Thomas out Walters in for punt returns

[depaashaas]

Glad that project is over, not due to Earl fumbling the ball, Walters has done the same but I really did not like to see Earl being exposed into a situation were injuries in the league are happening the most. I generally like Pete's view of thinking outside the box but in this case just an old fashion dose of common sense is just fine with me. Pete can say all he want's about Earl not being focused but I think it also has a lot to do with the fact they are running thin at CB spots and last thing you need now is to be out of Earl for 2-4 weeks over a punt return

http://www.seahawks.com/news/articles/a ... 54edd6b15f

[c_hawkbob]

This makes me very happy.

[mykc14]

Good, maybe just put him out there if we need him.

[THX-1138]

Oh thank Gahd!

Especially since it appeared that Earl was showing a bit of a propensity for wanting to return everything. He was going to get LAID OUT by somebody.

[Zorn76]

Still wish Harvin would do it.

[RiverDog]

Thank you, Pete.

[kalibane]

I'd rather not risk Harvin on punts either. He's on kickoffs, that's good enough. I liked what I saw of Walters in preseason. He may not be Devin Hester but I think he'll do well.

I don't think there is anyone (aside from maybe Earl and Seahawk opponents) who is unhappy about this move. We should also given an honorable mention to Richard Sherman for blocking a gunner into Earl, helping to cause the fumble.

[Seahawks4Ever]

Best news I had heard in a while. I really believed that winning the Super Bowl had really swelled the egos of Pete, Earl, and Sherm who also wanted to return punts.

I am so glad that the only cost was a TD that they essentially spotted to the Packers. I am elated it did not lead to E.T.

[NorthHawk]

Ditto.
And now ET can concentrate solely on his S duties and the next opponent rather than spending time with the Punt return team.

[HumanCockroach]

Eh, I think the mitigating factor was his decision making ( not so good) not any real or presumed injury risk. 1000s of punts a season, with few to less than few injuries. Never felt concern over a possible injury, My concerns stemmed solely from some questionable decision making. I like that Thomas and Sherman volunteered to help the team in one of the "concern" areas, it's what athletes do all the way up. Fine with him not returning punts, but see little to no reason for that decision other than he wasn't the best guy on the team to do it.

[Seahawks4Ever]

Well, I was worried about either Earl or Sherm getting injured returning punts even if the team didn't and I will tell you why.

After ET didn't signal a FC with the 1st. punt he fielded Pete said that they had talked to him and told him that if he is in that situation again that he should just signal a fair catch. Pete said that Earl acknowledged that he understood. Then, the very next punt he again didn't signal a FC even though he should have and this time it resulted in a fumble and the Packers turned it into 6 points. After the game Earl said that he wasn't going to change anything about the way he fielded punts, that's just way he said he plays the game. I love that about the guy but that is NOT putting the team first and that was the very first time I had EVER knew ET to put personal stats ahead of the team. Now, that IS the reason Pete pulled him from PR duties. and he was right to do so. I got to think that Richard Sherman would pick his spots better and not put himself into that situation. But I still don't want him doing it unless it is absolutely necessary( like we need a big lift or something.

The reason I worried so much about either ET or Sherm sustaining an injury returning punts because out in the defensive backfield doing their regular jobs they are both integral members of the LOB and losing either one of them for any length of time would be totally catastrophic to our defensive backfield, especially after losing so much depth. There is absolutely no reason to put either of those guys in that kind of jeopardy.

Does anybody remember Richard Sherman finishing the Super Bowl on crutches?? What if he had got injured in the first half? Worse, what if he had got injured in the first half in the NFC Championship game against the 49ners??? Same with ET, what if he is injured in a play off game returning a punt, and don't tell me that teams wouldn't be looking to take either of them out, heck, they would take them out on a regular defensive play if they got the chance and returning a punt is just asking for a cheap shot, especially playing against the Rams with that scum bag Bounty-Gate DC they have.

Everyone including the commentators said that Richard Sherman blocked the Packer defender in to ET which then caused the fumble. I saw it differently, I saw ET concentrating on making the catch yet not signaling for a FC. Richard Sherman saw that Earl wasn't going to signal for a FC and the guy he was supposed to be blocking was getting by him and would be in position to hit earl as soon as he fielded the ball. RS, as the Packer was getting by him actually reached out and tried to grab the guy and redirect him away from Earl but to no avail. It wasn't very good blocking by Sherm and he probably could have been flagged for grabbing and pulling the guy but after the fumble the zebras just let it go. Earl felt that the Packer had not given him the space they are supposed to give kick returners but, after Sherman had engaged the Packer the way he did the zebras just went with the call that Sherm had "blocked" his man in to ET thus it was a legit fumble, in their eyes.

