of Hitler because he's too thin-skinned and/or stupid to pick his phrasing more carefully.

[Aseahawkfan]

I think we already know what certain elements of Trump's base are like.

[Aseahawkfan]

I made it clear in the other thread what I thought of his tweet, but "if you hate it so much, you're free to leave" is a common turn-of-phrase, and ''sending' someone somewhere (what the skids in the crowd were chanting for) is different than telling them they have the option of moving to the places they claim are so much better.

Did any of the people Trump attacked say the places they are from are so much better? I don't recall any of them saying that.

[I-5]

burrrton you might have me confused with someone else. I’m not implying or equating him with Hitler. I must have missed that conversation in another thread. Do you think he’s sincere about ‘distancing’ himself from the chant that he seemed to revel in 24 hours earlier? Reminds me exactly of when he took Putin’s side in Finland and threw his own country’s intelligence community under the bus, then the next day says he ‘misspoke’ and meant to say the exact opposite of what he says. I’m sure you didn’t believe that whopper either...I hope!

[burrrton]

Did any of the people Trump attacked say the places they are from are so much better?

Huh? Three of the four are 'from' the US.

Also, I didn't say anyone was alluding to the disaster from which CongressDitz Ilhan immigrated.

[burrrton]

Do you think he’s sincere about ‘distancing’ himself from the chant that he seemed to revel in 24 hours earlier?

Yes. If there's one person on this planet that wouldn't cop to something like that without it being sincere, I think it's him.

Reminds me exactly of when he took Putin’s side in Finland and threw his own country’s intelligence community under the bus, then the next day says he ‘misspoke’ and meant to say the exact opposite of what he says. I’m sure you didn’t believe that whopper either...I hope!

Um, I thought the same thing then that I've thought so many other times- he's a narcissist dumbsh*t and 'takes the side' of whoever is kissing his ass at that moment in time.

[RiverDog]

Further, he did distance himself from the 'send them home' crap, something I think we can agree is a remarkable thing for him to do (which I take as an indication of his acknowledgement it's a terrible thing to advocate).

He didn't distance himself from it. More like trying to have his cake and eat it, too.

If he was trying to distance himself from it, he wouldn't have used such inflammatory language in that rally, ie the "the hate-filled extremists who are constantly trying to tear our country down." That's red meat for those bigoted supporters of his and is what started the chant. If he disagreed with the chant, he could have stopped it by simply raising his arms, but he just stood there and let it go on. Personally, I think he sort of vapor locked, thinking that he might have gone too far yet he knows that's what his base likes and decided just to go with the flow.

The Trump haters *really* need to figure out how to process his behavior rationally. You can't sh*t the bed yelling "HOLOCAUST LITERALLY HITLER RAWR RAWR" over ICE detention centers then expect anyone to take you seriously when you want to criticize bigoted language.

I agree, the Dems using that kind of language and comparisons is completely irrational, perhaps even disrespectful of those who lost relatives in the Holocaust, to compare Nazi death camps with overcrowded conditions at the border. But their irrational and inappropriate analogies of facilities and treatment of detainees aren't even close to the outrageous behavior of the President of the United States suggesting that a specific group of American citizens elected to Congress by their peers and that have done nothing illegal to "go back to where they came from."

On a scale of one to ten on the outrage meter, the Dem's are at about a 2 or a 3 while Trump came close to pegging it at a 9.

[RiverDog]

Do you think he’s sincere about ‘distancing’ himself from the chant that he seemed to revel in 24 hours earlier?

Yes. If there's one person on this planet that wouldn't cop to something like that without it being sincere, I think it's him.

Trump changes his position so often and lies so much that it's impossible to tell when he's sincere and when he's lying.

Reminds me exactly of when he took Putin’s side in Finland and threw his own country’s intelligence community under the bus, then the next day says he ‘misspoke’ and meant to say the exact opposite of what he says. I’m sure you didn’t believe that whopper either...I hope!

Um, I thought the same thing then that I've thought so many other times- he's a narcissist dumbsh*t and 'takes the side' of whoever is kissing his ass at that moment in time.

I hadn't thought of that, but I agree.

[Aseahawkfan]

Huh? Three of the four are 'from' the US.

Also, I didn't say anyone was alluding to the disaster from which CongressDitz Ilhan immigrated.

So it was a comment tossed in to the mix usually associated with that thinking.

[burrrton]

On a scale of one to ten on the outrage meter, the Dem's are at about a 2 or a 3 while Trump came close to pegging it at a 9.

LOL. Yeah, "if you don't like it, leave" is the same as "UR HITLER".

