HawkShack.com

Washington vs. Washinton State, also known as the Apple Cup.

Perhaps the first time in college football history that two major football programs fired their head coaches in mid season.

The interim head coach at WSU, Jake Dickert, seems to be doing an excellent job of keeping the team focused and their QB, de Laura, seems to be really getting his game together. And keep in mind that when Rolovich was booted, so were 5 assistant coaches. WSU dominated UW tonight at Husky stadium. UW is a program in complete disarray. Day's smacking his player on the sidelines was just the straw that broke the camel's back, an excuse to can him sooner than later.

trents wrote:The interim head coach at WSU, Jake Dickert, seems to be doing an excellent job of keeping the team focused and their QB, de Laura, seems to be really getting his game together. And keep in mind that when Rolovich was booted, so were 5 assistant coaches. WSU dominated UW tonight at Husky stadium. UW is a program in complete disarray. Day's smacking his player on the sidelines was just the straw that broke the camel's back, an excuse to can him sooner than later.

I love to see the team succeed as the anti American anti vax Rolovitch and his 5 stooges walked away to say they have been proven irrelevant is an understatement. This coach seems very buttoned down and calm , not an attention seeking narcissist like the last few . De Lara is really nice . Kind of reminds me of a young Russ . He’s really matured under this coaching staff. They are playing as good as anyone right now .

Anti vax, yes. But anti Amercan?

trents wrote:Anti vax, yes. But anti Amercan?

Yeah you can’t be pro life and pro choice at the same time . Now here comes another variant . Leaders lead in crisis , not confuse and divide . It’s unpatriotic to endanger others in a nation that’s lost 800 k people . Kind of like trying to overturn an election and it’s most of the same people .

trents wrote:The interim head coach at WSU, Jake Dickert, seems to be doing an excellent job of keeping the team focused and their QB, de Laura, seems to be really getting his game together. And keep in mind that when Rolovich was booted, so were 5 assistant coaches. WSU dominated UW tonight at Husky stadium. UW is a program in complete disarray. Day's smacking his player on the sidelines was just the straw that broke the camel's back, an excuse to can him sooner than later.

I agree. For once, WSU had the better team.

If Oregon loses to OSU today, WSU is the Pac 12 North champs, not bad considering virtually their entire coaching staff was fired, especially when you consider WSU's football history. It's quite a remarkable accomplishment. Dickert should be in line for Coach of the Year.

I'm watching Oregon-Oregon State, and I'm beginning to wonder: At halftime, are both of the teams going to go out on the highway and pick up litter? I can't think of any other pratical reason for those uniforms.

Hawktawk wrote:Yeah you can’t be pro life and pro choice at the same time . Now here comes another variant . Leaders lead in crisis , not confuse and divide . It’s unpatriotic to endanger others in a nation that’s lost 800 k people . Kind of like trying to overturn an election and it’s most of the same people .

The founding fathers placed a premium on individual freedom in the documents they gave us to build a nation on. They also placed a premium on minimal interference by the federal government in the life of the nation and in the lives of its citizens. No responsible historian or constitutional scholar will deny this. The founding documents they gave us were designed to help the new nation avoid the infringement on personal freedom that had been their experience in Europe. Those who are patriots still hold these principles in high honor. So, those who want to force government mandated vaccinations on people are the unpatriotic ones. And those who view it as a personal choice are the patriots.

Hawktawk wrote:Yeah you can’t be pro life and pro choice at the same time . Now here comes another variant . Leaders lead in crisis , not confuse and divide . It’s unpatriotic to endanger others in a nation that’s lost 800 k people . Kind of like trying to overturn an election and it’s most of the same people .

trents wrote:The founding fathers placed a premium on individual freedom in the documents they gave us to build a nation on. They also placed a premium on minimal interference by the federal government in the life of the nation and in the lives of its citizens. No responsible historian or constitutional scholar will deny this. The founding documents they gave us were designed to help the new nation avoid the infringement on personal freedom that had been their experience in Europe. Those who are patriots still hold these principles in high honor. So, those who want to force government mandated vaccinations on people are the unpatriotic ones. And those who view it as a personal choice are the patriots.