Well, again, a player fielding a kick especially a punt in concentrating on making the catch and is totally defenseless and that is where a punt returner is wide open to get injured, especially when they are so important to the defense as a starter.

Has anyone forgot Kenny Easely volunteering to being a punt returner and getting hurt??? Hey, I worry about all of the guys in the LOB getting hurt by unscrupulous receivers diving for their knees and/or ankles. I was really worried leading up to the Super Bowl because pukes like Welker had a history of blindsiding DB's by diving and rolling trying to take out the knees and/ankles of DB's and LB's. It took them most of the game but they finally DID get Sherm out of the game. They are especially going to have to be on their guard this season as every team they play is going to try every dirty trick to try and get players like ET, Sherm., and Kam out of the game, hook or by crook.

I wouldn't be so paranoid if everyone wasn't out to get me LOL!!!

[HumanCockroach]

Haven't forgotten Easily twisting his ankle doing it, nor did I forget that he missed zero game time and was named an All Pro that season. Again, that was in what? 1984? How many serious injuries has there been by a PR. Name them: There isn't, and never has been. It is a slightly less dangerous position than PUNTER for the love of god, and slightly more dangerous than placekicker. I can understand not wanting risking it, but for the love of all that is holy, I wish people would STOP pretending like the risk was some sort of excessive danger, it wasn't, never has been, and never will be.

FAR more dangerous is kickoff coverage, something Sherman, Thomas, Chancellor Wagner ALL do every game, and yet there has been zero fretting about that aspect, so why so much concern over this ?

[NorthHawk]

Earl's effectiveness as a S is dependent upon speed. All it would take is a slight hamstring pull or turned ankle and the whole Defense will be affected. If he is to get hurt, I would rather it be as a S than on a lark returning punts. At least he wouldn't be hurt doing something 5 or 10 guys on the team can do with similar effectiveness.

[depaashaas]

Haven't forgotten Easily twisting his ankle doing it, nor did I forget that he missed zero game time and was named an All Pro that season. Again, that was in what? 1984? How many serious injuries has there been by a PR. Name them: There isn't, and never has been. It is a slightly less dangerous position than PUNTER for the love of god, and slightly more dangerous than placekicker. I can understand not wanting risking it, but for the love of all that is holy, I wish people would STOP pretending like the risk was some sort of excessive danger, it wasn't, never has been, and never will be.

FAR more dangerous is kickoff coverage, something Sherman, Thomas, Chancellor Wagner ALL do every game, and yet there has been zero fretting about that aspect, so why so much concern over this ?

All I can find is that he injured his ankle in '86 and that injury resulted pretty much in a career ending kind of thing, now I know that if I am right Easily is a very extreme case if that was to be it. But do you know who backs up Earl at safety if he gets hurt? DeShawn Shead, I for one have hardly heard about him could be just me, guess he's good being a back up at that position with the Hawks for three years and all but still. I understand what you are saying about players getting hurt, it's football for crying out loud there is a lot of them getting hurt. But IMO there is a difference when players get hurt in their "normal playing position" compared to playing punt returner, especially someone like Earl and they way Earl was playing he was going to expose himself to potential injuries. I liked Baldwin returning punts last year and yes he can get hurt and I like Baldwin a lot but with 7 other receivers on the team it is easier to replace him in case he get's hurt. One thing I have learned about Pete over the years is that when he says one thing there is a completely different thing coming out about a week or two from now that makes you think "hmm maybe that has something to do with that." But I agree with what you are saying to that Earl also was just not a good fit at due to his decision making at punt returning, I for one had to grasp for some air after seeing him being piled on by what? 5 guys or so last week

[HumanCockroach]

Not sure where you are getting that info, but Easily stepped in for an injured Paul Johns in 1984, played the entire season, and was named an all pro. He was diagnosed with a kidney ailment when traded to St. Louis Cardinals for the rights to Kelly Stouffer three years later, had to retire and sued the Seahawks for their handling of him ( which is why it took so long for them to put him in the ring of honor). It most certainly was not due to the sprained ankle he incurred returning punts.

The point is moot as regardless of what you posted, Thomas isn't returning punts. I didn't want him doing so in the first place, but that had nothing to do with some made up "danger" from doing so. As I said there are far more dangerous plays on a football field, Sanders, Reed, Peterson have all returned punts, and not been injured doing so, so I wasn't in the least concerned that Thomas couldn't do it safely, I was however concerned with his reckless decision making, and ultimately that is the reason he isn't doing it any longer.

