Here we go with Jamal Adams

[NorthHawk]

He's not reporting to mini camp because of not getting a contract extension.
Can't wait to hear what his contract demands are (/sarcasm) but we gave up way too much in draft capital and a solid Safety in McDougald to
not give in to his demands unless they want to give up 2 firsts, a 3rd, and a starting Safety for a slight upgrade at a non premium position for
1 year.

[c_hawkbob]

The front office had to know this was coming, I can't believe we didn't have a plan in place.

[NorthHawk]

A new report said he's not in minicamp for personal reasons.
Maybe it's true but it may also be a way to cover up some contentious negotiations or to keep negotiations on a smooth track.
I'm sure they don't want to add any type of burr under the saddle during negotiations when not necessary.

[c_hawkbob]

My default position is to take everyone at their word until strong evidence otherwise, so as of now I'm not sweating it, but we'll see.

[jshawaii22]

We'll know a lot more on or about the first day of training camp.

[trents]

"The Seahawks were up front with Adams at the time of the trade that they were not going to give him an extension in 2020, sources told ESPN. Both sides agreed that he would play out 2020 on his rookie contract. One reason Seattle wanted to wait until this offseason to negotiate an extension was the uncertainty over how much the NFL's salary cap would drop in upcoming seasons due to the coronavirus pandemic. The team also wanted to get to know Adams before making a significant, long-term financial commitment." https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/316 ... ources-say

Hopefully, Adams will man up and honor his end of the deal he signed on for. When that is up, no one could could complain if he wants to walk and sign with another team or, alternatively, negotiate a new deal with the Hawks. But now he needs to grow up and do what he can to be ready for the start of the season.

[jshawaii22]

... as for next year, we can just tag him if we can't agree to a new contract. And Safety doesn't carry the large "CB" tag either, so he shouldn't cost a lot. (unless his contract doesn't allow it, of course)

and Duane Brown wants a new deal, right now,. .
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2021/06/15/report-duane-brown-attending-minicamp-but-wants-new-deal/

[NorthHawk]

The team also wanted to get to know Adams before making a significant, long-term financial commitment.

So they gave up 2 firsts, a third, and a starting player for someone they have seen play but don’t
know what they are getting? That implies they didn’t do their homework before pulling the trigger
on what may be the most lopsided trade in Seahawks history.

On a better note it sounds like Duane Brown wants to play a few more years. That should give our draft pick som time to
adjust to the NFL and the team will get to see if he has a future at this level.

[Aseahawkfan]

Addams was available for trade because he wanted a huge contract. We knew that when we traded for him a crazy amount of draft capital for a safety. If we don't pay him now, what a busted trade and I would literally think of firing Pete and John over this. Yet if we sign him for too much and limit our ability to retain talent for a safety, that is bad too. I would think of firing Pete and John over this.

We'll see how this turns out. I'll hope for the best. But to me this is more proof Pete and John have lost their way when it comes to team building. They used to find cheap, effective talent and build through the draft. Now these flash trades that don't work out the way they want are the standard. It's getting tiresome.

[Oly]

I totally get the frustration on the board, but I also remember all of Big Walt's holdouts and how they never tarnished his play, my thoughts about him, or his legacy as a Hawk. So I'm not worrying about it with Adams. Now if they don't sort it out by the start of the season, I'll be pretty pissed, just like I was with Kam.

[mykc14]

I could see there being a big gap between the two in terms of coming together on this contract. The Hawks could easily be putting together an offer of around 16 mil/year and tell him they are offering to make him the highest paid safety in NFL History while Adams points to contracts that are closer to 20 mil a year and say I am more than a safety- you can't pay me like one. Nobody needs to budge on this one right now so I could see this lingering into Training Camp. I don't think this is a straight forward negation. As far as family issues he may be having, I hope everything gets resolved and everybody is OK.