[burrrton]

Trump changes his position so often and lies so much that it's impossible to tell when he's sincere and when he's lying.

Agree, but when a guy with his personality admits to being wrong on some level, it tends to be sincere- if he didn't actually regret it, there's no way in h3ll he'd come close to approaching the same universe as a retraction.

[RiverDog]

On a scale of one to ten on the outrage meter, the Dem's are at about a 2 or a 3 while Trump came close to pegging it at a 9.

LOL. Yeah, "if you don't like it, leave" is the same as "UR HITLER".

Did any of "The Squad" compare Donald Trump to Adolph Hitler?

They were comparing conditions at a facility to concentration camps, not comparing one person to another. Trump made it personal.

[Aseahawkfan]

Did any of "The Squad" compare Donald Trump to Adolph Hitler?

They were comparing conditions at a facility to concentration camps, not comparing one person to another. Trump made it personal.

The Squad. Some new nickname to call them by. Please, make it stop, make it stop. We truly are in a John Waters film.

[I-5]

Agree, but when a guy with his personality admits to being wrong on some level, it tends to be sincere- if he didn't actually regret it, there's no way in h3ll he'd come close to approaching the same universe as a retraction.

I didn't catch him admitting he was wrong at any level. More like saying he never really agreed with what was happening...even though he thoroughly revelled in it. Trump would never, never, never say he's wrong about anything. That's his number one rule. It's just 'locker room' talk, right?

[burrrton]

They were comparing conditions at a facility to concentration camps, not comparing one person to another. Trump made it personal.

The comparisons to Hitler have been constant and unending, and comparing bog-standard detention centers to "concentration camps" (especially with the bonus of "'NEVER AGAIN' means something!" thrown in) is obviously an extension of that BS to anyone not struggling to apologize for those juvenile morons.

[I-5]

Why do we keep changing the subject? Back to the OP; does anyone believe Trump regrets the chant? This is what his rallies are all about; throwing red meat to the mob, while he stokes it. They love it.

[burrrton]

Trump would never, never, never say he's wrong about anything. That's his number one rule.

I don't have the quotes in front of me, but he clearly and uncharacteristically backed away from his 'go home' verbiage'.

What I'd say is it's not a hard and fast "rule" to never admit he's wrong, but it is certainly a characteristic of his, so when he does it *on some level" (the words I used, I think), it should tell you it's sincere- he doesn't do that easily.

[burrrton]

Why do we keep changing the subject?

The same reason we always do- the "NEVAR TRUMP" TDS lunatics have no idea how to process his behavior rationally.

Back to the OP; does anyone believe Trump regrets the chant? This is what his rallies are all about; throwing red meat to the mob, while he stokes it. They love it.

They're his supporters- whether he agrees or disagrees with them, he doesn't give a sh*t what they chant as long as they keep kissing his ass.

[I-5]

Which part of my post or replies contain irrational statements? I’d like to learn.

[RiverDog]

Why do we keep changing the subject? Back to the OP; does anyone believe Trump regrets the chant? This is what his rallies are all about; throwing red meat to the mob, while he stokes it. They love it.

I'm not sure that he regrets the chant. He clearly incited the crowd with his very inflammatory remarks prior to the chant and shouldn't have been surprised when they took it to the next level. IMO he was trying to calculate whether it would be best for him to embrace the chant or distance himself from it. I think his brain went into vapor lock.

[burrrton]

Which part of my post or replies contain irrational statements? I’d like to learn.

I I didn't say you made irrational statements.

[I-5]

I’m not aware of Trump ever admitting he was wrong, except I’ve seen him back away from something he’s said when he sees public reaction. The Helsinki debacle is an example...and he didn’t say he was wrong, he just ‘misspoke’. In Charlottesville, he double downed on ‘fine people on both sides’ in reference to white supremacists. You’ll have to remind me.

[burrrton]

Read more on this incident, then, I-5.

[I-5]

Assigning homework? Which incident? Why not just say what you mean...he’s said thousands of erroneous statements or outright lies since that day, so I’m sorry if I’m not able to choose the right statement to prove the point you’re trying to make. I’ve not heard him ever admit he was wrong.

[burrrton]

Read his statements on this freaking issue for chrissakes. I'm on my phone so it's a hassle to link you to things you can find with 10s of searching.

[I-5]

i saw his interview from the White House. He deflected blame for the chant by saying it wasn’t him that said it (he did say ‘they can leave’..hmm), and he said he didn’t disagree with it (though he was ok with it the day before since he said nothing while the chant went on and on. This is the BS I’m talking about. Call it what is. He doesn’t fool most people, but his supporters believe every word.