[NorthHawk]

I know it doesn't matter now, but a quick check showed Randall Cobb in 2012 hurt his ankle on a PR, Jacoby Jones had a knee injury in 2013, Rashaun Johnson lost part of his finger in 2013, and this year Davante Adams (R) from GB hurt his wrist.
So injuries to punt returners do happen every year.

[RiverDog]

Not sure where you are getting that info, but Easily stepped in for an injured Paul Johns in 1984, played the entire season, and was named an all pro. He was diagnosed with a kidney ailment when traded to St. Louis Cardinals for the rights to Kelly Stouffer three years later, had to retire and sued the Seahawks for their handling of him ( which is why it took so long for them to put him in the ring of honor). It most certainly was not due to the sprained ankle he incurred returning punts.

The point is moot as regardless of what you posted, Thomas isn't returning punts. I didn't want him doing so in the first place, but that had nothing to do with some made up "danger" from doing so. As I said there are far more dangerous plays on a football field, Sanders, Reed, Peterson have all returned punts, and not been injured doing so, so I wasn't in the least concerned that Thomas couldn't do it safely, I was however concerned with his reckless decision making, and ultimately that is the reason he isn't doing it any longer.

HC: This is the second time I've caught you misspelling Kenny Easley's last name, which is inexcusable for die hard 12's like us. I'm going to make you go to the blackboard and write it 100 times!

Heck, it's an easier name to spell than Hasselbeck, isn't it?

[HumanCockroach]

Auto correct RD nothing more.In fact let me put the correct spelling into my phone right now ..... Easley..... done.

[Long Time Fan]

I take this change as a sign that PC can see when a decision isn't working and needs to be changed. So many at the top of his profession marry a way of thinking and can not course correct. This move shows the worth of Pete as a coach more than the worth of ET as a punt returner.

[HumanCockroach]

I know it doesn't matter now, but a quick check showed Randall Cobb in 2012 hurt his ankle on a PR, Jacoby Jones had a knee injury in 2013, Rashaun Johnson lost part of his finger in 2013, and this year Davante Adams (R) from GB hurt his wrist.
So injuries to punt returners do happen every year.

Cobb did indeed injure his ankle ( though it was in 2012 not 2013) and missed? You guessed it zero games ( though he did miss ten the following year after breaking his leg on a REGULAR snap) Jones was indeed hurt after his rookie blocker ran into his leg last season and missed a game, the Ram player was NOT hurt on a punt return, he was injured on punt coverage( something Earl actually does not do). None of these examples actually hold weight as there was no serious injuries ( certainly not career threatening as was implied earlier for Easley) you would be pretty hard pressed to find serious injuries on PR. I'm not talking out of my arse here, few, VERY few serious injuries occur on punt returns. Whether people want to accept that truth or not, doesn't change that from being the truth.

[NorthHawk]

An injured ankle or hamstring for a player like Thomas whose range makes him what he is would make him an average Safety and the whole Defensive secondary would have to adjust as if he was out. One game where he is hobbled could be the difference between HFA and missing the playoffs.
I'm glad they woke up and stopped this nonsense because things can and do happen on punt returns as any time you handle the ball you are subject to being hit and possibly injured.
Why increase the probability when not necessary and when others less valuable can do just as well?

[HumanCockroach]

Every punt returner in the leagues job is dependant on speed and agility. They are always "skill" players, and are dependant on that stuff, whether it be HOF players like Sanders, or ST fifth receivers like Jones, or possible HOF players like Welker. The truth of the matter remains, you cannot play scared, or not do things out of fear. Thomas' issues were his unwillingness to play the position smart ( ie call for a fair catch when warranted, get away from the ball) his decision making could indeed have caused an injury, but to continue to say it is an inherent part of the job isn't accurate, I'm sorry that so many erroniouslerroneously feel it is, but it isn't.

I could flip that whole one game thing on it's ear as well. One game can indeed cost them those things, can you say that Thomas would NOT have been the difference between winning an losing a game, by getting his open field running on the field? You can't, there is no way. It is just as possible that Thomas WINS games returning as it is him getting injured ( honestly MORE likely). So spare the what if...... I did NOT want him returning punts, NOT because of some made up fear, but because he was dangerous with the ball, and THAT had a MUCH higher probability than some random, not likely injury scenario would have cost Seahawks games, which is why the switch was made according to Carroll ( ie he is playing like a rookie back there).

[Agent 86]

Auto correct RD nothing more.In fact let me put the correct spelling into my phone right now ..... Easley..... done.

LOL..good stuff guys, I enjoy a good laugh amongst fellow posters on something like this.