[NorthHawk]

Duane Brown also wants a new contract, so how do you satisfy both with limited Cap space?
He is now getting $10M base with a Cap hit of $13.35M so a new contract would probably be in the $12 - 13M/year range although
his age might limit the upside for him.

Wilson offered to restructure his contract, but it was turned down by the FO, so future Cap hits seem to be a big deal. They might
be able to add in the extra voidable years like other teams have done to lower the Cap, but I think Adams will be a tough negotiations.

The wild card in all these contract negotiations is the expected expanded Cap from gambling and streaming revenues. That might be
the one thing that can save a lot of teams from Cap hell. Spotrac has estimated our current Cap room at about $4M for the top 51 but
in future years that could expand by quite a lot.

[mykc14]

Duane Brown also wants a new contract, so how do you satisfy both with limited Cap space?
He is now getting $10M base with a Cap hit of $13.35M so a new contract would probably be in the $12 - 13M/year range although
his age might limit the upside for him.

Wilson offered to restructure his contract, but it was turned down by the FO, so future Cap hits seem to be a big deal. They might
be able to add in the extra voidable years like other teams have done to lower the Cap, but I think Adams will be a tough negotiations.

The wild card in all these contract negotiations is the expected expanded Cap from gambling and streaming revenues. That might be
the one thing that can save a lot of teams from Cap hell. Spotrac has estimated our current Cap room at about $4M for the top 51 but
in future years that could expand by quite a lot.

Yeah If I were the Hawks I wouldn't touch RW's contract right now. By restructuring you are giving him a much higher cap number in future years, which will really take away your leverage if things get difficult as you are trying to resign him because it will greatly increase his F-Tag price- which his camp will use as their base number in negotiations. DO NOT TOUCH RW's CONTRACT!!!

[c_hawkbob]

Yeah If I were the Hawks I wouldn't touch RW's contract right now. By restructuring you are giving him a much higher cap number in future years, which will really take away your leverage if things get difficult as you are trying to resign him because it will greatly increase his F-Tag price- which his camp will use as their base number in negotiations. DO NOT TOUCH RW's CONTRACT!!!

Totally disagree. Take Russ up on his offer and get what you need done. We'd be idiots not to keep him here every year we can anyway.

[mykc14]

Totally disagree. Take Russ up on his offer and get what you need done. We'd be idiots not to keep him here every year we can anyway.

That is my point... I want to keep him here as long as we can and if we want to resign him pushing money back now will make negotiations that much more difficult when it comes time to resign him. I think our FA knows this and won't really do anything to mess with his contract. It comes down to the fact that as of right now when it comes time to resign RW and the Hawks have the Franchise Tag as their leverage RW's agent knows that he will make at least 105 million if the Hawks F-tagged him for two years- which means that is the least amount they will be looking for in the first two years of his contract- obviously that is a lot of money... If the Hawks push money back- turning his 11 mil dollar base salary into a signing bonus then the base amount he would earn (if F-tagged for two years) would jump to 121 million. It would also take his cap hit of 37 and 40 mil over the next two years and push those to something like 43 and 46 million. In short it would put the Hawks way behind at the negotiation table if him and his agent know they would be getting at least 121 million in the first two years of his contract if the Hawks F-Tag him. It just takes away too much leverage from the Hawks, IMO.

[TriCitySam]

My default position is to take everyone at their word until strong evidence otherwise, so as of now I'm not sweating it, but we'll see.

My thoughts as well. Plenty of good things being said by Carroll, Diggs and others indicate this will get handled.....they knew this was coming, and we've seen JS wait on these things time and again. Presumably its more than his negotiation style, it seems he wants to see what other pieces that come available so he can fit them in at the same time

[Aseahawkfan]

20 million a year for a safety would be nutso.