Guys,,,I'm not a mod and we're pretty loose in here with off topic subjects as we don't have a lot of traffic in here, which is one of the reasons why I like this place, but we have a very hearty little group over in the other forum in which we've debated this very subject. I highly suggest that we take this discussion over there and try to keep this one, if not about Seahawk football, at least football or sports in general.

RiverDog wrote:
Guys,,,I'm not a mod and we're pretty loose in here with off topic subjects as we don't have a lot of traffic in here, which is one of the reasons why I like this place, but we have a very hearty little group over in the other forum in which we've debated this very subject. I highly suggest that we take this discussion over there and try to keep this one, if not about Seahawk football, at least football or sports in general.

Hear hear!

trents wrote:The founding fathers placed a premium on individual freedom in the documents they gave us to build a nation on. They also placed a premium on minimal interference by the federal government in the life of the nation and in the lives of its citizens. No responsible historian or constitutional scholar will deny this. The founding documents they gave us were designed to help the new nation avoid the infringement on personal freedom that had been their experience in Europe. Those who are patriots still hold these principles in high honor. So, those who want to force government mandated vaccinations on people are the unpatriotic ones. And those who view it as a personal choice are the patriots.

And yet The Founders used forced quarantines and believed in science when it came to viruses and how to handle them because they understood that safety was also a responsibility of government. And that during times of emergency like war or a viral outbreak, it was one of the responsibilities of government to gain control of those situations.

It's funny how many people think of The Founders as men that would have let Americans do whatever they want during a viral outbreak. They wouldn't have. One of the few times government needs to step in is when you have these types of emergency.

Though I don't agree with Hawktawk that anti-vax people are anti-American. Just scared, politically manipulated, and not well educated in the science of virology and vaccines. It's natural to be scared and not want to put a strange substance in your body that you don't know much about. Then to battle that fear pretend you're doing it because of 'freedom" as that makes you feel brave when what is actually driving you is just fear at the entire situation.

Aseahawkfan wrote: Though I don't agree with Hawktawk that anti-vax people are anti-American. Just scared, politically manipulated, and not well educated in the science of virology and vaccines. It's natural to be scared and not want to put a strange substance in your body that you don't know much about. Then to battle that fear pretend you're doing it because of 'freedom" as that makes you feel brave when what is actually driving you is just fear at the entire situation.

How condescending that is! There are fully qualified scientists/medical experts and good science on both sides of this debate. But if you only patronize certain news services you would not know that. I have gotten both Moderna vaccinations and got my booster a week ago. For me at my age I have decided the pros outweigh the risks. But it was my decision. If I were much younger, I may have made a different decision. Most of the people I know who decide not to get the vaccine are not poorly educated, they are not unintelligent and they are not making decisions about vaccinations due to fear or political manipulation. They are making independent decisions based on good information and that makes sense to them in their life situation because they are not Fauci/Biden lemmings. You have created a straw man, my friend.

But River's admonition is well taken. Let's stick to sports.

Geez shoulda left out the un-American part . Medical plagues are no time for individual freedom and this country has many vaccine mandates already . It’s called medical martial law imo right now as this is clearly a grave danger to life on the planet . I’m done on this side and my apologies for stirring it up on this forum . I do greatly relish the thought of that idiot Rolodex seeing that happen I’m with River . The new coach is a keeper . It would be ironic if he winds up a ten year guy getting the job because a fool and his 5 stooges committed career suicide .

Hawktawk wrote:I’m with River . The new coach is a keeper . It would be ironic if he winds up a ten year guy getting the job because a fool and his 5 stooges committed career suicide .

I don't necessarily think that he's a keeper. It's extremely hard to judge this new guy based on just one half of a season. Heck, this wasn't even Rolovich's recruiting class, it's Mike Leach's. But the job he did under some very challenging circumstances was superb.

Oregon won today, ending the Coug's hope of a conference championship.

College football needs to expand their playoffs to include 8 teams, giving the Power 5 automatic bids and allowing for 3 at large berths. It's easily do-able as they can use the 4 New Year's Day bowls (Rose, Sugar, Orange, and Fiesta) as quarterfinal games. It would re-invigorate the NYD bowls, which since they went to a 4 team playoff, have lost quite a bit of their luster as they're thought of as second rate.