[Hawktawk]

Trump basked in the glow with a smirk on his face allowing the chant to continue for 13 seconds before saying anything. He didn't admonish the crowd in any way. John McCain did, stopping a town hall meeting to disagree with a woman who said Obama was an Arab and chastising her on national TV.

Had McCain played the race card which would have been simple to do he might well have been elected but I digress. Trump coming out and making a statement the following day was absolutely worthless and he couldn't even tell it straight, saying he couldn't hear what they were saying. It was his advisors and a few congressmen finally standing up just a little coupled with polls showing him once again cratering with independents , swing state voters and suburbanites that made this vapid empty morally bankrupt vessel say what he did.

Burrt you're a very smart guy but you are too cool for school when it comes to this POS. You sound a little like Lindsey Graham honestly

And no he's not Hitler. He's too stupid and and weak and gullible as the despots he reveres prove by playing him like a fiddle. But hes a wanna be despot.

No he's no Hitler but his slathering horde of Trumptards, too cool for school dismissive critics and utter bobblehead sycophants in congress who cheer his unacceptable racist antics show me how hitler rose to power....

[RiverDog]

Trump basked in the glow with a smirk on his face allowing the chant to continue for 13 seconds before saying anything. He didn't admonish the crowd in any way. John McCain did, stopping a town hall meeting to disagree with a woman who said Obama was an Arab and chastising her on national TV.

Had McCain played the race card which would have been simple to do he might well have been elected but I digress. Trump coming out and making a statement the following day was absolutely worthless and he couldn't even tell it straight, saying he couldn't hear what they were saying. It was his advisors and a few congressmen finally standing up just a little coupled with polls showing him once again cratering with independents , swing state voters and suburbanites that made this vapid empty morally bankrupt vessel say what he did.

McCain wasn't going to beat Obama no matter what he said or didn't say, but I agree with your analogy regarding McCain's stopping a meeting and chastising the woman you spoke of. I'm also reminded of Hubert Humphrey, in the 1960 West Virginia primary, telling prospective voters that if they were voting for him just because his opponent was a Catholic, that he didn't want their vote. Those were people that felt that some things, in particular your honor and your reputation, are more important than winning an election. Unfortunately our current POTUS does not share those attributes.

[Hawktawk]

https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2019/07/18 ... r-country/

I've said it before and this just proves it once again. Trump isn't fit for any job in america except being a bankruptcy acrobat in Trump world and apparently president of the united states and *leader* of the free world. He couldn't be an assembly line worker as I am and stay employed saying what he does, having a social media profile like he does. We are warned verbally and in writing that language like he regularly uses is grounds for immediate termination.

He couldn't stay employed ANYWHERE ELSE. But hey Im wetting the bed again I guess

[Hawktawk]

https://www.yahoo.com/now/trump-fumes-o ... 35880.html

This is not a man who is mentally well..I get accused of being a loon for colorfully expressing my righteous vitriol at this disgrace of a president and maybe there's something to it although I know how to spell correctly at least.

But you can't call me a loon and then say someone this thin skinned ,narcissistic, utterly dishonest and immoral is OK upstairs either....He wants to make these 4 women the face of the Dem party but of course they aren't which is why Biden is leading in the polls. But he is definitely the crazy wild raccoon eyed face of the Trump party and its not going to go well unless he gets on some meds.

[RiverDog]

https://chicago.cbslocal.com/2019/07/18/buckys-employee-fired-racism-viral-video-go-back-to-their-country/

I've said it before and this just proves it once again. Trump isn't fit for any job in america except being a bankruptcy acrobat in Trump world and apparently president of the united states and *leader* of the free world. He couldn't be an assembly line worker as I am and stay employed saying what he does, having a social media profile like he does. We are warned verbally and in writing that language like he regularly uses is grounds for immediate termination.

He couldn't stay employed ANYWHERE ELSE. But hey Im wetting the bed again I guess

There's more to it than the racist language being used by the store clerk. He also refused service to a customer, so it's not directly analogous to the Trump tweet.

However, it's likely that the clerk took his que from Trump.

[RiverDog]

Further, he did distance himself from the 'send them home' crap, something I think we can agree is a remarkable thing for him to do (which I take as an indication of his acknowledgement it's a terrible thing to advocate).

So much for Trump's "remarkable thing" of distancing him from the "send them home crap":

Less than 24 hours after attempting to disavow supporters who chanted "send her back" at his North Carolina rally this week, President Trump reversed course and took their side.