These are the highest paid safeties right now.
1. Broncos safety Justin Simmons: $15.25 million: This is a cover safety more like Earl Thomas.
2. Cardinals safety Budda Baker: $14.75 million
3. Bears safety Eddie Jackson: $14.6 million
4. Titans safety Kevin Byard: $14.1 million
5. Chiefs safety Tyrann Mathieu: $14 million
5. Redskins safety Landon Collins: $14 million
7. Patriots safety Devin McCourty: $11.5 million
8. Vikings safety Anthony Harris: $11.4 million
9. Browns safety John Johnson: $11.25 million
10. Jets safety Marcus Maye: $10.61 million
10. Saints safety Marcus Williams: $10.61 million

Can you invest that much into a safety? I find it hard to justify, though safety is a high value position in Pete's defense.

[NorthHawk]

Adams thinks of himself as more than just a Safety thereby making him worth more than
a top Safety. I would think he’s demanding near top CB or DE money which would put
him around the $18-20M range. Maybe they can work things out, but it looks unlikely
that we will get him for a good deal for the team.

[obiken]

Can you invest that much into a safety? I find it hard to justify, though safety is a high value position in Pete's defense.

ME TOO, but what choice do we have? Its that ASHF, or lose 2 first rounders.

[c_hawkbob]

He IS more than just a Safety. I think of him more like an Edge rushing LB that instead of short coverage on the TE or RB on plays when he's not rushing goes into deep coverage instead. Edge rushers make well over $20M, I think he's got a solid argument.

I hope for our sake he signs for less than 20, but I don't think 20 is out of line.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

Saw an article relating this to the Jimmy Graham situation. Graham was being negotiated with as strictly a tight end, but he and his agent were arguing he lined up in the slot and outside so often that he should be given consideration as a wide receiver. Big difference in money.

As for Adams, yeah, he came in and got 9.5 sacks. That's all well and good, but he also had some lapses in pass defense. I know he was injured for some of that, especially in the playoff game against the Rams, but, as a safety, he's expected to stop those plays.

I am sure he feels the way Graham did, but I just wonder if you should pay for the 9.5 sack performance if you're not going to put him in the position to do that again this coming season. I feel like Pete would rather get back to having the front seven get most of the pressure. Him sacking the quarterback isn't worth as much to me as him stopping the big pass plays that come his way.

[Aseahawkfan]

Relying on your safety for pass rushing in a pass first league is a bad idea. I don't want a defense that relies on a 220 lb. safety get the most sacks or line up to sack the QB too often when we need that safety to cover and ensure passes don't go deep or cheap.

So Jamal Addams may be good at sacking the QB, but you have a badly designed defense and a weak defensive line if you're relying on your safety for pass rush production.

You can't drop a D-lineman into a safety cover position. You are unlikely to find a good cover D-lineman as good as a good cover safety.

So if we brought Jamal Addams over for pass rush production and to pay 20 million, I don't think that's going to work very well. Safeties are not relied on for pass rush production for very good reasons due to the design of defense. A safety rushing the passer weakens your pass defense. We cannot afford that in this league.

I think it's a very bad idea to pay a safety to rush the the passer. They should be hyper-focused on pass defense and that middle of the field as well as backing up the run defense if a strong safety. Pushing them up to the line to rush the passer is just asking for problems in other areas of your defense as well as encouraging good passing offenses to use plays to draw your safety up knowing it will provide holes in your pass defense.

Though it's cool that Jamal is good as rushing the passer, I don't agree it's a good idea to use them as such in our defense. It also creates the chance that some team goes, "Hey, this 220 lb. strong safety is their pass rusher. I want you 300 lb. jumbo guys to make him pay for rushing the passer." Jamal isn't going to do too well if some jumbos decide hurt him.

I'm not real down with that plan, especially for 20 mil a year when we could spend that on some 280 to 300 lb. D-lineman that can also play the run. We might as well have kept Clowney or Reed if we're planning to use someone like Jamal Addams as a pass rusher. They at least had the size to truly line up on the line and compete with the big boys in the scrum.