It’s a short sample but the team has been dominating lately , playing at a level not seen even by some winning teams . The term coug it wasn’t close to being heard . Dickert is reportedly being named the coach .

trents wrote:How condescending that is! There are fully qualified scientists/medical experts and good science on both sides of this debate. But if you only patronize certain news services you would not know that. I have gotten both Moderna vaccinations and got my booster a week ago. For me at my age I have decided the pros outweigh the risks. But it was my decision. If I were much younger, I may have made a different decision. Most of the people I know who decide not to get the vaccine are not poorly educated, they are not unintelligent and they are not making decisions about vaccinations due to fear or political manipulation. They are making independent decisions based on good information and that makes sense to them in their life situation because they are not Fauci/Biden lemmings. You have created a straw man, my friend.

But River's admonition is well taken. Let's stick to sports.

There are not good people on both sides of the debate. What was done by the government is Virology 101. It is very basic science practiced for centuries. Even movie writers know about these types of outbreaks and how to handle them as evidenced by movies more than 30 years old covering this very type of situation that they researched with virologists or books written by virologists.

It's hard not to be condescending to people who make proclamations about freedom without providing any evidence The Founders shared their viewpoint. There is in fact evidence of George Washington as well as other local government enforcing quarantines worse than anything modern Americans saw during outbreaks. There is also well-documented evidence of the government mandating vaccines with the Supreme Court supporting their ability to do so as part of the emergency powers of the government with no violation of Constitutional rights involved. The government in fact has a Constitutional obligation to act during periods of emergency which would include quarantines aka lockdowns and the use of tools like vaccine mandates to gain control of a deadly virus.

I highly disagree that the people making these decisions are doing so aren't politically manipulated and that they were following good science when the use of a vaccine to eradicate a deadly virus is a over a hundred years old and well-documented in cases like polio or smallpox.

I'll step back if you don't want to go on with the debate or you can take over to the off-topic forum and let's see your evidence that you have Constitutional protections against the emergency powers of government granted in the Constitution and backed up by the Supreme Court who interpret the Constitution. We've had multiple people try to prove this and why don't you take your shot.

Hawktawk wrote:It’s a short sample but the team has been dominating lately , playing at a level not seen even by some winning teams . The term coug it wasn’t close to being heard . Dickert is reportedly being named the coach .

Colleges are a different monster than the pros. So much is dependent on recruiting, especially for an unknown name coach in a po dunk little place in the middle of a wheat field, zero tradition, hardly any current NFL players that are alums.

So we'll see. Let's revisit this guy in a couple of years.

RiverDog wrote:Colleges are a different monster than the pros. So much is dependent on recruiting, especially for an unknown name coach in a po dunk little place in the middle of a wheat field, zero tradition, hardly any current NFL players that are alums.

So we'll see. Let's revisit this guy in a couple of years.

WSU has zero tradition? I think they have a legacy of producing some pretty good quarterbacks: Jack Thompson, Drew Bledsoe, and the infamous Ryan Leaf who was a bust in the pros but a phenom in college. And there was a corner named Marcus Trufant.

RiverDog wrote:Colleges are a different monster than the pros. So much is dependent on recruiting, especially for an unknown name coach in a po dunk little place in the middle of a wheat field, zero tradition, hardly any current NFL players that are alums.

So we'll see. Let's revisit this guy in a couple of years.

trents wrote:WSU has zero tradition? I think they have a legacy of producing some pretty good quarterbacks: Jack Thompson, Drew Bledsoe, and the infamous Ryan Leaf who was a bust in the pros but a phenom in college. And there was a corner named Marcus Trufant.

Pales in comparison to some of the big boys in the southeast and midwest. Even more locally, WSU doesn't have near the players in the NFL as UW and Oregon do. When was the last time the Cougs were in a New Year's Day bowl? These high school kids turn on their TV's and see players like Budda Baker and Justin Hebert with Washington and Oregon behind their names. A quick check reveals that the Cougs have just one starter in the NFL while Washington has 15 and Oregon has 9:

https://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-d ... tate/92476

https://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-d ... gton/92453

https://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-d ... egon/91625

That's one of the reasons why I want to see a playoff system that gives automatic berths to the power 5 champs. It takes away much of the importance of the beauty contests and allows for a team like WSU, or in this year's case, Utah, a chance to compete on the national stage.