Not sure if anyone heard PC's weekly interviews on Sirius, but Pat Kirwan asked him about the switch. And basically Pete he didn't want Earl to be thinking about a muffed punt or turnover when he is on defense. He wants him fully focused when he is on D. He said ET29 was totally OK with the move to Walters. As someone mentioned earlier, it is nice to see when a coach can realize a decision wasn't right and make the change and not be stubborn about it.

FYI, PC is on a Sirius weekly on Tuesday's at around 1:00PST for those that can listen. Always a great listen when his good friend Pat Kirwan is asking him questions. PK always asks him things that I want to know and Pete is pretty candid with his answers.

[Hawktawk]

I remember a game vs Denver at mile high in the 80's. Kenny Easley was returning punts. As I recall he was signaling for a fair catch and the gunner hit him right in the jaw with the crown of his helment with the ball still in the air. Easley was cold cocked on the play and had to be helped off the field. It was a clear attempt to injure our best defender and I wouldn't put it past one of our desperate opponents in this situation either. It is stupid to put either ET or Sherman in that type of position.

[Bird Droppings]

I repeat myself when I hit bad speed bumps at the wrong time, especially when the other side of the speed bump shows blurred rainbows.

They don't need Walters as a receiver.

And they don't need LaMichael James as a running back.

But, they need the best option possible at punt returner.

A possible answer better than an existing waiting for something bad to happen as more likely than something good to happen is quacking and flies over speed bump and is ready for immediate employment after this coming Sunday.

As to Mr. Kirmin and Mr. Carroll, Mr. Kirwin was nearly a member of Seahawks organization when Mr. Carroll, who knows about birds, flew in.

Some of those questions are discussed before hand.

You ain't heard Pete sound flummoxed on that show yet, have you?

zoom

[Agent 86]

I repeat myself when I hit bad speed bumps at the wrong time, especially when the other side of the speed bump shows blurred rainbows.

They don't need Walters as a receiver.

And they don't need LaMichael James as a running back.

But, they need the best option possible at punt returner.

A possible answer better than an existing waiting for something bad to happen as more likely than something good to happen is quacking and flies over speed bump and is ready for immediate employment after this coming Sunday.

As to Mr. Kirmin and Mr. Carroll, Mr. Kirwin was nearly a member of Seahawks organization when Mr. Carroll, who knows about birds, flew in.

Some of those questions are discussed before hand.

You ain't heard Pete sound flummoxed on that show yet, have you?

zoom

Yeah Bird, I remember Pete asked PK to be part of his staff when he was first hired on with the 'Hawks.

While I totally agree that the questions are probably discussed beforehand, they are, nevertheless, questions that I like to hear answers to. Kirwan does a great job with all his guests of asking questions that he already knows the answer to, but he asks anyways so the fans get insight that wouldn't normally.

And for what it's worth, rehearsed questions or not, I doubt you would ever see PC flummoxed in any interview

[RiverDog]

Auto correct RD nothing more.In fact let me put the correct spelling into my phone right now ..... Easley..... done.

You're excused, HC, and re-admitted to the diehard '12's' club. Just giving you a hard time.

[Seahawks4Ever]

HCR; Your points are valid. I am sorry for such a long post, if I had been speaking in public one would have said that I love to hear myself talk. I prefer "baffling them with bullshit myself.

I know that Petersen has returned punts as have other DB's. One of my problems is how I tend to look at the position. I look at the position as a determining factor when a team has to cut down to 53. One of those factors is if and how much players on the bubble contribute on Special Teams and if they can run back kicks and field punts. Every team want s the next Devon Hester a fantastic player who could do both, probably the best ever and it's quite possible his returns could propel him into the HoF.

We will have to agree to disagree. I love the fact that ET is so competitive that he wants to help the team win, I am ashamed that yesterday I said he was trying to put himself over the team when the exact opposite was true. I was loosing the debate and was obviously grasping for straws and latched on to a red herring.

It is the motives of some of our opponents both players and coaches that I do not trust. I know there are teams out there that would love to cripple the leader of the LOB so their offense could gain more yards, score more points and win more games against our Seahawks. A good (and bad for us) would be to a cheap shot at earl when he is defenseless while fielding a punt.

[Zorn76]

Like I said elsewhere, Harvin will only get a few opportunities to return kickoffs, since our D won't be giving up too many points (again) this season.

Punts would provide him more chances to make a difference. I understand why they won't do this, but I think it'd be a great way to maximize his value.

[HumanCockroach]

They did allow him to return punts when was a rookie in Minnesota, I believe he also had the same problems ET displayed and so it was a fairly short experiment. I was hoping Richardson would get a shot during the pre season to see if he could do it, but from all reports, that didn't go well in practice ( dropped balls etc) so I'm OK with Walters, for now.