Anyone who has watched Seattle for these years with Pete as coach knows his defense works best with a strong deep cover safety covering the middle to create the three deep zone and back up the CBs. If Jamal can't do that, not worth the 20 million.

[c_hawkbob]

Anyone who has watched Seattle for these years with Pete as coach knows his defense works best with a strong deep cover safety covering the middle to create the three deep zone and back up the CBs. If Jamal can't do that, not worth the 20 million.

I think Pete's more flexible than that. That's what we've seen in the past because that was the personnel we had in the past. Last couple years it's morphing into a LB focused defense with different talent surrounding them. I think can make his defense work with the talent we have now and I don't think it has to look just like the Legion of Boom.

[Aseahawkfan]

I think Pete's more flexible than that. That's what we've seen in the past because that was the personnel we had in the past. Last couple years it's morphing into a LB focused defense with different talent surrounding them. I think can make his defense work with the talent we have now and I don't think it has to look just like the Legion of Boom.

A safety who can cover looks real essential to making Pete's defense work to me. I read the design of his defense a long time ago when he first got here. He had a big breakdown on how to build a defense with Pete's particular 4-3 Cover 2 Zone. That free safety who can cover seemed real essential for it to work. The CBs funneling to the middle with the safety making sure nothing deep and nothing cheap keeping everything in front. The Legion of Boom was good not just because of individual talent, but because of how ideal they were in the structure of Pete's defense.

Pass rushing safety was not on Pete's list. But I guess we'll see how that goes. I still think 20 million a year is better spent on a real high quality D-lineman than a safety myself.

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

I chalk up Adams usage last year to lack of pass rushers. With no Dunlap and only two bonafide LBs with only a promising rookie and two dedicated backups/STers, had to get some pressure some where.

I am sure Pete is adaptable, but the hope is that the Dline acquisitions and Darryl Taylor can upgrade what hopes to be improving return players to the point Adams can play the true strong safety role and the front seven gets back to creating pressure.

I am in the camp that Adams pass rushing stats were a product of the lack of pass rush else where. 9.5 sacks should be an anomaly for him, so that’s a “no” on the $20 million for me.

[NorthHawk]

So what can the FO do with Adams having so much leverage?
We might have to overpay unless we are willing to give up 2 firsts and a third plus McDougald
for one year. Given what is assumed his demands are, who would trade for him?

[MackStrongIsMyHero]

Depends on how strong the Seahawks FO feels about whatever salary and contract they intend to offer. They may stand firm on the number and let him hold out a la Kam Chancellor. Could work if we’re winning but backfire if we’re not.

The trade value is real, but I don’t see it as we have to overpay this guy in order to match with the capital required to get him. Whether or not the FO agrees is what will matter though. If they think that is the case, they’ll cave to save face.

[Aseahawkfan]

We were 31st in passing yards per game allowed last year. If Jamal Addams as a safety isn't improving that, 20 million a year isn't worth it. We need cover safeties and CBs more than a pass rush safety.

[RiverDog]

If Pete and John didn't have a pretty damn good gentleman's agreement with Adams about the parameters of a new contract before they made the trade, then they ought to both be fired for giving up as much draft capital as they did without such an understanding. That was one of if not the most expensive trade we've made in club history. I don't mind over paying him, but we can't lose him like we lost Clowney, burning valuable draft picks for just one season's worth of performance.

For me, this contract impasse is a watershed event for my continued support of this regime. I've already had one foot off the bandwagon over their 6 year failure to improve this team and this kind of unforced error that's going to hurt us for years to come may very well represent the straw that breaks the camel's back.