RiverDog wrote:
Pales in comparison to some of the big boys in the southeast and midwest. Even more locally, WSU doesn't have near the players in the NFL as UW and Oregon do. When was the last time the Cougs were in a New Year's Day bowl? These high school kids turn on their TV's and see players like Budda Baker and Justin Hebert with Washington and Oregon behind their names. A quick check reveals that the Cougs have just one starter in the NFL while Washington has 15 and Oregon has 9:

https://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-d ... tate/92476

https://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-d ... gton/92453

https://www.ourlads.com/ncaa-football-d ... egon/91625

That's one of the reasons why I want to see a playoff system that gives automatic berths to the power 5 champs. It takes away much of the importance of the beauty contests and allows for a team like WSU, or in this year's case, Utah, a chance to compete on the national stage.

As far as Washington out recruiting the Cougs good luck this year. Your coach got fired for slapping a player for the second time. you have a losing record. There wont be too many guys off that team going to the show the next few years. Chris peterson has left the building.
Cougs have 2 sure fire pros I see. Borghi who looks like a poor mans Christian McCaffrey perhaps more durable. I believe Delaura will also be drafted and based on his bowl appearance and if his trajectory climbs as a result. Id take him in a seahwksd uni if Russ is outta here. Not sure who else.
The last few games that team and players climbed to a level i haven't seen in Pullman in a while. I credit the coach.

Hawktawk wrote:As far as Washington out recruiting the Cougs good luck this year. Your coach got fired for slapping a player for the second time. you have a losing record. There wont be too many guys off that team going to the show the next few years. Chris peterson has left the building.
Cougs have 2 sure fire pros I see. Borghi who looks like a poor mans Christian McCaffrey perhaps more durable. I believe Delaura will also be drafted and based on his bowl appearance and if his trajectory climbs as a result. Id take him in a seahwksd uni if Russ is outta here. Not sure who else.
The last few games that team and players climbed to a level i haven't seen in Pullman in a while. I credit the coach.

The Cougs aren't recruiting against just UW. Oregon has been the location of choice for premier athletes on the west coast for some time. But both schools have an advantage in that both USC and Stanford are on the downslide. They should be able to recruit well in California.

I agree with you 100% with Dickert. He's earned this opportunity. It will be interesting to see what kind of a bowl matchup they get.

Shortly before being canned Jimmy Lake said “ we don’t compete against Oregon “
I heard the quote . Of course everyone competes with Oregon and most lose . But thinking back they were a joke till Phil Knight came along with all the Nike money and basically rebuilt their facilities and reshaped their image , marketing etc .

Hawktawk wrote:Shortly before being canned Jimmy Lake said “ we don’t compete against Oregon “
I heard the quote . Of course everyone competes with Oregon and most lose . But thinking back they were a joke till Phil Knight came along with all the Nike money and basically rebuilt their facilities and reshaped their image , marketing etc .

Yup, that's true. I can remember going to a UO/USC game in Eugene back in the mid 70's. We had free tickets as one of my friends was an assistant coach at Clackamas CC near Portland. Because he had a Saturday afternoon game and the USC-Oregon game was at night, we were late to the kickoff and had to walk around the stadium to the opposite end zone. We could hear over the loudspeakers that USC had scored twice before we ever got to our seats.

Oregon always had decent men's basketball teams and outstanding track and field teams, but their football teams were horrid until Uncle Phil came along. Now they are the only decent CFB program on the west coast.

Yup, that's true. I can remember going to a UO/USC game in Eugene back in the mid 70's. We had free tickets as one of my friends was an assistant coach at Clackamas CC near Portland. Because he had a Saturday afternoon game and the USC-Oregon game was at night, we were late to the kickoff and had to walk around the stadium to the opposite end zone. We could hear over the loudspeakers that USC had scored twice before we ever got to our seats.

Oregon always had decent men's basketball teams and outstanding track and field teams, but their football teams were horrid until Uncle Phil came along. Now they are the only decent CFB program on the west coast.

NOT True, we turned the program around under Bellotti, in 1997 Ed and Elaine Moshofsky, built the Moshofsky Center, an indoor practice facility, and got the Cali kids outta the rain. This was way long before Phil came along. We went from average at best, to 8, 9, 10 wins a year. As a Duck Alum I think it should be Bellotti field not Brooks. Phil came along in 04 or 05.