"As you know, those are incredible people...those are incredible patriots," the president said Friday.

The chant was widely seen as a racist attack on Minnesota congresswoman Ilhan Omar, who is originally from Somalia but is now an American citizen. After first lady Melania Trump, the president's daughter Ivanka, and several republican lawmakers expressed their concerns about the ugly scene, the president offered a tepid rebuke.

"I disagree with it, by the way," Mr. Trump said. "But it was quite a chant and I felt a little bit badly about it."

But less than a day later, he was back to blaming Omar. "You know what I'm unhappy with? I'm unhappy with the fact that a congresswoman can hate our country," Mr. Trump said. "I'm unhappy with the fact that a congresswoman can say anti-Semitic things."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/send-her-b ... 019-07-20/

[burrrton]

"I disagree with it, by the way," Mr. Trump said. "But it was quite a chant and I felt a little bit badly about it."

Yeah, that's quite the backtrack.

Did you think them chanting that stuff suddenly made Omar a great friend of Trump's and *not* anti-Semitic?

[Hawktawk]

Did you think them chanting that stuff suddenly made Omar a great friend of Trump's and *not* anti-Semitic?

Frankly a majority of americans don't like Omar or the other women in the "squad" including Nancy Pelosi and the rest of the democrats in congress . They often get only their 4 votes out of 250+ with their legislation. Omar in particular has absolutely made anti semitic comments and I thought the House was weak to only offer a resolution condemning discrimination on all sides as opposed to slapping her down with a rebuke. Bidens lead in the primary polling shows that democrats in general are not near as far left as the squad.

But here's the thing. Prior to Trump's racist go back comments all 4 women were underwater and Trump was climbing in the polls to the highest level of his presidency. Polling showed his comments were very unpopular with a strong majority of americans disapproving which is why hes backpedaling while still trying to play to his base. Omar got a hero's welcome back to her district when she was reportedly facing a primary challenge within her own party causing him to launch a twitter blizzard.

It was another unforced error by asshat. It's why he's never gotten his head above water politically since his inauguration. Every time it's going smoothly he trips over his little mushroom and down he goes again and up goes the approval rating of his opponents.

[Aseahawkfan]

I'm starting to wonder of Trump will be like L. Ron Hubbard someday where he finally comes clean that he can't believe all these people voted for him after all the crazy crap he has spouted, all his reversals, and just the generally crazy way he went about campaigning.

[RiverDog]

Yeah, that's quite the backtrack.

Did you think them chanting that stuff suddenly made Omar a great friend of Trump's and *not* anti-Semitic?

The "backtrack" was from his on one day saying that he disagreed with them and that the chant made him feel badly then the next day calling those that were chanting "incredible people, incredible patriots". Having his cake and eating it, too.

That's not how you distance yourself from a subject.

[idhawkman]

The "backtrack" was from his on one day saying that he disagreed with them and that the chant made him feel badly then the next day calling those that were chanting "incredible people, incredible patriots". Having his cake and eating it, too.

That's not how you distance yourself from a subject.

Wow, that's quite a standard you set Riv. You can't be an incredible patriot or an incredible person if you've ever said one thing wrong. Good luck convincing people of that.

[RiverDog]

The "backtrack" was from his on one day saying that he disagreed with them and that the chant made him feel badly then the next day calling those that were chanting "incredible people, incredible patriots". Having his cake and eating it, too.

That's not how you distance yourself from a subject.

Wow, that's quite a standard you set Riv. You can't be an incredible patriot or an incredible person if you've ever said one thing wrong. Good luck convincing people of that.

Of course, as an individual, one can say something wrong and be excused for it under certain circumstances (like an apology).

But the chant didn't highlight any individual. It was a collective effort, so you can't say that they "said one thing wrong".
The group only said "one thing". You're suggesting that the group "said" multiple things and just happened to get one of them wrong.

Trump initially distanced himself from the chant (a day late and dollar short IMO but better than nothing), then the next day when the subject was being discussed, flip flopped by describing the chanters as "incredible patriots", with the obvious implication being that what they were chanting was "patriotic" as there was no other activity, before or after, that the chanters were engaged in.

You can't have it both ways. You can't on the one hand, say that you disagreed with the chant and on the other hand, say that the chant was "patriotic".

[I-5]

I'm starting to wonder of Trump will be like L. Ron Hubbard someday where he finally comes clean that he can't believe all these people voted for him after all the crazy crap he has spouted, all his reversals, and just the generally crazy way he went about campaigning.

That's exactly what I've always though, ASF. Glad I'm not the only one who thinks so.