[RiverDog]

The company line is that everything is peachy keen:

https://www.nfl.com/news/seahawks-pete- ... ct-him-for

[NorthHawk]

An article that says a deal might be close at hand for Adams:

https://www.profootballrumors.com/2021/ ... -preseason

[NorthHawk]

And now Quandre Diggs wants a new deal as he's on the last year of his current one.

https://www.profootballrumors.com/seatt ... ews-rumors

[RiverDog]

And now Quandre Diggs wants a new deal as he's on the last year of his current one.

https://www.profootballrumors.com/seatt ... ews-rumors

he wants a new pact to reflect his performance

Jeezus, where is it going to stop? Granted, Diggs had a decent season and was named to the Pro Bow, but nevertheless, he was part of a pass defense that was ranked 31st. Is he truly satisfied with that performance to the point where he thinks the team should bow down to him and throw open the bank vault?

[curmudgeon]

Somebody whispered today “Pay them more”……

[Aseahawkfan]

I remember when Pete first got here all these players that just wanted to win a Super Bowl. Now they want to get paid "their value" because it's a business. Huge change. I still believe that change occurred because we lost that second Super Bowl. It killed our shot at being a dynasty and our ability to attract players for a lower price.

[mykc14]

Jeezus, where is it going to stop? Granted, Diggs had a decent season and was named to the Pro Bow, but nevertheless, he was part of a pass defense that was ranked 31st. Is he truly satisfied with that performance to the point where he thinks the team should bow down to him and throw open the bank vault?

I’m not surprised he’s looking for a new deal, he’s one I thought we would be negotiating with as you typically do with players entering the last year of their deal. Why is this a surprise? Also why wouldn’t he try to get paid like a pro bowler? He is one. I guess I don’t see why this is a big deal at all.

[NorthHawk]

It's one of the problems with trading draft picks for established players. Young players on their first contracts just want to win and worry about
their next contract when the time comes, but veterans look at setting themselves up for eventual retirement.
The veterans who want new contracts include Duane Brown, Adams, and Diggs. Brown and Diggs if re-signed will probably add $6-8M to the existing Cap
unless the FO gets real creative and Adams wants an extra $7-8M himself. This hasn't been a period of stellar Cap management with the trades we've made.

[RiverDog]

I’m not surprised he’s looking for a new deal, he’s one I thought we would be negotiating with as you typically do with players entering the last year of their deal. Why is this a surprise? Also why wouldn’t he try to get paid like a pro bowler? He is one. I guess I don’t see why this is a big deal at all.

If our defense played better last season, then I could see it. But here's the statement he's making: "Yeah, we were the 31st ranked pass defense in the league and bottom third overall, and yeah, we got beat in the playoffs by a one armed quarterback, but so what! It wasn't my fault. I made the Pro Bowl. Now show me the money!"

He's not taking any responsibility for the team's performance. It's the absolute wrong message to be sending his coaches and teammates and one of the reasons why I'm not enamored with individual post season awards.

[NorthHawk]

Most of the problems on Defense last year was the lack of pass rush.
Even the LoB would have had a bad year if we lost the PR. It's just not possible for DB's to
cover for that long while the QB just sits in the pocket taking his time. As well, with Adams blitzing so much
the secondary was playing out of scheme. Things in the secondary settled down once a PR started to work so
I'm not convinced the stats show the problem with the DB play, and Diggs in particular. He made it to the Pro
Bowl after all.

[RiverDog]

Most of the problems on Defense last year was the lack of pass rush.
Even the LoB would have had a bad year if we lost the PR. It's just not possible for DB's to
cover for that long while the QB just sits in the pocket taking his time. As well, with Adams blitzing so much
the secondary was playing out of scheme. Things in the secondary settled down once a PR started to work so
I'm not convinced the stats show the problem with the DB play, and Diggs in particular. He made it to the Pro
Bowl after all.

I understand and agree. But nevertheless, I don't like the message that Diggs' contract dispute is sending to the rest of the team. It's like he's not taking any responsibility for the defense's failings. I'm so great that I made the Pro Bowl and deserve more money but the rest of you guys suck so bad that you ought to give back some of your salaries.